Any Chrysler Voyager experts?

[Tetleysmooth]

I've replaced my Toyota Previa with a Chrysler Grand Voyager.

It's a great bus, apart from one thing - rear drum brakes.

I'm toying with the idea of swapping the complete rear axle from a Voyager with discs, but I need to know how straightforward the job is.

Will I need to alter the hydraulic brake lines at all?

Will the drum brake handbrake cables fit the disc setup, with the handbrake shoes inside the disc?

Anything else you can think of which may cause a problem?

Thanks in advance.

[skattrd]

Sorry, I've no idea about voyagers, but personally I'd say leave it alone.

 

The only thing disc brakes on the rear are any good for is handbrake turns. If you fit disks you will also need to fit a compensator to reduce the amount they work as they will be too harsh without it, hence why drums are usually adequate for the rear.

[dollywobbler]

Agreed. There's not a lot wrong with drums. Discs are usually underworked on the back end of stuff, so just seize up.

[crapcarcollector]

I will ask, whats wrong with the back brakes that makes you feel conversion is needed?

[warren t claim]

Could you not fit drums to the front to even out the braking?

[Albert Ross]

Leave it alone, drum brakes are far better as parking brakes, as the drums contract onto the shoes as they cool. I work on vehicles for a living. Rear pads need replacement at 25k, discs often at the same time. Shoes and drums? 80-100k. Do the maths, and be lazy. Just ignore it, it will go away.

[Bren]

Leave it alone, drum brakes are far better as parking brakes, as the drums contract onto the shoes as they cool. I work on vehicles for a living. Rear pads need replacement at 25k, discs often at the same time. Shoes and drums? 80-100k. Do the maths, and be lazy. Just ignore it, it will go away.

 

 

Unless you have a Rover SD1.

[RichardMoss]

Agreed. There's not a lot wrong with drums. Discs are usually underworked on the back end of stuff, so just seize up.

This. I ran a Grand Voyager for 3 years and 80,000 miles and never once found myself wishing for rear discs. The drums are perfectly OK as long as they're in good order (like any brakes).

[Morgan84]

I know cars with discs all round 'can' feel sharper,but to be honest,its a heavy large vehicle granted,but if Chrysler thought it needed them,they would certainly have fitted them as standard. With regards to conversions,the handbrake cables would need changing,the rear pipe hydraulics 'might' just be the rear flexible hose from the steel pipe to the rear hub,but again,it may be something which needed modiforcation.Another item would be rear ABS sensors and compatibility with the existing vehicle harness ie plugs and location.

As I'm sure you know,rear disc brakes can be a pain in the backside if not kept well maintained,as the back end of the vehicle draws in all the muck and wet when travelling along,and the rear pads do tend to seize in the housings,as well as rear calliper slider pins,so unless they are serviced regularly and well copper slipped,they end up binding,or not operating as they should,and you end up with scabby discs.On most vehicles,the back brakes are the ones which give the most problems.

It would be a interesting conversion to do,if you happen to have a donor vehicle to take all the parts off,but if not,would be a very expensive thing to do,with perhaps no real advantages gained.

They are a nice car though,and although people moaned at them being a 1 star crash rating vehicle,I would rather crash a 1 star Voyager than a 4 star supermini anyday ! It was only rated compared to other vehicles in its class,so despite that,its still safer than many little tinboxes on the roads

[dollywobbler]

The biggest problem with rear drums is self adjusters that don't. Even the Maverick suffered in this regard. Adjusting the drums myself was no hardship and changing a drum is a piece of cake compared to a disc.

[Pete-M]

Admittedly some things are swines to change discs, but that's the same with some drums.

 

What's difficult about undoing the caliper carrier, swinging that and the caliper out of the way, undoing one screw, remove disc? Replacement is reverse, etc..

 

If there's one thing on cars I avoid it's messing about with drum brakes. Bloody awful fiddly buggers.

[Morgan84]

Ask someone with a MK2 Jaguar or a Rolls Royce Silver Shadow that question ! I know what you mean about removing the caliper etc being straight forwards,but when the said items are seized to buggery,it becomes a battle.I also know what a pain in the bum rear drum brakes are on cars like Clio's when the rear shoes unbond,and jam the brake on;both types of brakes have their pro's and cons

[Pete-M]

Inboard drums wouldn't be much fun, and neither are the ones on Beetles..... Rust can make anything a bugger to work on.

 

Wasn't it the Mini that got discs on the front in the '80s because the boss of Rover (Graham Day?)'s wife reversed her mini into his car. Drums don't work too well in reverse, so minis got front discs as standard after that?

 

Both systems, as you say have their advantages. Drums are better for handbrakes as when the drums cool - i.e when parked up after a long run - the handbrake gets more efficient, whereas discs handbrakes get less efficient as the disc cools. Which is why lots of manufacturers fit drums just for handbrake use.

[Tetleysmooth]

Sorry for the late reply, I've been at work.

Thanks for all the advice chaps.

Compared to the Previa, the brakes need a bloomin' good shove before they'll work as I would like them to.

I had the drums off when I first got the bus, and blimey, the amount of springs, adjusters, spacers etc was a bit daunting. I just put the drums back on, adjusted them manually and left them alone.

I am losing a little brake fluid though, the level keeps dropping, but I'm buggered if I can find out where. Nothing on the front or rear wheels, so I'm wondering if the servo is gradually filling up. All dry around there though.

[Ian Nexus]

Drums can get quite bad if left, this toyota pickup had been loosing fluid for a while and had a lot of pedal play - the friction material had come off the shoe plates!!

about $100 of parts had it all fixed though

[Tetleysmooth]

Urghhh!! Mine looked nothing like that when I pulled the drums off.

Plenty of lining left, and dry.

[STUNO]

As others have said , leave the rears as they are, they are more than up to the job. If braking performance is less than it should be it is not the fault of the rear brakes. You are losing fluid somewhere other than at the wheels so that is a good indication something is wrong round the servo, or is it one of those cars where the master cyl leaks inside behind the carpet making a huge mess you don't see till too late !

[Tetleysmooth]

As others have said , leave the rears as they are, they are more than up to the job. If braking performance is less than it should be it is not the fault of the rear brakes. You are losing fluid somewhere other than at the wheels so that is a good indication something is wrong round the servo, or is it one of those cars where the master cyl leaks inside behind the carpet making a huge mess you don't see till too late !

 

I pulled the carpet away from the passenger side footwell yesterday (the master cylinder and servo are on the passenger side - yank), and everything was dry.

I've got a couple of weeks off soon, so I'll be able to have a very detailed look.

[Albert Ross]

As for the fluid loss... is it a manual? Does it have a hydraulic clutch release? Is the bottom of the flange joint between engine and box wet? If yes to these, you're going to be asking how to do a clutch soon....

[AXrescuer]

If I were you I'd do as others have said and leave the rear brake setup as is. A better move would be uprated discs, pads and calipers on the front.

[RichL]

I used to work at a Chrysler Jeep dealer back in 2001/2 and drove loads of Voyagers in all specs. The brakes feel woefully indaequate when you first drive them, especially when in LWB "Grand" spec with the 3.3 V6 motor and autobox. I can remember the first time I drove one of them, quite how it stopped at those traffic lights and got round that corner I'll never know. Soon got used to it though, great motors for wafting around in. The later models with discs were very different to the early ones though, so I don't think it would be possible to convert.

[RichardMoss]

It's worth bearing in mind that the vast majority of braking effort is taken by the front discs - so making sure that the pads and discs are in good order is essential. I lived in Spain when running my GV and due to the "variable" driving standards out there often found myself performing emergency braking manoeuvres to avoid cretins in SEATs and it was quite common to feel the ABS kicking in on the rear drums. That tells me that an upgrade to discs at the rear is almost certainly a waste of time.

 

Also, the American habit of fitting the parking brake shoes inside the rear disc bell actually means that you have TWO rear braking systems to maintain and that the parking when you have vehicles with rear discs.

[Tetleysmooth]

As for the fluid loss... is it a manual? Does it have a hydraulic clutch release? Is the bottom of the flange joint between engine and box wet? If yes to these, you're going to be asking how to do a clutch soon....

It's an auto.

Ok the general opinion is to leave them alone and save myself a few bob into the bargain.

I put new pads on the front when I got the bus, maybe they're inferior or just taking a while to bed in.

I'm deffo going to find that leak though.

[Morgan84]

Give the back brakes a good clean out,and make sure the shoes are adjusted correctly ( auto adjusters sometimes pack up on any car ),and check the front pads are free in the housings and everythings nice and free.