Your Shite Room 101

[cort16]

I really dislike a lot of the new VW/Skoda/Audi/Seat stuff they're churning out just now.  They're just so white goods they just blend into the landscape with their nothing ness. It's not even like you get great quality cars from them anymore they're just the same quality if not worse than what ford and vauxhall are putting out.

 

Have a look at the previous and current generation A3, A4, A6 and A8 and you'd be hard pushed to tell the difference other than the slight curver of a tail lamp or a swage line that's moved 2 inches. Come on VW just cos Porsche do it doesn't mean it's not boring as fuck!

[John F]

That's a bit unfair, perhaps... VAG are a victim of their own success, and their vehicles are perhaps considered bland because they are *everywhere*.

 

I'd argue that they're actually reasonably attractive in comparison with other brands (albeit in a rather sanitised Germanic way), and their lightweight construction philosophy is excellent. In terms of quality, they're certainly in a higher league than Ford and Vauxhall.

 

I wouldn't buy one though, because all modernz ar shite, innit?

[Junkman]

...because all modernz ar shite, innit?

 

No. They are shit.

[Hendry]

The Mk4 Astra although not bad to drive is so white goods and lacking in any kind of charisma that you could probably own one for 3 years and not notice. The only thing that cheered up the interior on my Bertone Coupe one was that someone had hammerited the centre console brown.

I've got to agree with that, I had a 52 plate mk4 hatch and have also owned a mk3 and a mk5 and the mk4 was a good car, reliable, ok to drive, cheap to run, but fuck me it was so drab if you sat in it for any longer than half an hour you'd be sleeping, whereas the mk3 and mk5 while nothing special were miles better. I had to fit he SXi matt aluminium effect console to brighten it up a bit.

[Spiny Norman]

 and their lightweight construction philosophy

 

I was with you right up till that bit....

 

VAG have been at the forefront of producing ever more porky cars since the late 90s, and sadly wherte they led, others followed.

Modern 1.2 Fabia? Heavier than a Cavalier SRi.

A current Golf 1.6 is heavier than a mid 80s BMW 5 series and an Audi TT 2.0 Quattro weighs the same as a V6 engined Mercedes E class!

 

New cars may or may not be shit, but they weigh an obscene amount compared to their predecessors, and given that we're allegedly all supposed to want to save fuel.

[cort16]

I think what annoys me about the VAG stuff is the way they share the cars over the brands and think that the buying public are too stoopid to notice the difference.

 

I give you the new Jetta

 

 

Toledo

 

 

 Rapid

 

 

I can under stand why you'd platform share or even make a little budget car like the Up, Mii, Citygo like this but a 12-15 grand car is taking the piss. Lazy bastards, all they've done is change the soft stuff like the grill, headlamps and front bumper.

[Lacquer Peel]

Isn't the Jetta a different car, despite appearances?

[Spiny Norman]

Unfortunately, things don't get a whole lot better when you take similarly sized cars from DIFFERENT manufacturers .....

 

 

I can't be arsed naming them all, it doesn't really matter at the end of the day, but it sure fuels the OMGNEWCARZISSHIT argument.

Never since the 50s have we been so inundated with bland copycat styling and general dullness in car design.

 

[Lacquer Peel]

I don't know, some 1980s and 1990s cars were pretty dull and homogenous. Not goppingly ugly, at least.

[Cavcraft]

I don't know, some 1980s and 1990s cars were pretty dull and homogenous. Not goppingly ugly, at least.

 

To be fair a lot of cars in the 1960s/70s were too. As much as I like them, I can't see people having a trouser tent moment over a Farina Cambridge or a Mk4 Zephyr for example back in the day. Doesn't mean they're shit I hasten to add, just not exactly awe inspiring.

 

As regards this 'all modern cars are rubbish' caper I would be willing to bet that people have been saying this for the last 40 years or more. Each generation grows up with a different era of cars and subconsciously compare them to newer ones, that what I reckon anyhow.

[Richard]

There was copycat styling in the 60s and 70s too. The Hillman Minx/Hunter was so similar to the Mk2 Cortina that I bet you could fit one with panels from the other.

 

What has become very generic is the engineering. If you were buying a small to medium family car in the 1970s you could have front wheel drive with the engine facing any of four directions, you could have the gearbox in the sump, below the sump or bolted onto the end of the engine. With rear wheel drive you could have the engine at either end. You could have two to four cylinders in several arrangements with 2 stroke, OHV or OHC. For suspension you could choose struts or wishbones, leaf springs, torsion bars, coil springs, rubber blocks, hydragas or hydropneumatic. Most of these features could be had without buying anything too outlandish.

[ProgRocker]

Ssangyong Rodius.

 

As previously mentioned - the Shitty Rover & Xsara Picasso

[garethj]

I think what annoys me about the VAG stuff is the way they share the cars over the brands and think that the buying public are too stoopid to notice the difference.

 

I give you the new Jetta

 

Toledo

 

 Rapid

 

I can under stand why you'd platform share or even make a little budget car like the Up, Mii, Citygo like this but a 12-15 grand car is taking the piss. Lazy bastards, all they've done is change the soft stuff like the grill, headlamps and front bumper.

This is amazing, VW have been doing it for a few years with apparent success, yet they've copied the business model from the Austin Cambridge / Morris Oxford / Riley 4/72 / MG Magnette / Wolseley whatever

 

My room 101 entry goes to the BMW X6, although most similar cars get a mention for their gawping ugliness, the fact they don't fit on the roads and their drivers seem to have issues with their attitude

[Hendry]

I think the reason VAG have been successful with 3 stables of identical cars when you'd think that they would be shooting themselves in the foot competing with their own cars is that if one brand doesn't have something a customer wants, 1 of the other brands will whereas with Ford/Vauxhall/Renault etc if they don't have something it'd mean the customer choosing another make of car whereas with VAG they are keeping the customer in the group.

 

To me the cars are aimed at at fall into 3 different niches, Seat for young people and people who want a sportier looking car, Skoda for people who want value for money, older people, people who don't care about image and of course taxi drivers, not only for the Octavia and Superb but I've seen a few Rapid taxis now too, the. Vw themselves for badge snobs who want to try and impress the neighbours and keep up with the Joneses but who can't afford premium German cars like Mercs and BMs, and those who believe all the hype and still think VW is a byword for reliability, people who still believe in the previous reputation VW are still living off

[garethj]

...and Audis for those who want to split the atom, by putting it between your back bumper and their front bumper?

 

You're right about it all being kept in the group.  I wonder if the '60s was a successful time for BMC using the same business model?  They certainly failed in the '70s by making cars that overlap so narrowly (Maxi, Marina, 1800) but they each had development costs, whereas VWs nowadays is probably better controlled.

[vulgalour]

I was going to nominate the Daewoo Espero, but that has some redeeming features in the looks and comfort department so instead I nominate the Toyota Carina E.

 

 

My condolences to anyone that owns one of these cars.  Just thinking about it is making me feel sleepy, actually, and that's really the big problem.  Very competent, excellent mpg, build moderately well and all the makings of a really good last forever type of a thing and many of them have.  But here's the rub: they're so BORING.

 

My Dad had a Carina for a while, it was superb at doing all the things he needed it to do cheaply and well every day.  But the steering wheel felt like it belonged on a toy, the power steering was so light that you had no idea what the front wheels were doing until they did it.  The interior was a sea of plastic so du..zzzzz

 

*snort*rabbits on the tracks!*snorts and wakes up* sorry, where was I?  Oh yeah, the soporific haze that is the Carina E... er, yeah, the rear visibility is terrible, the auto box is vague, the driving experience *yawns* is less than thrilling and... oh, and it's annoying when drunks try and flag you down because they think you're a taxi.

 

I'm going to have a nice little nap, someone else pull the lever, the Carina has made me too tired to want to.

[Hendry]

^^^ The problem is, IMO you could say the same about most volume Japanese cars, and that's not enough therefore to make it room 101 worthy.

 

Toyota are still doing it now and being very successful, Nissan, Lexus, Mitsubishi, etc the only 1 who are trying to make cars that aren't boring these days Japanese are Mazda IMO.

[brickwall]

The manufacturers are confined by efficienty and engineering when it comes to shape? Like submarines, the best shape is tear drop.

[Lacquer Peel]

I don't know why Japanese cars are singled out for being dull, I don't see the equivalent VAG or GM product as any more exciting. Just less reliable.

[vulgalour]

I would agree with the dullness not being enough, but the Carina E is, paradoxically, notable for it's utter lack of notable items.  It's so efficient, so anodyne and so much a machine to do a job it stands head and shoulders above other Japanese offerings in a similar field that I've experienced.  It is the singularly most boring car I've ever had the misfortune to travel in or drive and considering the sorts of boring cars I've been in that's quite an achievement.  A 1980s Bluebird is positively exciting by comparison and a 90s Micra fizzy and fun.

[ProgRocker]

I was going to nominate the Daewoo Espero, but that has some redeeming features in the looks and comfort department so instead I nominate the Toyota Carina E.

 

 

My condolences to anyone that owns one of these cars.  Just thinking about it is making me feel sleepy, actually, and that's really the big problem.  Very competent, excellent mpg, build moderately well and all the makings of a really good last forever type of a thing and many of them have.  But here's the rub: they're so BORING.

 

 

If I was going to rob a bank then the Carina E with it's boringness, spritely performance and reliability would be ideal.

[vulgalour]

Except you'd find the getaway driver had nodded off and you couldn't get him to drive off.  Or if you were driving, all the adrenaline of the bust would be drained out of you as soon as your sat in the drivers seat and you'd become Marvin, I mean really, what's the use?  And you'd have this terrible pain all down the left side of your diodes... brain the size of a planet...