Talk to me about Rover P4 110?

[25v6turbo]

Have a chance to buy a 1964 Rover P4 110,i know the grand sum of zero about these cars but have starting reading up about them.

Its in very nice condition,not a show winner but nice and clean and smart looking.

It will be about £2500 I think,i have seen there is a good following for them and spares seem to be in quite good supply. 

Can anyone give me some idea if that's a sensible price and the pros and cons of owning one.

I guess the idea of it getting nicked and put around the track is a worry....

[wuvvum]

110 is probably the one to have, although I think they had steel doors by then so one more thing to rust (which they do quite well).  They are a nice old thing to drive and will keep up with traffic as long as you don't try to go round corners quickly; most 110s will have overdrive and so cruise happily at 70.  They do like a drink, but that's of secondary importance with a car like that,

 

I am so out of touch with classic prices now that I'm not even going to attempt to provide any input on that score.

[N Dentressangle]

It'll have the 6cyl 3l Rover engine which was also used in the Series Land Rovers as well as the P5. Thirsty, not powerful, but smooth. Cracked exhaust manifolds seems to be a problem, and spares for them aren't plentiful.

 

£2.5k doesn't seem bad as long as the body / chassis is OK. I seem to recall these are only partially monocoque, with a fairly heavy chassis structure as well as structural sills etc. Trim will be unobtainable, so make sure it's all there.

 

I'd like one, but would probably be happier with a P5 or 6. The P4 is a 50's car, and I've never had one of those!

[trigger]

They have suicide doors so for that reason alone you should definitely buy it.

[mercrocker]

'64 was the last year for these.  Should have steel doors, as Wuvvum says.  I would have thought that is a pretty decent price for a good P4 - the 110 has the Weslake head and bigger carb and is generally considered the best performer.   Standard overdrive, too, IIRC.   Worth a punt!

[JeeExEll]

The 'big-block' 2.6 IOE engine certainly sounds like an old jalopy should.

Zero to 120mph in under 12 seconds still quite impressive, even by modern standards.

Grandpa must have had great fun charging up and down the recently opened M1 in one of these.

 

Rapid wear of the rear tyres appears to have been a problem so make sure no-one tries to pan you off with a dud car, get right down there and have a close look. May be wise to just budget for a new set regardless.

[Minimad5]

Pictures that man.

Have two friends with P4s, I believe they are both 105R models.

 

Have a soft spot for the design, and really do appear to waft with grace.

 

Poke around at the Chassis etc.

Bits can be found as they seem to have a good following, if you're on Facebook P.m your details and I'll add you to a few groups.

 

Good luck

[cros]

I think the worst thing about p4s are the wheezy 6 cylinder engines, and after a while I hooked them out of both of mine, as moderner Rover 4 cylinder 2.5's go in easily (one petrol, one diesel)

At least the Westlake head boasts a separate inlet manifold and is a bit more efficient, but the late car weighs more with it's extra steel bits. 2.6 was the largest size in P4s, gearbox layshaft not up to the 3 litre. (I've snapped and replaced 2 so am fairly sure about this)

The other downside is handling, press on and they corner like a drunken whale.

The good bits are that the ride is very acceptable, and they are great to travel a long way in. I missed the 8pm ferry to Spain once, took a crossing to France at 2pm the next day and still reached Bilbao first. The 2.5 tdi kept it a around 120 kph, more on the 4 occasions I got flashed by them hidden speed camera's.... You can't use many other 50s cars like this.

£2500 is good for a decent car, no point in bothering with a knacker as you won't paint it for that, let alone weld it up first. Front and rear wings need watching and are not the easiest to sort. Bottom of the b piller goes too along with chassis outriggers. They are much like a Series Landrover in this respect, and are extremely rigid if in good nick. Seats are often shagged, good ones hard to find; Richards Rovers near me is the man for SH parts, Waring and Wadhams both do most new parts including panels at remarkably low prices. I recently bought newly made early type overiders for less than the cost of decent re-chroming. These cars really are as well served as Minors.

Cheap radial van tyres work fine (Owners club disagree) crossplies are horrible except that the steering is lighter on them. It is very heavy to park, my Mrs uses it for shopping but doesn't like tight spaces much. Good re-circ. ball steering once under way, nice steering wheel, and amazingly, built in front seat belt mounts even on my '57 P4. Reserve petrol switch. Boot is big but poorly designed, overall its a shiters Rolls Royce.

Nearly forgot, disc brakes should stop very well, but the gearchange is fairly poor; make sure it doesn't spoil what is otherwise a very nice car to drive. I've noticed a big variation in 'boxes. Also, I know someone with a 110, I don't think it ever sees 20mpg.

[wuvvum]

  On 10/01/2019 at 00:59, cros said:

2.6 was the largest size in P4s, gearbox layshaft not up to the 3 litre.

Indeed - in fact the later engines with the Weslake head are 13cc "smaller" than the earlier versions - 2625cc instead of the 2638 in my old 105.

[lesapandre]

I'd say give it a good drive first- see if you like it. I have had a lot of 50's cars and they are an acquired taste. Owning and polishing is one thing - but if you don't like the driving experience not much point in ownership.

[sierraman]

Around 96-97 Practical Classics restored one, back issues of that could be handy.

[Amishtat]

If the interior is tidy and you like it after a drive I'd say that's worth a go. I had a spin in one for the first time last year and was pleasantly surprised how well it went

[Uncle Jimmy]

Got freewheel innit?

[lesapandre]

I'm not sure the late ones have freewheel. Disc brakes perhaps? Freewheel is frankly terrifying on a big underbraked 50's saloon where engine braking is vital to manage brake fade and inefficiency pre-servos.

[JeeExEll]

Nice looking 110 on ebay today, currently at £2500, reserve not met.

 

 

 

 

 

No mention of a drag racing history, but with a car of this age who can tell? Manual overdrive.

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Rover-P4-110-1964/292902954677?hash=item44326066b5:g:j7sAAOSws99cL3GO&redirect=mobile

 

[Junkman]

GIB, ffs!

[cros]

  On 10/01/2019 at 10:34, lesapandre said:

I'm not sure the late ones have freewheel. Disc brakes perhaps? Freewheel is frankly terrifying on a big underbraked 50's saloon where engine braking is vital to manage brake fade and inefficiency pre-servos.

Can have freewheel or O/D but not both, freewheel went in late 50's anyway. It enables clutchless gearchanges and is OK in beautiful flat Lincs where I live. It automatically disengages for reverse. As you say, drums are a bit marginal but I like them and this is why. In very heavy rain the discs don't work initially- '70's Jap bikes with stainless rotors did the same thing. It's horrible, but I've never heard this mentioned by other owners, they perhaps don't go out if it's cloudy*** (I tried different pads and shields were correctly in place). Worth watching if only to save shitting yourself on those nice seats.

Both my cars had diffs changed for disco 3.54's which the more powerful engines will pull happily in overdrive. The Tdi gave great mpg with this set up (40+) but it badly spoils the smoothness.

 

 

*** Now I think of it, check the wipers, chances are the rubber mountings are perished, they all go. You can buy expensive fixes, I just bolt them up rigidly as on regular cars. If my life was so hassle free that the noise from the wiper gearboxes was bothersome I'd probably join the Owners Guild. Yes, that's what it's really called.

[Junkman]

Going by FPB7's example, the drum brakes are excellent and work very well even if freewheeling is enabled, which is such a nice feature that I would never buy one without it.

It's the opposite of terrifying and I used it in town and on dual carriageways intersected by those fucking roundabouts that shouldn't intersect any dual carriageways.

This talk about brakes is wimpish. Talk to me about brakes after you've driven a '50 Studebaker and even those are sufficient if you aren't an idiot.

[lesapandre]

Yea my experience was of an Austin Westminster 1958. Perhaps the Rover is better with its freewheel. Wessie was distinctly underbraked even with constant fettling. Rover looks lovely.

[95 quid Peugeot]

I impulse bought one at ACA Kings Lynn a few months ago. P4 110.

I paid 1700 Inc fees.

Very happy with it. Even Mrs 95 drives it

[Squire_Dawson]

Herbert Austin claimed good brakes make bad drivers.

[wuvvum]

Brakes are massively overrated.  I once drove a Saab 9000 Turbo automatic from Paris to Norwich with no brakes at all, and I didn't die once.

[Doctormop]

I bought a 1955 P490 in 2003 for £800 it seemed a bargain

To be honest I never took to it but it had been terribly bodged in the past

Suppose a well maintained and cared for one is joyous but mine was not

Probably should have got a better example but that's the story of my life

YSL 485 probably put me off rash unseen purchases forever; even at £800

[Junkman]

  On 10/01/2019 at 21:15, Squire_Dawson said:

Herbert Austin claimed good brakes make bad drivers.

 

Ettore Bugatti told his race drivers he pays them for winning, not for braking.

[sierraman]

They are at that age where they’ll have seen some right giffer bodges over the years, filler trowelled in, repairs brazed on etc.

[AMC Rebel]

  On 11/01/2019 at 08:27, sierraman said:

They are at that age where they’ll have seen some right giffer bodges over the years, filler trowelled in, repairs brazed on etc.

 

 

Like my Chevy - it's had some amazing patches bodged in using a gas welder from pre-mig/tig days.  Regular little blobs rather than seam welding because the heat from gas would distort to frickery. All levelled out with a big pile of wob of course.

[Junkman]

  On 09/01/2019 at 23:19, mercrocker said:

'64 was the best year.

 

EFA

 

On my birthday, you could have walked into a Rover dealership and driven home either a P4, a P5, or a P6 and celebrated the occasion with a 1964 wine bought at the corner shop for Pennies!