invacar LightBulbFun's Invacar & general ramble thread, index on page 1, survivors lists on Pages 24/134 & AdgeCutler's Invacar Mk12 Restoration from Page 186 onwards, still harping on...

[richardmorris]

  On 12/03/2025 at 18:47, LightBulbFun said:

oh the top speed genuinely is 12Mph as per my 1952 edition of the Stanley Argson Electric Instruction book which I was lucky enough to win on eBay recently  (and its 6Mph in low range and 4Mph in reverse for those curious)

its provided a most interesting read in its own right  

it tickles me how the tyre pressure for the front tyre is given as  a fairly vague"to  just thumb hardness" and the batteries is just "yeah thats not for you to worry about" 

this being a handbook for a Ministry issued machine, which fascinatingly had details of the machine it was issued with scribed on the inside of the front cover

its sister car funnily enough was one I discovered as having existed, a few years back  

there are also number of fold out things, including wiring diagrams, but most have come apart and been taped back together in the long distant part, and it makes it tricky to fold them out flat to get a good photograph of them, but i was able to get a good shot of the lubrication chart

 

 

if you wanted a speedier machine thats what the Villers Petrol powered Stanley Argson was for, lets not forget that Stanley also made petrol machines

Electric machines where explicitly produced for those who genuinely did not want to go fast, wanted a quiet soft going machine, or had some major disability that required them to have a very easy to control machine, (this later point is what made the Invacar such a big deal at the time, it was the first petrol machine that could be entirely 1 hand controlled. prior to the invention of the Invacar and its unique control scheme in the 1940's if you only had 1 functioning limb, you where relegated to electric machines regardless if you wanted one or not)

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Building has long gone…

coincidentally Vanwall was a mile or so away in Staines.

[plasticvandan]

Be aware that it is likely to blow again somewhere else once the back pressure is returned.infact it may have a part to play in your low mpg figures. As that's right on the bend that's where moisture tends to sit.years of short journeys causes that.being as you are obviously keeping it for life it wouldnt be out of the realms of sense to have a stainless steel system made,being as you have spare exhaust parts could even lend them to a fabricator to copy.

[LightBulbFun]

  On 13/03/2025 at 19:13, plasticvandan said:

Be aware that it is likely to blow again somewhere else once the back pressure is returned.infact it may have a part to play in your low mpg figures. As that's right on the bend that's where moisture tends to sit.years of short journeys causes that.being as you are obviously keeping it for life it wouldnt be out of the realms of sense to have a stainless steel system made,being as you have spare exhaust parts could even lend them to a fabricator to copy.

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it only blew while on the motorway most recently (or maybe the A2? somewhere along that route where I was flat out at about 55-60 anyhow) so i dont think it has any bearing on the recent MPG figures

its actually quite interesting just how suddenly it went, there was no gradual increase of noise or anything like that, one moment everything is normal noises, and then the next moment it just suddenly started going "TICK TICK TICK TICK" and I was like "whats that thats just started making a noise?" until a bit later when i was off the motorway and able to give it a bit more direct attention and was like "oh yeah thats a an exhaust blow" 

the thought of getting these remade in stainless has actually crossed my mind, for the reasons you state, thankfully the downpipes themselves are not too complicated things, I dread to think how much it would cost to get a heat-exchanger-silencer (re)made (in stainless or mild!), although would be very cool to see be done at the same time  I wonder would it sound any different in stainless? (I have always wanted to see the insides of a Model 70 heat-exchanger-silencer just to see how it all works/flows internally etc)

 

[brummiejon]

  On 13/03/2025 at 13:26, plasticvandan said:

Ep oil shouldn't be used in anything with brass or bronze as it will attack them,so wise to get that out

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Ok, thanks, I didn't know that, job for today

 

[brummiejon]

  On 13/03/2025 at 14:39, lesapandre said:

Yes. It eats into the metal and will ruin the GB or diff. Give it a good flush.

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Althogh shell spirax is still available, there is no worm gear oil, it seems to be either auto transmission oil or manual gearbox oil. There are other worm gear oils on the market, considering I've just learned a valuable lesson from this forum I'm loath to make a mistake again. As long as I'm using any worm gear oil, is it safe to say that any would be OK?

[Andrew353w]

I'm not sure if this will help, but Daf recommend the use of A.T.F. in their transmissions, both the primary and secondary parts, and the selector box. 

[Snake Charmer]

  On 13/03/2025 at 19:06, richardmorris said:

Building has long gone…

coincidentally Vanwall was a mile or so away in Staines.

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Vanwall sodium filled valves forged in Colnbrook, centre one has been used and sectioned. 😊

[brummiejon]

  On 14/03/2025 at 12:57, Andrew353w said:

I'm not sure if this will help, but Daf recommend the use of A.T.F. in their transmissions, both the primary and secondary parts, and the selector box. 

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Ater reading some forums about worm gears, I have settled on some of this..

 

 

[Cavcraft]

  On 12/03/2025 at 19:33, lesapandre said:

And this. It's moved by pulling the 'steering wheel' backwards and forwards. They were in a junk shop in a village I passed through. Next time I see something I will buy it - they were about €100 each.

These are possibility for WWI disabled veterans. 

Somewhere I have a whole 1920's French book on the subject of adaptations - I will look it out.

What's somewhat forgotten is notwithstanding the huge numbers killed in WWI - immense numbers also were maimed or lost limbs.

A whole industry grew up around adaptation.

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That's bloody great for £100.

[catsinthewelder]

This just popped up, as usual he's talking bollocks but you could make the first comment.

[LightBulbFun]

  On 14/03/2025 at 21:23, catsinthewelder said:

This just popped up, as usual he's talking bollocks but you could make the first comment.

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I skipped thought it looking for the Invacar content and could not find anything (apart from a passing comment about them having existed back in the day), any idea whats about and why I might want to comment?  

[catsinthewelder]

It's only 5 minutes long Dez 😂

Just the usual mildly inaccurate guff about them before a rant about motability.  Thought you might want to correct him.

[Marshall2810]

  On 14/03/2025 at 22:08, LightBulbFun said:

I skipped thought it looking for the Invacar content and could not find anything (apart from a passing comment about them having existed back in the day), any idea whats about and why I might want to comment?  

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Misleading advertising, false or deceptive!  Gowon LBF play merry hell

[LightBulbFun]

  On 14/03/2025 at 22:15, catsinthewelder said:

It's only 5 minutes long Dez 😂

Just the usual mildly inaccurate guff about them before a rant about motability.  Thought you might want to correct him.

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  On 14/03/2025 at 22:15, Marshall2810 said:

Misleading advertising, false or deceptive!  Gowon LBF play merry hell

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i'd be at it all day if I was playing that game then!  there is *so much* bollocks said about them everywhere, especially anytime someone posts a stock-photo-esk picture of a Model 70 to one of those facebook groups

although amusing in that video he failed at the first hurdle, it was Graham hill, not Stirling Moss, who drove an "Invacar" (actually an AC Acedes Mk15 for those curious)

 

I have mentioned it before how even just saying "AC Invacar" is the same as saying "Ford Citroen"

 

[dozeydustman]

My dad and brother spotted this Thundersly special in Greenwich this morning

Was this you Dez?

[Floatylight]

  On 16/03/2025 at 13:01, dozeydustman said:

My dad and brother spotted this Thundersly special in Greenwich this morning

Was this you Dez?

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Looks like Dez...

[LightBulbFun]

  On 16/03/2025 at 13:01, dozeydustman said:

My dad and brother spotted this Thundersly special in Greenwich this morning

Was this you Dez?

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haha indeed that be me and REV, very fun to see someone managed to pap me while on a more substantial road  

 

as alluded to by the picture above I had another big trip today, another 50 miles of M25 and A2 and black wall tunnel/A12, so first trip was brim the tank again to be on the safe side (and because after previous long runs I am curious to see what the MPG's work out at)

and this time round 61 miles covered 8.7L went in so about 32 Mpg I think  and then I hit the road 

and another 52 miles or so I was home  

REV once more performed without fault, and I even managed 64 Mph on a somewhat down hill bit of what I *think* was the M25? or maybe of been the A21 something or other most of the M25 was 50Mph road works, it was only right at the end and then onto the A2 that NSL opportunities presented themselves (the highlight of that was when the left and middle lanes where slowing up for some reason but I could see the right most lane was nice and clear/empty ahead, so I was able to swiftly move into the right most lane and shoot past everyone at speed, keeping my valuable momentum going, well right until the 50Mph sign suddenly came up and I had to reign it in)

I spotted a Morris Minor going about a Sunday drive, with the rather "Appropriate/unfortunate  in an Autoshite sort of way" Number plate ROT 87 (should of been on a Scania Metropolitan or something!) and around about that point a blue Reliant Robin Mk2 went the other way   

I also saw a modern Jaguar Saloon with the DN10JAG, I was playing leap frog with him for a while on the M25 during all the 50Mph zones as traffic ebbed and flowed between lanes  and then for a while I was with a Purple somewhat barried JDM (going by the number plate setup) K11 Micra on a W prefix plate that I cant recall

 

all in all apart from blowing a hole in the exhaust REV has performed very well these past few many miles days, I think in total adding up previous trips etc I have done at least 125-150 miles if not maybe even more, of just motorway/fast dual carriageway driving now  

 

[lesapandre]

Are you coming to France for the International Fest? 🏁🇬🇧🇲🇫🏴‍☠️

[quicksilver]

I also saw a Morris Minor with a ROT plate this morning. The owner calls it Johnny Rotten.

[LightBulbFun]

  On 16/03/2025 at 15:34, lesapandre said:

Are you coming to France for the International Fest? 🏁🇬🇧🇲🇫🏴‍☠️

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if your referring to Shitefest international

https://autoshite.com/topic/60030-shitefest-international-2025-9-10-august-france/

I certainly would like to, but obviously thats a pretty major undertaking, so I am not going to commit myself right here and now but over the months ill be certainly looking into it/thinking with it

in the thread above  @Mrs6C put forward a good route which is what I am currently planning/playing/working with  

  On 14/01/2025 at 00:11, Mrs6C said:

You could opt for the Portsmouth>Caen (Ouistreham) ferry and take the non-motorway route from Ouistreham port to L'Homme... Google reckons it's 135 miles and about 3 1/2 hours to drive.

French 'D' roads (like our 'A' roads) are pleasant, often quite straight and reasonably quiet, as most of the traffic takes the motorways and toll roads. There are plenty of opportunities to stop in safe places if needed.

European breakdown cover would be sensible, so if the worst happened, REV could be taken home.

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although since then I have driven some miles on British motorways and found it to be a non-issue in REV, so I am now not too afraid of taking motorways if they make the route quicker/less complicated, (for example playing with it on google maps from the Caen port to Saabnut's french place, its about 3.5 hours via non autoroute, but if I go by Autoroute it shaves an hour off the time) but I will take the opportunity here to ask, if there are any gotcha's regarding said french motorways? I understand they are mostly toll roads, but im not sure how much they cost/you pay for them, and what are they like to drive on? and there is still the over-arching concern of the fact I dont speak any French at all LOL

[lesapandre]

Your shout - but I'd say go for it if you can. 

My recommendation is to stay off the autoroutes. The old Route Nationales (RN) are much nicer to drive and pretty good. Much easier to handle an FTP too.

There are quite a few here with French connections to give detailed advice as and when.

"The time is just about right for an out and out thriller like this" 👍 

Don't worry about not speaking French either - France welcomes 100 million  visitors a year so is well set up.

If you can take in the local car show - you'll be the absolute centre of interest.🇲🇫🇬🇧🏁

[plasticvandan]

Pretty sure there are translator apps.motorways are great,everyone can over take,the average speed isn't actually that high,and everyone is going the same way.

[LightBulbFun]

alright, for something a bit different, I am wondering who here is clued up on bushes, suspension bushes that is!

I have someone who is doing a nut-and-bolt restoration on a Model 70 and needs new bushes for their front suspension/leading arm assembly

we have a part number for these bushes Ministry Store No: STY183, Manufacture part number Clayflex B606/8 but we cant find much on them sadly, it looks like they have an OD of 1 3/8th inches (and there is also STY184 “Distance tube 7/8” diameter x 11G (for use Clayflex bush)” (which I understand keeps the 2 bushes a set distance apart in the arm)

 

 

but things get a bit bemusing, in that for *specific* reg range of *Invacar* Model 70's they used a different STY200 Dunlop 13/0774 bush, and apparently used 1 of these vs the 2 clayflex bushes, (which I am quite curious about, in itself, how does just 1 bush work in place of 2 bushes?)

but these dont fix a Clayflex arm, they are slightly too small an OD, which is a shame because the person doing the nut-n-bolt restoration *does* have these STY200 Dunlop bushes in stock,

However I note on that front that STY185, is the same leading arm store number regardless of if you have a Clayflex or Dunlop Model 70, so it seems like in some fashion both bush types can be made to fit the same arm, now along side the Dunlop STY200 part, there is a part listed as Store No STY199 special centre spacer, but we sadly dont have this in stock nor know what it looks like, but I do wonder if it might allow the fitting of STY200 bushes to the leading arm frame? so if we can find a way to make these dunlop bushes work, that would be great, since those are in stock

 

so what I am wondering is if someone might recognise the Clayflex part numbers and know if there are modern equivalents we can order or if someone might know of way to make the dunlop bushes fit instead? and might know what STY199 is about?

 

here in an extract from the Model 70 parts listing for those who want to see the raw data for themselves so to speak  

(as an aside note how it says that *later* Invacar Model 70's are fitted with yet a different part number of bush, but if those wear out the whole arm is to be replaced and a new STY185 arm and normal STY183/STY184 bushes/parts fitted in its place, makes me wonder what REV has!)

[Snake Charmer]

Dez, have a look HERE at the bushes around 34.93mm which should equate to 1 3/8". You really need the old ones out if possible to get the dimensions.

[plasticvandan]

Commonly used on spring hangers and leaf springs,land rover used clayflex. You are going to need to measure the original and look up bushes to suit.

[LightBulbFun]

  On 18/03/2025 at 15:20, Snake Charmer said:

Dez, have a look HERE at the bushes around 34.93mm which should equate to 1 3/8". You really need the old ones out if possible to get the dimensions.

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Thanks  turns out the person im trying to help had already contacted them and they did not have an exact match

here are the details for the Model 70 Clayflex bush

  Quote

OD - 34.93 (1 3/8”)
ID - 15.68 (15.88) (5/8”)
OL - 44.52 (44.45) (1 3/4”)
IL - 50.61 (50.80) (2”)

ID Inner Diameter
OD Outer Diameter
IL Inner Length
OL Outer Length

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[MarinaJosh]

Superflex were very helpful when I needed some odd suspension bushes. Loads of different ones listed on their website.

https://www.superflex.co.uk/

[LightBulbFun]

as an aside, I am just wondering, does oil have a shelf life? I have this bottle of 20W50

that I bought back in late 2021, to top REV back up after I drained the excess oil that she ended up with at that point in time, and its otherwise sat indoors, until the recent 2 big trips I did where before hand I checked the oil level gave her a smoll top up (and took the bottle with me just incase) 

but I notice during that smoll top up and looking at it in general that the oil has gone quite dark in colour much darker then I recall it being when I first purchased it

(I also have a "matching" bottle of EP90 that I got at the same time/from the same supplier, that I have *not* opened (IIRC anyhow!) and that similarly looks a bit dark also, well at least from what I can tell looking through the little translucent gap for checking the level in the bottle)

 

so I am just wondering if its still good or not? 

[Weird Car]

  On 20/03/2025 at 17:55, LightBulbFun said:

does oil have a shelf life?

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I mean it’s literally millions of years old already so 🤷🏻‍♀️

though google says 3-5 years so maybe it does 

[Rustybullethole]

  On 16/03/2025 at 13:01, dozeydustman said:

My dad and brother spotted this Thundersly special in Greenwich this morning

Was this you Dez?

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Charlton POlice impound in the background there. Nice shot.