Old modern dervs

[Bren]

I am quite philosophical about things - I bought a £1500 diesel that has issues. No great shock and I'm not angry. I will spend £2-300 on it but then that's it.

 

Sometimes you just have to know when it's time to bail out.

[cpjitservices]

Mk4 diesel is much better in reliability though.

Apparently so,

 

The 2.0 TDCI in mine is the same one thats in the X Type - So I've heard.

[cpjitservices]

We have done 133k kms(80k miles) on a 1.6 Hdi fitted to a C5 - a little engine in quite

a big car.No problems with DPF or turbo.The EGR valve wore out just after we got it with

around 160k kms on it.I stuck on a second hand one which has lasted ever since although it

did stick partly open once.I cleaned it out and it was fine.The thing is though that the car has always

had top spec oil ,usually Total Ineo ECS,every 10-12 k kms.Cheap mechanical insurance.

 

A lot of diesels,particularly VAG stuff seem very marginally engineered.An example would be

the tensioner arrangement on 2.0 PD VWs and Audis,We put a VEGE recon 2.0 into an Audi A4.

The tensioner is very large and hangs on a very long stud which screws into a 10mm thread in

the block.When it leaves the block it steps down to an 8mm thread.It was very carefully torqued and tensioned

with the engine out of the car.2000 miles after the engine was refitted the stud snapped across the size

stepdown ,causing no end of trouble and a lost customer.This kind of marginal engineering can work ok

when everything is perfect.Problem is it never is.Mind you VWs and Audis only exist to make GM cars look good.

the 'old' 1.9 PD is an outstanding derv engine. 

[wuvvum]

I think part of the problem Bren has had with his, is that its has never been known for being a reliable lump. Some installations were far worse than others - e.g. Saabs with it was disastrous.

If you think Saabs were bad you should try it in a fugging Vel Shatis.

[cpjitservices]

The 2.0 8V HDi was pretty robust, more so than the XUD in some ways.

Yep mine did France twice, then a week later ran around the Lake District without skipping a beat. I really do like those lumps. The usually outlast whatever they are put into. Had the Cambelt on my 2.0 HDI changed at around the 140k mark, cost me about £120 inc Water pump. I supplied the parts. It got to 208k with no issues.

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

As you may be aware I have diagnosed the turbo being at fault on our vectra.I have also discovered how reluctant the trade are to get involved with cars having issues - I enquired today with the garage I use if they replaced turbos - I was told no because of the issues they can cause.

 

Even my local vauxhall specialist will not touch the fuel system on any diesel cars - understandable when you consider a failed pump can contaminate the entire fuel system with fragments. So its not just a replacement pump you need to consider.

 

Sadly the cost of all this work often outweighs the value of the car - couple this with owners who have watched too many shows with Dominic Littlewood, who expect the moon on a stick and "know their rights" means that quite a few garages have probably had their fingers burnt and now avoid such work like the plague.

 

Tomorrow I will get an estimate for having my turbo rebuilt - I will remove and replace it myself. Obviously I will do my homework first - if I spend a couple of hundred and it still wont play ball then it's not theend of the world.

 

What does this mean for old modern derv cars? Diesel is not the miracle fuel everybody believed it was - I can see most of them being weighed in at the first major expense. I am surprised many traders still sell such cars knowing the potential for grief - many people expect an £800 diesel to perform like a £10k one and get all upset when they don't.

 

Will I have a go a fixing the vectra? Yes because I have sunk too much in - including purchase price it stands me at around £2k.

 

Would I have another diesel? Highly unlikely.

 

My two' pennorth.

 

 

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Genuine-Melett-Turbo-CHRA-Core-Astra-Vectra-Zafira-SAAB-1-9-D-M741-755046-766340-/391099425975

[Cleon-Fonte]

The big advantage of those early PSA 2.0 HDis is that despite being commonrail they're not saddled with any other complications, so they're quite a robust old lump and easy enough to fix if things do go wrong.

 

I'm not sure the same can be said of later 16v derivatives, although they do seem to be quite well regarded compared to their contemporaries. They're certainly not in the same league as their Ford-developed 1.4/1.6 counterparts, that's for sure.

 

[Bren]

I rang ac turbos in Skem. They want £300 to overhaul my unit which is'nt too bad. They did say they did'nt do many of them....

[SiC]

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Genuine-Melett-Turbo-CHRA-Core-Astra-Vectra-Zafira-SAAB-1-9-D-M741-755046-766340-/391099425975

Wrong part. Bren has the 3.0 V6 CTDi...

[sierraman]

I'd be sure to identify the cause of the turbo failure before committing to replacement.

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

..and remove the intercooler to wash it out!

[mat_the_cat]

Im fairly sure the VW 1.2 TSI is the prime example of an absolute pos of a modern (downsized) engine.

 

Someone I know works for a VW dealer, and a few years ago was telling me when they get one in for part exchange, it's taken straight down to the auctions as they simply daren't offer a warranty on it! Maybe they were bitten with some of the early ones and things have improved since then, but it's fairly telling...

[twosmoke300]

I've always used midland turbos for recon units . No issues at all

 

Also agree that the 1.9 pd tdi is a cracker

[320touring]

I've always used midland turbos for recon units . No issues at all

 

Also agree that the 1.9 pd tdi is a cracker

I preferred my pre PD vag derv, but the PD was OK in the Fabia, and never gave an issue aside from sensors.

[DodgeRover]

It all started to go wrong when manufacturers tried to make Diesel engines that thought they were petrol.

[Lacquer Peel]

Diesels I can get behind.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Anything else is SHITE.

[320touring]

Good man yersel

[gordonbennet]

Another lovely Diesel from the good era was the 2068 cc NA lump Renault fitted to the 21 (and probably the 18).

 

My Savanna sprang an oil leak from the CHG, so one week i whipped the head off and dropped the sump and removed the pistons to check for wear at the same time, it had done around 130k then but properly serviced from new, couldn't find any wear anywhere ( i don't recall putting new rings in though it's possible i did seeing as the pistons were out), it was a pleasure to work on (north/south see), whipped the injectors out and got them cleaned at Northampton Diesels, didn't use a drop of oil, was a completely reliable car that sipped fuel and could maintain an 80mph cruise all day and went round corners like it was on rails.

 

Removing those injectors was about as involved as changing a set of spark plugs, WTF did we have to go and ruin Diesels utterly with this common rail electronic crap.

[Lacquer Peel]

modern fuel injector removal

[gordonbennet]

^^, yep my Merc indy had a fuggin great slide hammer welded to the sodding things in an A Class, which he hates with a passion anyway,  i believe the injectors have to come out before you can remove the head, i don't think he ever did get them out, box of swan vestas would have been the best tool before he even raised the bonnet on the heap.

[Cleon-Fonte]

Diesels I can get behind.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Anything else is SHITE.

 

 

I'd agree with this, save for the omission of the Daihatsu CL50 turbo: three cylinders, 993cc and a Bosch pump as standard for 70+mpg veg action.

 

[SiC]

Diesels I can get behind.

 

 

... To push, because they're so freaking slow!

[Eddie Honda]

OM602 Merc 5 banger is what this thread needs.

 

For added shiteness (and slowness), I'll throw in the OM616. 

[Lacquer Peel]

... To push, because they're so freaking slow!

 

I've seen an indicated 130MPH in a Rover 825D on a private* racetrack*.

[DodgeRover]

Why no Perkins lumps in that line up?

 

Or the old Peugeot 2.3 in all it's variants not much used to go wrong with those.

[Lacquer Peel]

I only include diesels I've personally experienced.

[TRW]

The modern DERV I own.

 

 

More than modern enough for me thank you. All the comfort and reliability that I need.

Whats common rail injection? And AdBlue sounds like some Merlin like wizard stuff you refill pens with.

[cpjitservices]

Ill throw this one into the mix:

 

Good old Endura.

 

Specifically the 1.8 found in the Mondeo Verona

[twosmoke300]

The 1.8 td in the mondeo had the worst turbo lag I have ever experienced!

 

My diesel choices would be

 

Transit 2.5 di

Vauxhall / Saab 2.0 /2.2 dti

Vag 1.9 pd

Xud 1.9 n/a

Ford 1.6d ( better than the 1.8imo)

Hilux 2.5/3.0 d4d ( I look after 15 of these , most over 120k , some over 200 and I've changed one injector and never taken a head off )

 

The 2.0 hdi is pretty good but a bit prone to a hgf and a twatty job .

 

The Sierra 2.3d was painfully slow on modern roads .

 

Iveco / Renault master sofim engines are as hard as coffin nails too

[mat_the_cat]

Any views on the diesel engine in the Hyundai iLoad van? (I may have a slightly vested interest in the future...)

 

It seems to me not to be screwing a ridiculous amount of power from a small capacity (~115 bhp from 2.5 litres) and has realistic sounding 10,000 mile service intervals. Don't sem to hear many horror stories, but then again there's relatively few of them about!