Crash bang wallop advice

[Craig the Princess]

Highway code section 185

 

When reading a roundabout you should:

•Always give priority to the traffic coming from the right, unless you have been directed otherwise by signs, road markings or traffic lights

 

•Check if the road markings allow you to proceed without giving way (always look right before joining just in case)

 

•Watch out for other road users on the roundabout

 

•Check the traffic has moved off in front of you before you proceed to enter the roundabout

 

Hard to argue the other party wasn't at fault on 3 if not all 4 of those points.

[Tickman]

The only 'confusion' on his part is that he was on your right so probably thinks he has right of way.

 

Unfortunately for him and anyone else in his life he is an arse.

 

Story go something like this? Obviously add in road names and his for the insurance.

 

 

I was travelling along .... road intending to turn right into ...... road at the roundabout. As I  approached the roundabout I indicated my intention to turn right. There was a green car coming from ...... road and turning into .... road. This car was indicating left on approach and his driving position confirmed his intention to turn. Using this information and the fact that the round about was clear of other vehicles I entered the junction and proceeded towards my destination. I was completing my manoeuvre across the junction when ......... entered the junction from ........ road intending to turn right into ........road. He proceeded to turn right, not yeilding to traffic, despite the fact that I was already in the junction and physically blocking the route to his destination. It was at this point that he collided with the rear of my vehicle with the front of his vehicle. There is no possible way for the rear quarter of my vehicle to collide with his vehicle other than his vehicle steering into me. When we stopped he apologised and admitted that he was at fault which he has later contested despite being at fault. I take no responsibility for this accident as Mr ....... is at fault. 

[The Moog]

Fantastic, great write up.

 

I have got insurance guy coming on Monday to interview me. I think I will type that out and hand it to him.

[richardmorris]

Basically it seems he didn't look at what was in front of him. No amount of priority shenanigans will change this.

[Tickman]

 I think I will type that out and hand it to him.

Copy and paste is your friend!

 

As long as he doesn't get away with it.

[The Moog]

Insurance company have offered £320 - excess so £230.

 

Apparently I just need to give them my details and they will pay me.

 

How they word it is that I have no choice.... Bugger that. Will be going back and arguing over it.

 

What is the status if I am disputing the claim?

[Tickman]

Find a similar Focus with LPG for sale and then send them the information. This then gives them a 'value' of the car. 

The pay out should be the 'value' of it which can only be found by replacing it on the open market.

£230 doesn't buy much. 

Also if they are deducting the excess then the claim is going against you. 

Politely remind them that it was not your fault and that no excess is to be deducted and also no loss of no claims is to be taken from you.

 

Can you tell I have been through this before?

 

Any salvage rights and put it back on the road?

[The Moog]

Spoke to a lovely lady. I need to send in a copy of recent Lpg pump and they will revise their offer. Didn't know about salvage or where claim was up to, with check and get back to me.

 

I reckon £100 more and it is a fair deal. Already had cat C marker so will never make top dollar.

 

Asked about excess, they said it was standard to take it. She said that they take the excess and it has no relation to fault. Once fault had been established then the money will be refunded.

[Craig the Princess]

No chance I would accept that about the excess, no reason for them to fight the custom if they can blame you and keep £230.

[Tickman]

 they said it was standard to take it. She said that they take the excess and it has no relation to fault.

Bullshit.

 

If it is your fault then you pay excess, if not then they can bugger off. 

 

I don't know why people cannot admit when they have screwed up and save all the hassle. If it was as simple as 'hit here by them' maybe the insurance cost would not be as high.

[The Moog]

Fair point. Although not sure £100 would make them fight that hard

[Eddie Honda]

Asked about excess, they said it was standard to take it. She said that they take the excess and it has no relation to fault. Once fault had been established then the money will be refunded.

Actually, this isn't bullshit.

 

You're making a claim against your own policy therefore excess applies. If the insurer bothers their arse and magics the monies out of the other party, you should get the excess reimbursed. If you don't want to pay an excess up front, then don't put in a claim with your own insurers and just chase the third party's insurers direct.

[lisbon_road]

Hope you get it fixed, looks like an interesting car with the unusual lpg set up, and not too much damage.

[Tickman]

Actually, this isn't bullshit.

 

You're making a claim against your own policy therefore excess applies. If the insurer bothers their arse and magics the monies out of the other party, you should get the excess reimbursed. If you don't want to pay an excess up front, then don't put in a claim with your own insurers and just chase the third party's insurers direct.

You have to pay excess if the claim is against you (at fault) otherwise you do not. Does not matter if you go through your insurance at all. 

 

I made a claim with my insurer, had a hire car for two weeks and my car repaired, all paid for by them with no excess being paid by me.

 

The way this is being processed it appears that you are being classed as at fault.

[barefoot]

As can be seen, the green car (clearly illustrated here in purple)

collided with the red car (obviously shown here in blue)

 

 

or something...

[Dave_Q]

RE: Excess, I think it depends on the insurer.

 

My wife was hit while stationary a couple of years ago, she still paid the excess when the car was repaired but got it back, eventually, after legal shenanigans between the insurers etc.

[Eddie Honda]

Typical policy wording, Aviva motor policy example:

 

Definitions

 

Excess

The amount the principal policyholder or the vehicle policyholder must pay towards any claim

 

[snip]

 

Excesses

 

If your vehicle is lost, stolen or damaged, the excess shown in your schedule must be paid, no matter how the loss or damage happened.

 

If your vehicle is to be repaired and the repairer chosen is not one of our approved repairers, then an additional excess will apply; this excess will be shown in your schedule. This excess will apply in addition to any other excesses under the policy.

 

A young driver excess will also apply while the permitted driver of your vehicle is aged 24 or under. This excess will be shown in your schedule (Comprehensive cover only). This excess will apply in addition to any other excesses under the policy.

 

The excess applied to glass claims can be found in Section 11 of this policy booklet.

In short, you make a claim you pay the excess. You don't make a claim (e.g. insurer recovers the money from someone else), you don't pay the excess. Like a No Claims Discount, it's got sod all to do with fault and everything to do with the insurer shelling out cash.

 

As dink says, it depends on the insurer. Tickman, what was the nature of your claim and the insurer involved?

[Tickman]

As dink says, it depends on the insurer. Tickman, what was the nature of your claim and the insurer involved?

 

Some not very nice woman reversed into me and 'claimed' I crashed into the back of her.

Luckily managed to get evidence that she was a lying bitch and it got sorted.

Insured with Swiftcover at the time who were on the whole very good.

 

I think at the time they asked for the excess to be paid by me and I refused as I was not at fault, I was obviously pissed off at the time and feeling aggrieved so being a argumentative git with anyone who disagreed with me!

With all the info above I am surprised that it got dealt with as well as it did and I didn't get hung up on!

[panhard65]

This could be out of date as it was probably about 20 years ago some silly bint hit my Land Rover then bounced off and hit 2 other cars. I rang my insurance company and told them what happened. They did the usual and said get it booked in etc. As it wasn't my fault and I wanted the cash rather than repair it they told to to go after the other driver for the money. From a legal point of view your dispute is with the driver of the other vehicle not any insurance company. Get 2 quotes made out in mateys name and send them to him. He should forward them on to his insurance company who should settle the claim, or at least contact you to tell you what they are going to do. I was lucky and they coughed up. If they persist in this 50/50 bollocks then go for the throat and take matey to the small claims court for the costs of repairing the car and all your fees. If you read up about how to take him to court there are rules you have to follow to get him to pay first. Bloody insurance companies are bastards and will try every trick in the book to crush the little guy but as long as you are not at fault, which must be the case you will nail them long before it gets to court. Don't take any shit off them and don't pay out anything or let them have the car. Good luck

[Mr Lobster]

The problem is, if you want the insurer to fight it for you then unless there is absolute proof (witness, cctv) then they won't really be interested on the basis that if theres no hard evidence then a court won't be interested.  If you have his details its worth going after the third party directly as stated above.

 

As for your excess - I think that falls into the category of 'uninsured losses' so if fault is not determined by the time repairs have been completed or total loss paid out is normally recovered separately.  Been a few years since I did this in the course of work so I'm not 100%.

[dollywobbler]

I recall when my 2CV got thumped that I had to pay the excess, which then had to be claimed from the other side - which ended up in court due to useless cockend lawyer types who hadn't got a bloody clue. For some reason they admitted liability which got me my courtesy car and the go-ahead for 2CV repairs, but then disputed my excess. Not really relevant, but that was the process anyway. So, if you've not got liability pinned down at this stage, you will be paying your excess I'm afraid.

[Tickman]

I think all this proves is that no matter how insured you think you are the insurance company will never be out of pocket.

 

Obviously read the terms and conditions as they seem to be very different across different companies.

[Eddie Honda]

Ok Tickman, got it now.

Swiftcover is AXA. I opened their online policy wording and thought "this is familiar" and then I noticed that it's basically the same as an AXA one I read earlier.
 

Excess/Excesses
The amount you must pay towards any claim even if the incident is not your fault. Excesses apply under Sections A, B, D, and G of this policy

 

Section A - Damage to your car

We will not pay more than the market value of your car at the time of the loss less any excesses

 

Section B - Fire and theft

We will not pay more than the market value of your car at the time of the loss less any excesses

 

Section D - Windscreen and window damage (This section only applies if you have comprehensive cover)

What is not covered: 1. Any excess shown in your schedule for glass replacement or repair.

 

Section G - Foreign use

The relevant excesses and exclusions under Sections A – D (Sections B-C if Third party fire and theft cover is selected) also apply whilst your car is being used abroad.

 

 

So in the above circumstances excesses apply. You don't physically "pay" up as such, they just knock it off what they pay out.

 

But there are circumstances where you can make a claim and not get hit with an excess deduction, for instance under the terms of their "Uninsured driver promise"

 

Now some time ago I had a policy with AXA Ireland and I made a theft claim. I don't remember incurring any excess.

 

Their Irish Policy wording is:

 

 

Excess

 

You will not have to pay an excess if the loss or damage is caused by fire, lightning, explosion, theft or attempted theft. You will have to pay the excess shown on your policy schedule for any other type of claim covered under this section. Nor will we seek on your behalf to recover an excess from another person. Please refer to your schedule to see what excess applies to your policy. You can reduce your policy excess by €100 if you use an AXA garage. This reduction is not available to Studentfirst policies.

 

 

Under same five circumstances on a UK policy, an excess does apply. Same company, different policy.

 

 

TL;DR - always read the label.

 

Note also on that Irish policy: "Nor will we seek on your behalf to recover an excess from another person." e.g. We're lazy bastards and you'll either get a crappy panel solicitor to do that with whatever uninsured loss recovery / legal expenses cover that you might have or you can sod off and do it yourself.

 

"Uninsured loss recovery" insurance / "Legal expenses" cover boils my piss. They are good for simple cases that you could do yourself anyway, but if it's a bit complicated or costs anything more than writing a couple of letters then FRO they're not interested. Don't pay extra for this shite.

[Tickman]

 always read the label.

 

This or don't moan when it goes wrong!

 

Goes off to check current insurance details...........

[beko1987]

This is why I view the zx as disposable in these circumstances. Car cost £350, my excess is £350. I will just try my dammned hardest to either not crash, or if I have to bin the car, not someone else.

 

If someone else hit me, I hope they would just not go through insurance. Keeping the zx looking like shit helps them back away, the bashed up wing portrays an 'he doesn't give a shit' aura I think, which works for me...

[sierraman]

Like the truck in Duel!

 

Try getting a quote for bodywork as well these days. Instead of repairing what they should they start putting in all sorts of shit that doesn't need replacing thus sending the cost through the roof and leaving the insurance to write off the car due to value.

[The Moog]

Thanks for all advice.

 

I offered the guy the opportunity to pay up, but no doubt he has had mates advice about giving way to right. He also said he can't afford it and his car will need a few quid spending on it.

 

End of the day focus is disposable, so not that bothered about that part. Annoying I have spent cash on it but that's life

 

More important to avoid fault and loose ncb. Whatever is the quickest and least hassle to ensure that happens.

[The Moog]

Just quickly used Google to get images of junction (isnt technology amazing!) 

 

My View 

 

His View 

 

[r.welfare]

When my wife was hit by someone pulling out from a junction without looking a couple of years back, the other driver (despite admitting liability at the time) then refused to give insurance details, changed her mind on who was at fault, and fabricated a witness.

 

A detailed statement of the type you have been kindly supplied, together with diagrams punctuated with Google Streetview screenshots, saw 100% of the value of our car refunded despite our accident management chaser company thinking it would only go 50/50.

[The Moog]

Spoke to the insurance investigator today. Apparently other party has put in hefty medical bill and is claiming it all from my insurance. Also he wasn't by himself, he had his family with him who also need treatment! They certainly hid themselves well after the crash. 

 

Guy took a detailed statement (also took a copy of mine I had produced), asked me to email all the pictures I took and wanted copy of police report.  He said it is standard now that people get home, talk to friends then bump their claims up massively.

 

The fact I have all this evidence and have got support such as my police log will mean that he doesnt have a leg to stand on. Also the angle of impact plus amount of damage doesnt tie up with what he is saying and the speeds involved. He hit me at about 10mph but I think is claiming 3x that. 

 

I just need to deal direct with my company regarding the car and salvage etc. He will deal with the spurious claim. 

 

If your insurance goes up next year it is because of idiots like this guy.