Citroen XM - was JohnK's steed

[dollywobbler]

Interesting. Clearly my insulating tape is crap too then, as that was my very first minor bodge.

[richardmorris]

Lidl has multiple tapes on offer at the moment.

 

Also digging up a memory. A friend of my parents had an Xm, and this would have been middle 90s so quite early, and water obviously got into the electrics as whenever it rained the sunroof and windows opened. This was while parked on the drive. And you think you've got problems

[dollywobbler]

Yup. I've heard of that happening. Well, sunroof anyway. 

 

MO - could well be a plan. I wouldn't drop the headliner until the very last minute though, as it currently stops the inflowing water pouring all over the passenger seat. Need some decent bloody weather!

[messerschmitt owner]

sounds like you have a real leak - never had one of my XMs leak more than a dribble - a couple of days notice and it'll be fine to help. Once it's up and fitted, they take a teeny bit of adjustment but that can be done singlehanded - it's the getting it up that needs two sets of hands.

[beko1987]

Take the passenger seat out and it won't get wet! Or tape a bin liner underneath and play 'sharp corner roulette' when it gets full on the way to MO's? There's only one or two corners on the way to his...

[Inspector Morose]

Enlarge door to workshop so dolly fits in there then clean garage out to fit in XM. Job jobbed. It's easy! (from where I'm sitting)

[vulgalour]

it's the getting it up that needs two sets of hands.

 

We're not letting this go unnoticed, I hope!

[dollywobbler]

 

Moving swiftly on...

 

It seems sunroof antics may now have to involve aerial antics too. No, not in the sky - I just snapped the radio aerial off with a broom because I'm a twat. I even thought "should I lift the aerial to make life easier?" and decided 'meh.' Bad call. Got a decent aerial on the breaker MO?

[messerschmitt owner]

Yes I have an aerial. Still in the car but I have decent gaffa tape. And, of course, a gazebo for if the weather is wet but not windy.

[messerschmitt owner]

Have you done it after the bit that twists round or right at the hinge?

[dollywobbler]

Right at the hinge I think, but will have another look the next time there's something approaching daylight. Good point.

[messerschmitt owner]

Doesn't matter. I can unbolt it from the roof if you need all of it. Otherwise I'll just screw it off and Leave the stub. Sounds like you broke at the threaded part.

[dollywobbler]

Hmmm. Started the XM this morning, and rolled it forward into the sunshine to assist de-icing operations. I may have done this before it was fully pressurised. Certainly, the middle pedal did nothing at all at first! Just before I panicked and used the parking brake, it actually did stop. For the next few miles, there was a definite lag - not what you need really, though it did seem to improve. I suspect that somehow, air has got into the system, but I'm not sure how. Once work is completed, I may have a go at bleeding the system. 

[Lankytim]

I hate it when that happens, you need to let the system built up pressure/sort itself out/work before the brakes do anything useful.

[dollywobbler]

Yup. Was just concerning as it took a long time to sort itself out! As in several miles. I then depressurised it again and let it rise up before driving home and it did seem better, if not perfect.

[Andrew353w]

Hmmm. Started the XM this morning, and rolled it forward into the sunshine to assist de-icing operations. I may have done this before it was fully pressurised. Certainly, the middle pedal did nothing at all at first! Just before I panicked and used the parking brake, it actually did stop. For the next few miles, there was a definite lag - not what you need really, though it did seem to improve. I suspect that somehow, air has got into the system, but I'm not sure how. Once work is completed, I may have a go at bleeding the system. 

Interesting... My Xantia has NO braking at all until the engine fires but once the engine's running the brakes are immediately "spot on." I did read in a book somewhere that there's a technique to bleeding the hydraulics but that the brakes are always bled automatically by the car and that any air locks would end up in the suspension system. I stand to be corrected but I understood that the car powered the brakes first & the suspension later, with the storage spheres being the last to power up. Try going up & down 10 times & see if that helps-it usually does!

[dollywobbler]

It's fine today. I have learnt a lesson though. Don't press the brake pedal until it has fully pressurised!

[forddeliveryboy]

Yup. Was just concerning as it took a long time to sort itself out! As in several miles. I then depressurised it again and let it rise up before driving home and it did seem better, if not perfect.

 

Any LHM Cit which has a spongy brake after even a hundred metres has air in the brake circuits. They don't self-bleed - they're blind ended like any other brake circuit.

 

I'm assuming you've already changed the LHM, DW - if not then it would be a good time to do so. At any rate, I wouldn't dare drive another mile without at least bleeding the brakes. When the old style hydraulic pumps had covered half a million miles they could start introducing bubbles which would find their way into the brake circuits eventually. I'm assuming the XMs use the Xantia-style pumps (which are known for leaks by 150k), sited down where the power steering pump would be.

[cort16]

Get some of that glue stuff BMW use to bond on quarter panels and the like and glue an old road sign over the sunroof. Problem solved.

 

Oh. I wonder how many people have been caught out by the opening the sunroof on the way home after buying the car and it jamming. Me for one. You only do it once, okay maybe twice.

[dollywobbler]

Any LHM Cit which has a spongy brake after even a hundred metres has air in the brake circuits. They don't self-bleed - they're blind ended like any other brake circuit.

 

I'm assuming you've already changed the LHM, DW - if not then it would be a good time to do so. At any rate, I wouldn't dare drive another mile without at least bleeding the brakes. When the old style hydraulic pumps had covered half a million miles they could start introducing bubbles which would find their way into the brake circuits eventually. I'm assuming the XMs use the Xantia-style pumps (which are known for leaks by 150k), sited down where the power steering pump would be.

 

Well, I've done nothing and it's now better. A full Hydraflush is on the To Do list, but the To Do list is quite lengthy and I may have to put timing belt replacement further up the list. Then there's finding the 'overheat' fault, replacing the sunroof cassette, replacing the lost relay, sorting out the now-sagging headlining...

[messerschmitt owner]

Ian

I just used pva glue on the tiny bits of sagging cloth on mine.

 

mainly at the edges - and it's just pop some behind and then hold it till it sticks - if elsewhere and the cloth is coming away from the backing, use a syringe to inject glue behind the cloth and then use your hand to glue it back to the backing.

 

Also, what relay is missing - I have a box of assorted XM relays and will have a few more soon ...

[dollywobbler]

I dropped one of the five-pin ones behind the passenger headlamp. I'm not going to bother fixing the headlining until the sunroof job is done - might be easier when it's not fitted to the car anyway. I'm hoping to be heading your way in early-mid Feb. Possibly.

[forddeliveryboy]

Think I'd be investigating intermittently-working brakes before anything else on the to do list. Bleeding's a pain at this time of year as with any car, a little less so not having to pump the pedal - but it's better than not being able to stop for something. Doesn't matter if someone runs out in front of you or a cyclist rides across your path - with brakes which have failed once already, it'd be seen as your fault. Just hoping the problems has gone away never to come back may be ok with most things, but surely not brakes?

[Noel Tidybeard]

Hmmm. Started the XM this morning, and rolled it forward into the sunshine to assist de-icing operations. I may have done this before it was fully pressurised. Certainly, the middle pedal did nothing at all at first! Just before I panicked and used the parking brake, it actually did stop. For the next few miles, there was a definite lag - not what you need really, though it did seem to improve. I suspect that somehow, air has got into the system, but I'm not sure how. Once work is completed, I may have a go at bleeding the system. 

hmm i wonder if this may be why they have a girt big STOP light on the dash

[dollywobbler]

Stop light is not illuminated, and wasn't at the time either. Car is several miles away at the moment so I'm not sure when I'll get a chance to get the spanners on it anyway. If I genuinely thought it was unsafe, I wouldn't have driven it several miles.

[dollywobbler]

Some successes to report.

 

1) Sunroof has been taped up again, and actually seems to be watertight now, though the lack of apocalyptic rain has helped with that. Mere drizzle today.

2) Towing electrics are now fine. The old wiring had been cut off at the plug. I cut into this wiring to wire my new plug in. I managed to wire it up to the dead end of the wire. Clever! However, three months on, I got busy with the multimeter, spotted the other end of the wire and found a lot of electricity. So, it's now wired up properly. Phew.

3) Brakes have been bled. Quite easy on an XM. Jack up each wheel, run the engine, use a bar to press the brake pedal and then operate the nipples. None of them were seized, which was nice, but the front ones are in a bloody stupid place. Mucky stuff came out. I think I should probably stick with my Hydraflush plan longer term. Pedal response seems quicker now.

 

It's flashing Overheat warnings at me near constantly now, so if this drizzle sods off, that might be this afternoon's job.

[Station]

Does your radiator fans still come on?

Mine have started doing it, but it's when I switch the car off on a longish drive (about 30 mins). I think this is just the cooling system, but a bit unusual, unless there's an electric water pump? The STOP and the temp symbol has come on a couple of times, but it hasn't overheated. The fan stays on but have not sat in the car to see how long it goes on for.

I've ordered some glow plugs as it's getting a bit tricky to start in the morning, and the battery is starting to get slower!

I've also noticed about the brakes, there have been a couple of times I press the pedal, and there's nothing. They seem to lock up really easy!

The suspension is also unfathomable. I get a comfortable ride 1/20 times, but otherwise the ride is probably the worst of any car I've owned. I can feel any and every bump through the back. I'm going to give it to a local Citroen specialist and get him to sort it out. I've checked the height level thing in the back, but I can't fathom out what is seized and what is not. It looks very, very primitive, I couldn't believe they still used this type of lever in the 90's, completely exposed.

Even with it's flaws, which are fixable, it's still a really good car!

[dollywobbler]

Fans would come on if I hadn't removed the relay. They're unnecessary this time of year. They never operate with the ignition off though...

Water pump is very much mechanical so it sounds like you have a similar fault. Very common it seems.

My starter has been getting slower. Hoping to avoid new battery time for a while!

If the brakes do absolutely nothing, that does suggest an issue. Try bleeding them first. 

If the rear height is jamming in the high position, that'll give an utterly shit ride as it's maxxed out on the bump stops. Mine jiggles a bit sometimes, but can also waft at other times. Potholes are not fun. I don't really understand height controllers as I've never had to muck about with them.

They are good. They must be. Over three months for mine now and sunroof leak and overheat warning aside, it's hard to fault.

[dollywobbler]

I very nearly got to thoroughly test the winter tyres today. Did drive through some snow, but hardly sufficient to form conclusions. The views were absolutely staggering though.

[Lacquer Peel]

Winter tyres aren't just for snow.