2001 Woever or Rover 75

[purplebargeken]

Ok, I'm back in the seat of a 75. This is the ebay purchase which I collected today. The car is a 2001 2.5 V6 Connie. It has 82, blah blah blah miles on the clock and is MOT'd until Nov. I paid 340 quid.

 

Pro's: 

 

Nice interior, will valet up well

Message display is perfect

Wood/leather steering wheel in good condition

Decent wheels and tyres

Starts and sounds great

Gearbox is fine, no issues

It has a bit of history

 

Cons:

It needs a valeting - no big deal

One tyre has wear on the outer edge, possible TRE needed - not the end of the world

Bodywork is tatty, the bumper has taken a bump and is scuffed

The N/S rear quarter could do with a repaint

The drivers door switch cluster for the windows needs replacing - no big deal. The other windows work happily on their own switches

Both chrome door mirrors are tatty - I have a spare set

It needs a spare wheel

 

The car was purchased just to get me back into the fold. It will never ever be a minter, my intention was just to make it tidier/respectable. 

 

Everything was fine and dandy until about 8 miles into the journey home. The A406 was busy. The owner said that he checked the coolant level and all was fine and he topped the oil up slightly. He took it out for a spin and put a tenners worth of petrol in it for me. 

 

I took the car for a spin and all was fine and I also checked stuff.

 

However, the temp gauge needle was now rising from the mid point, I have had MGF's, so I watch the temp guages like a hawk . The needle was going a bit nuts, up, down, then up, and up, and up until the red warning light illuminated. I stopped and let everything cool down, levels of coolant were fine, fans sound like they are kicking in, no obvious leaks. This happened a couple more times during the journey and I had no option to press on for the last couple of miles with the red light illuminated.

 

The engine is fine, no knocks, squeeks, rattles or bangs. What the hell is going on? I guess I have bought a pup. Oh well, out of over 300 cars it had to happen once or twice but I am puzzled.

 

The owner seemed like a decent bloke, he said  that car had been trouble free before he took it off the road due to having to get a car more in tune with his business needs.

 

Can anyone help? Please?

 

I don't want to scrap the car and would like to persevere with it if at all possible but funds and knowledge are a bit limited to small Triumphs and a bit of Amazon.

[155V6]

Just guessing,but could it be a faulty sensor or something like that?.Miss_155's Pug 307 does a similar thing,driving along & suddenly the gauge will shoot up as though the engine is boilling over & the STOP OR KITTENS WILL DIE light comes on.After a short while it goes out & the gauge goes back to normal.

[dugong]

That sounds.......odd. Buggered sender? Faulty gauge?

 

Pictures be fine. Very fine. We like pictures.

[Pillock]

Would a cheap OBD scanner (even one of the three quid Bluetooth jobs and a free phone app) tell you the true temperature of the engine? Might be a duff gauge, dodgy connection or voltage.

[purplebargeken]

I was kind of thinking that as well but am now paranoid. Pictures will appear tomorrow

[purplebargeken]

Rover is T4 something or other diagnostic-wise.

[Pillock]

There's a diag mode that you can use, puts car data on the display thing apparently. One of them is engine temp.

 

http://forums.mg-rover.org/showthread.php?t=353060#/forumsite/20925/topics/353060

[RoadworkUK]

Tune the stereo back to Radio 3. The car probably just needs a bit of reassurance that everything's going to be OK.

[purplebargeken]

I need reassurance, never mind the car

[MarvinsMom]

first off i'd join the 75 and zt owners club forum, (www.75andztownersclub.co.uk or similar) it is free and there is a shit load of information on there bout the 75.

 

75 and rovers generally have tempreture senders that do tell lies, alot. but for it too get well onto the red something is amiss. 

 

do these have a shitty little saab valve in the cooling circuit like a rover 25? 

 

rover uses a diagnostic system called T4 which i think is their own invention, but there are fellas on the club forum which have all the computer system for the cars.

[Junkman]

There's a diag mode that you can use, puts car data on the display thing apparently. One of them is engine temp.

 

http://forums.mg-rover.org/showthread.php?t=353060#/forumsite/20925/topics/353060

 

Yeah, right. Let's believe what a computer says. That'll be the day.

 

The only question here is, whether the car overheats, or not.

And this has always been measured with an old timey thermometer, is measured with an old timey thermometer, and will ever be measured with an old timey thermometer.

[Pillock]

It'll show whether the gauge is lying due to voltage issues or a dash oddity.

 

I'm not even sure how you'd use a thermometer in the coolant whilst driving...!

[320touring]

It'll show whether the gauge is lying due to voltage issues or a dash oddity.

 

I'm not even sure how you'd use a thermometer in the coolant whilst driving...!

Mouth rather than arse;)

[Junkman]

It'll show whether the gauge is lying due to voltage issues or a dash oddity.

No, it doesn't. It shows what a computer is programmed to display on a screen, which is bollocks by default.

 

I'm not even sure how you'd use a thermometer in the coolant whilst driving...!

 

When the gauge goes up, you stop, get out of the car, open the bonnet and use this:

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/261034524504

[purplebargeken]

I am already on th R75 forum, will check the V for coolant and also check all the hoses for equal warmth. 

[Pillock]

That looks a lot like a computer, and therefore not to be trusted

[purplebargeken]

Just bought one. Always handy.

[Junkman]

That looks a lot like a computer, and therefore not to be trusted

 

Draw a cock on it and you'll be alright.

[purplebargeken]

Coolant was quite clean too. No obvious oil/coolant mix on the dipstick. 

 

Sigh

[RobT]

Is it losing coolant? After a pressure test mine needed a new thermostat housing as the old one had a crack in it and was pissing out, plastic housings on these like other Rovers. Although in your case Ken it does sound like a dodgy sensor.

[dugong]

Your old car is behaving fine, Ken. It won some sort of prize (or got covered in confetti).

 

[Tetleysmooth]

Ken, just go and get this:

 

http://www.volvoforums.org.uk/showthread.php?t=227505

[michael1703]

An air lock gives the same results, you coul try bleeding it at its highest point, if there's nothing to "crack open" I loosen the jubilee clip and then slide something thin between the hose and pipe elbow like a flat blade or scriber and get some bubbles out.

 

Faulty sensor or wiring also possible, you could try grounding the wire to the sensor, gauge should go off the scale and stay there without fluctuating

[red5]

Check actual (on-car) reading using the dash short cut  - the gauges read 'normal/middle' for a range of about 20degrees...

 

Check n/s/f plenum chamber......

 

The infra-red temp guns are ok - but expect a 5 or 6 degree difference at least between what you read externally and actual internal coolant temp.

[EssDeeWon]

Yes to what Red says, there is a way (I cant remember how exactly) to get the actual engine temperature on the dash display. The 75/ZT Forum guys will know, some really helpful guys on there!

 

The fact its shooting up and down sounds like a dodgy sensor, and good news that the oil and coolant looks good. The fact its been sitting about probably wont help.

 

Also, get those plenum chambers checked out asap, who knows when they were last checked and a blocked drain can end one of these cars.

[alf892]

As other say it's a bit pointless reading what the car thinks the temp is......that infra red do dah will let you measure the overall temperature but more importantly find out differences like in and out of rad. And thermo housing.....maybe this is sticking or not opening till it gets localised boiling?

 

On board diagnostics are great but can only read what the sensor says or the fault conditions it was taught to expect so if sensor or wiring is fkd the computer will still spout the reading like it is the truth.

[purplebargeken]

I'll check the plenum chambers this afternoon. I went out and checked the fluids, the coolant is still clean and does not smell 'cooked'. No overt signs of anything like K seal. The oil is ok but could do with a change. Top hose was hot, couldn't get to the bottom hose. No signs of leakage.

 

I started the car up, it got up to temp in about 8 minutes, I let it idle and it sat at mid point on the temp gauge without issue, a longer stint will be attempted this afternoon.

[EssDeeWon]

Signs look OK so far then Ken..

 

No air escape from the expansion tank when you removed the cap? Warm air coming through the vents?

 

Most importantly the fluids are clean (not contaminated) and no white smoke on start up, so I bet its something silly like a temp sensor/sender. 

[red5]

a) Put key into ignition and turn it to position 1 (instruments activated).
a2) If you intend driving with diagnostic mode active, start the engine now.
Press and hold the trip reset button. This is the button sticking out near the speedometer.
c) Your LCD display will show "test 1.-"
d) Immediately press the reset button every half second until you get to "test 19.-". (19.0 allows access to diagnostic mode)
e) The display will now show alternating "Log 1 -on" / "Log 1 -off"
f) While it shows "Log 1 -off" press the reset button and. .
g) With no delay press within a half second (repeatedly if necessary) to get to the required section.
h) The screen will appear similar to the earlier one, but is a different series. Keep pressing every half second to select one of the following functions (there is no title on screen):

 

push button once for each change till you get to

 

7 Temperature and Speed
7.0 Coolant/Engine temperature - changes every whole degree Centigrade. (eg: 021+ is 21°C)
7.1 Ambient/Outside temperature - changes every 0.5 degree Centigrade. (eg.125/130/135 is 12.5°/13.0°/13.5°C)
7.2 Engine speed / Current (RPM)
7.3 Vehicle speed / Current Speed (km/hour)

[purplebargeken]

Ok, second stint at idle. The car held the mid point for a while but the needle then jerked up to halfway between mid point and the next mark. It stayed there for a minute or two and then went back down to the middle mark. At this point I'd heard the whirring of the rad fan for a few minutes and this then continued throughout. The needle then jerked up again, then reached the next marker, after a minute or two it moved up further and I then turned the car off.

 

When the engine was cold I turned on the screen demist, there was a normal heater type noise but no noise similar to that of a fan for the radiator. I hope that makes sense. 

 

I am at a loss to be honest. Any further ideas?