The Hated ULEZ - getting your shitecar exempted

[angle]

I didn't I'm afraid Rob, I'll chase him up on the new year. 

[Dave_Q]

Seems well suspect that Riverbank could not tell you anything due to "confidentiality" and all the car places are basically saying do one and buy a new car.

 

Could you try to get an MP on the case? Seems like scrapping off cars that meet the ULEZ is incredibly wasteful and damaging to the environment.

 

What do you reckon the odds someone at TFL is a scooterboi and set up Riverbank to give a route for 2 strokes without considering cars....

 

You could get round it by rebuilding/ringing your MGF onto a euro 4 TF shell/ID but it seems mad this would be the only option left.

 

 

[Rob Bell]

On 12/20/2019 at 8:35 PM, Dave_Q said:

Seems well suspect that Riverbank could not tell you anything due to "confidentiality" and all the car places are basically saying do one and buy a new car.

 

Could you try to get an MP on the case? Seems like scrapping off cars that meet the ULEZ is incredibly wasteful and damaging to the environment.

 

What do you reckon the odds someone at TFL is a scooterboi and set up Riverbank to give a route for 2 strokes without considering cars....

 

You could get round it by rebuilding/ringing your MGF onto a euro 4 TF shell/ID but it seems mad this would be the only option left.

 

 

Dave, that's exactly what I think - someone in TfL is a scooterboi and left a two-stroke sized loop-hole in the regulations to allow him to ride to work... But who knows?

A bit of a slow-down over the Christmas period, but Charlie at CCW is running a larger piece on the ULEZ and its implications for modern classics. That may produce some movement (hopefully not in a negative direction!) Oh, and through a friend, we may have a contact that can pull some strings at Millbrook that can definitely do the necessary NOx emissions tests. Early days yet, but I suspect that my best bet could be to convert my MGF to MEMS3 which is EU3 compliant (I'd conveniently forgotten I have ported the head on mine and used warmer R140 cams - which I am sure will mess up emissions even though it still passes MoT without difficulty). Of course, to get to EU3 specification could mean that I fit the 1.8 K-series turbo from a Rover 75 that I have sitting in the garage, but hey, there has to be a silver lining somewhere!

 

Happy new year everyone - hopefully I'll make some more progress on this over the next year  

[Mrs6C]

I had posted this on another thread as part of a discussion there, but at the TfL link below, the following is stated about the ULEZ charge:

"The charges only need to be paid if you drive your vehicle within the zone. Parked vehicles are not subject to any charges."

https://tfl.gov.uk/modes/driving/lez-lez-services-37309

If the charge is due only on the days the car is driven, then if it's not your 'daily driver' but more of a 'high days and holidays' car, would paying out for the few days a year you might use it in London remain as a practical fallback?

[Rob Bell]

 

On 12/31/2019 at 5:45 PM, Mrs6C said:

I had posted this on another thread as part of a discussion there, but at the TfL link below, the following is stated about the ULEZ charge:

"The charges only need to be paid if you drive your vehicle within the zone. Parked vehicles are not subject to any charges."

https://tfl.gov.uk/modes/driving/lez-lez-services-37309

If the charge is due only on the days the car is driven, then if it's not your 'daily driver' but more of a 'high days and holidays' car, would paying out for the few days a year you might use it in London remain as a practical fallback?

That's kind of fine as a solution, but it is also a massive disincentive to drive the car at all - I want the freedom to jump in the car any time, and then not worry about paying the tax - which at £12.50 a pop, would soon mount up.

 

Let's say that this is my plan of last resort. 

[Dave_Q]

Also a bit of a theoretical, but if they police the thing with cameras at the border and you live inside the zone, could you drive around inside for free?

 

I imagine they would use the current congestion cameras as part of the charging network but outside that zone you might be able to get away with quite a lot?

 

 

[dieselnutjob]

So I can leave my non compliant car just inside the ULEZ zone, drive my wife's non compliant car to just outside the zone, walk across the border swapping vehicles and pay nothing? 

[Dave_Q]

Yeah that seems like a pretty big loophole.

I reckon that they will have to police it by having cameras on so many routes that avoiding them is impractical.

[Rob Bell]

Likely to be two rings of cameras - one for the ULEZ current zone, and another for the extended ULEZ. 

If you had three cars parked in strategic positions, that'd work, but I fear parking charges might be a bit excessive (unless you have a cunning rouse to get past that one).

 

Some good news - friend of friend who used to work for MG Rover before the company's collapse can help with an entry to Millbrook. One part of the jigsaw.

If they're agreeable, I'll take my pscan diagnostic gear and a later-spec catalyst with me and see whether I can get the car to pass the NOx test without changing the ECU - but if I need to convert to a later specification, it won't be the end of the world  

[chompy_snake]

I believe that I may* have a later type mgf/tf ecu and key set kicking about from a 1.8 if need it but would need to confirm numbers etc 

[Prote]

No help at all, but my 2001 Shitroen Xsara Pigasshole is ULEZ compliant. One of the few perks of ownership of this old kipper.

[chompy_snake]

I am astonished.... 4.3 V8 and it meets emmisions regulations for ULEZ 

[reb]

Who the fuck is Lez?

[dieselnutjob]

Interesting that this 1.8 turbo ZT is ULEZ compliant

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/114023904211

[dieselnutjob]

and this V8

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/223716858968

[willswitchengage]

11 minutes ago, dieselnutjob said:

and this V8

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/223716858968

Did Rover really just drop the Ford engine straight in? It even still has the Mustang logo!

[dieselnutjob]

They used a slightly modified Ford Mustange engine ECU, and then had to create a whole new "Gateway ECU" to convert between the Rover electronics on one side and the Ford on the other.

The diagnostics is interesting because the Rover T4 diagnostic tool doesn't "talk" Ford and the modified Ford ECU doesn't "talk" T4 and they didn't want (I guess) to push a whole new diagnostic tool to every MG Rover dealer in the country and so the Gateway ECU has to translate from T4 to Ford on the fly.

At much the same time Landrover had exactly the same issue because they inherited the Rover diagnostic tool but the newer Jaguar / Landrover went Ford (my X350 is all Ford based). Ford just made all the dealers buy a Ford based diagnostic tool which is the reason why modern Landrover main dealers can do nothing with Mk1 Freelanders.

[Kiltox]

Avoid this attack on the motorist by buying a fine vehicle that will shortly be available in the for sale section  

[Dan_ZTT]

1 hour ago, willswitchengage said:

Did Rover really just drop the Ford engine straight in? It even still has the Mustang logo!

Yep, pretty much.

I have so much want for a tourer or ZT-T version but they are rare and expensive.

[bub2006]

On 1/5/2020 at 1:01 AM, chompy_snake said:

I am astonished.... 4.3 V8 and it meets emmisions regulations for ULEZ 

But yet the trike with an 850 4 pot isn't ?‍♂️

[Alan_Green]

OK, what's going on here then?  https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/RENAULT-MASTER-MWB-ULEZ-VAN/202877390153 

"HERE WE HAVE A ULEZ RENAULT MASTER MWB.  YES ULEZ (COST £4500) TO BE DONE WITH CERTIFICATE"

[Dave_Q]

Nice find, as that's a diesel it has probably be retrofitted with a particulate filter to get it up to Eu6 standard.

https://www.mthlfleetservices.com/ultra-low-emissions/

Seems a slightly bizarre choice for such an upgrade but I guess that's a bit rich coming from us...

[JayB]

A few months ago I saw a Mk1 Citroen C5 2.2 HDi for sale, listed as not subject to ULEZ. I thought this may have been a one off conversion, but after entering a few number plates of C5s into the ULEZ checker, it appears that pre-facelift C5 2.2 HDis aren't subject to it. Very odd! 

[dieselnutjob]

607 with the same engine? 

[dieselnutjob]

There is a Japanese import in this video which appears to be compliant in the ULEZ checker 

I wonder how it works with imports? 

[Rob Bell]

Absolutely no idea - particularly for vehicles that have never been homologated in the EU. You'd have thought that they would not automatically be exempted from the charge?

 

BTW still working on this "project" that I appear to have set myself, but am still working to see whether we can get a reasonable and workable solution through Millbrook - who happen to undertake emissions compliance work for TfL...  

[jonny69]

Did anything ever come out of this? I forgot I'd replied about that Insight guy getting his V5c successfully updated. I tried to do the same on mine but couldn't get it done because it's a Japanese import and Honda UK couldn't access the data to get it put on my V5c.

I started a thread on Retro Rides but never got the time to keep it updated: https://forum.retro-rides.org/thread/223588/ulez-compliance-altered-emissions-testing

I also looked into testing and was pointed towards Millbrook and MIRA by the VCA.

Anyway, for other Japanese imports, I think 2006-onward are ULEZ compliant anyway.

[Stinkwheel]

On the whole ULEZ front, is it still correct that 'historic' vehicles are all exempt?  As when i put the reg for my visa into the TFL site to check, it showed a charge would be due 😮

[LightBulbFun]

23 hours ago, jonny69 said:

Did anything ever come out of this? I forgot I'd replied about that Insight guy getting his V5c successfully updated. I tried to do the same on mine but couldn't get it done because it's a Japanese import and Honda UK couldn't access the data to get it put on my V5c.

I started a thread on Retro Rides but never got the time to keep it updated: https://forum.retro-rides.org/thread/223588/ulez-compliance-altered-emissions-testing

I also looked into testing and was pointed towards Millbrook and MIRA by the VCA.

Anyway, for other Japanese imports, I think 2006-onward are ULEZ compliant anyway.

have you tried contacting Honda Japan to see about getting the data directly from them? I talk a bit about it here, it also does not necessarily have to be a letter for the entire car, even a letter of just the particular engine/driveline that the car has may suffice 

https://autoshite.com/topic/53421-ulez-compliance-conversionstype-approval/?tab=comments#comment-2737671

23 hours ago, Stinkwheel said:

On the whole ULEZ front, is it still correct that 'historic' vehicles are all exempt?  As when i put the reg for my visa into the TFL site to check, it showed a charge would be due 😮

for vehicles registered after the 1st of Jan 1973 Historic, they dont show as exempt on the first page, you need to click on "pay a charge" and then you will see it ULEZ exempt  

[Stinkwheel]

21 minutes ago, LightBulbFun said:

 

for vehicles registered after the 1st of Jan 1973 Historic, they dont show as exempt on the first page, you need to click on "pay a charge" and then you will see it ULEZ exempt  

 

That explains it, thanks. Odd website if thats how it works though