German gearbollox

[Uncle Jimmy]

A friend of mine spouted the opinion earlier on that BMW manual boxes good, Benz manual boxes shit and vice versa for the autos.

I've read here that the manual boxes on Benz 190s were a bit agricultural but is this otherwise a load of old bollocks?

[Lukas]

Thats what german magazines wrote...

 

I liked the manual transmission in my 1996 Mercedes-Benz C220 Diesel. 

 

And I absolutely adore the 8-speed-automatic-transmission from ZF in the new BMWs. 

[Urko]

Too generalised to make a lot of sense I reckon.  Getrag made a lot of the manual boxes for BMW(still do) and Merc 190s as well as stacks of other manufacturers.  Ex wife had a manual Benz 230 SLK - it was fine as far as it goes - I preferred it to the auto one she had before it. 

[gordonbennet]

Merc's problem is the foot operated hand released parking brake, so you need 3 feet and to think a lot to make smooth work of manual driving if hill stops and starts are involved, the autos i've had have always been lovely with an inbuilt superb hill hold meaning the parking brake really was just for parking.

 

Mercs auto boxes in lorries are utter shit, but then so was the electric powerliner manual a load of shit too.

 

Never driven a big Beemer with manual, the 3 series were nice enough changes.

[Des]

The Merc handbrake is an example of thorough German engineering solution to the problem of how to pull a handbrake turn while giving a nazi salute out the sunroof and keeping a hand on the wheel.

Never understood why some cars are so criticised for gearchange, can't remember ever having a problem with anything as long as I've remembered to use the clutch. Front wheel drives though, they're shit.

And unnatural.

[andrew e]

I can vouch that a manual E39 is awfull, yet a manual E36 is GR9. But why? Maybe some cars are engineered for two pedal, some for three pedals.

[Uncle Jimmy]

I'm considering an automatic E34, hence my interest.

[2MB]

I think the e30, lauded for a slick change, and w201, ridiculed for being shit if you had to change your own gears, shared the same Getrag box across some models. I've been wrong before though.

Either way, can't say I've encountered a truly bad manual change. Some automatics are hopeless though

[sloth]

auto e36 are dogshit. gearbag has no idea whats going on.

[spartacus]

What engine e34?

[Skizzer]

Wow, a thread with German in the title and it took until post #5 before someone mentioned the Nazis.

 

Manual box on my modern BMW is notchy. Had much better.

[RoadworkUK]

I can vouch that a manual E39 is awful.

 

This excludes M5.

[spike60]

In the manuals, my BMW e36 Z3 2.8 has a unpleasantly notchy box, lady's BMW e46 318i was nice, son's BMW e39 530d fine if a bit loose at 244k. For what it's worth my 200k 320 CLK Merc was the best auto I've used, 200k 300SE Merc I have at the moment probably the worst auto despite fettling attempts.

Mebby more relevant, my 540i e34 auto I had for 10 years was no trouble if not particularly smooth changing.

[BavarianRetro]

Well I'm a fan of the ZF 4HP22EH switchable four speed auto as fitted to the E30 325i, E24/28/32/34 *35i and various Land Rovers products amongst others.

 

The steptronic in the E39 felt good too.

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

I ran a W203 200K manual Benz. The gear change is pretty good, clutch smooth - no issues. The foot operated handbrake is fine - I got used to it very quickly and never found it a problem, even on hills on traffic queues.

 

BMW's? E39's have a long gear lever with a balance weighted gear knob and they can feel a bit clunky. The big ZF boxes on 2.5/2.8 stuff can be notchy. Small Getrags in the 316i-320i stuff is very good.

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

Well I'm a fan of the ZF 4HP22EH switchable four speed auto as fitted to the E30 325i, E24/28/32/34 *35i and various Land Rovers products amongst others.

 

 

Jesus, really? I hate them, horrible recalcitrant slush box of the old school. The five speed auto was such a massive step forward.

[Tamworthbay]

E46 step tronic auto is great, sport mode for frosty and snowy days or full manual mode but do wish the up and down were reversed in manual mode.

[Tamworthbay]

But it is the first auto I have owned so who knows what others are like............

[Peter C]

The 8 speed auto box in my wife's 4 series BMW is an amazing bit of kit. It always finds the right gear and changes are seamless. In comparison, the 7G box I had in my company C-Class coupe a few years ago was a joke. It never seemed to know which gear it should be in and the changes were very obvious, almost clunky.

 

Both my W123 and W124 Mercs have manual boxes, both have slow and long shift actions with long clutch pedal travel. Awful for sprightly driving but they are maintenance free and last forever.

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

E46 step tronic auto 

 

 

NO M8 ITS TRIP TRONIC CUZ THATS WHOT THEY ALL ARE ON EBAY AND AUTOTRADRER

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

The 8 speed auto box in my wife's 4 series BMW is an amazing bit of kit. It always finds the right gear and changes are seamless. In comparison, the 7G box I had in my company C-Class coupe a few years ago was a joke. It never seemed to know which gear it should be in and the changes were very obvious, almost clunky.

 

Both my W123 and W124 Mercs have manual boxes, both have slow and long shift actions with long clutch pedal travel. Awful for sprightly driving but they are maintenance free and last forever.

 

Yes, it's an amazing bit of kit. Who the fuck would prefer a manual? SRSLY?????

[Uncle Jimmy]

What engine e34?

3.5 6cyl.

[BavarianRetro]

Jesus, really? I hate them, horrible recalcitrant slush box of the old school. The five speed auto was such a massive step forward.

Bearing in mind that they're bolted on to engines from the late 60s in the M20 and M30, and fitted to cars designed in the same era - the E28 is no more than a 1972 E12 in a new coat - then I think they're good in the cars they are fitted to. Yes.

[andrew e]

Peter C I concur about the 7G box in the Mercedes, often wrong footed about 25/30. I still the step tronic box in my E39 was the best ever, though I agree Tamworthbay both BMW (and Mercedes) have the gears up and down thing back to front direction wise.

 

The engineering of the linkage is the thing - drive a Getrag IB5 box in a facelift 25/45 it's awfull - same box anything else is wonderful and precise.

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

3.5 6cyl.

 

 

Never was such an engine wasted behind a 4HP22.

[Asimo]

My '84 BMW 518 had synchro on reverse, which I thought a very nice touch.

Would have preferred first gear out and opposite reverse though, like those dog-leg Getrag 'boxes that get magazine car testers excited/confused.

[Squire_Dawson]

It's German engineering, of course it is marvelous and splendid.