Mk3 Golf VR6 - any good????

[Betaboy2.0]

Afternoon all!

 

Can I pick your collective Shite-brains please?

 

A friend of mine needs a decent, practical, reliable, fun, fast, cheap mid-sized hatch to ferry his dogs about in, to prevent wear and tear on his Clio 182Sport.

 

He has found a couple of Golf VR6's on the bay (one auto, one manual) that on first glance would seem to fit the bill. My knowledge of Golf is limited (it doesn't have a Lancia badge on it you see) but I seem to remember that VR6s have been mentioned in this parish before and the general concensus is that they are best avoided?? Am I right?

 

Any info / what to look for / running experiences would be very much appreciated - preferably asap before the auctions finish!

 

Thanks chaps

 

Andy

[MrDuke]

I would avoid Mk3 Golfs in general unless you have a penchant for rotted-out floors. The only thing I can confirm regarding the VR6 is the excessive weight, the laughable fuel consumption, and the lovely, lovely noise.

[scaryoldcortina]

[Cavcraft]

And don't forget seats that you perch on and slide off at the merest whiff of a corner, comedy rust proofing and no apparant redeeming features at all.

[stormee]

The automatic ones are to be avoided! 2.8litre, 174hp in a Golf... sounds like it must be a rocket... It's NOT! Very poor performance at lower revs, it gets better beyond 4000r/m but then high fuel consumption kicks in. And it's not that happy revvy as one might expect as well.

Look for both (!)tensioners and chain replacement, a noisy valvedrive is a sign for wear and an expensive job, both parts and work!

[cobblers]

They sound lovely, go alright (not really a lot better than the gti 16v though) and are about as cheap as they are ever going to be. I reckon they are prime shite if in un-scenebummed condition.

 

If you don't like it or it fails the MOT, there will be a queue of people to buy it off you to rape it for the engine to put in a mk2 golf.

[Betaboy2.0]

Right - Could almost be Italian then??? ................

[Pete-M]

When they're running as they should the VR6 lump is a great engine, although they don't suffer being thrashed from cold or infrequent oil changes. The rest of the Mk3 Golf, however, isn't particularly wonderful.

 

VR6 suspension is in no way 'sporty'. They're soft, tend to wallow and they feel like the shocks must be knackered. Excellent on the motorway, because that's what they were designed to do. They were built to be a small fast car for German businessmen to blast along the motorway in when the Germans went insane on being "green" in the early '90s. Otto the accountant was meant to give up his 3 series, buy a VR6 and it'd give the illusion that he was being environmentally friendly. Which is why 96> VR6s lost the GTi arches etc.

 

The gearchange is pretty crap in 'em. Electrically they're better than a Renault or Fiat most of the time, but a lot of the electrical issues I've discovered with 'em tend to be related to people fitting Thatcham alarms and / or big stereos in the past. Sensors etc tend to be Bosch so no more or less reliable than on anything else really.

 

If it's a 3dr the A pillars weren't up to the job of supporting the huge heavy doors. I've seen a fair few needing repairs around the hinges.

 

Suspension bushes at the front wear pretty quickly. A Mk3 VR6 is no lightweight.

 

I'd have a nice highline 5dr in a dark metallic with leather and aircon. Something like this.

 

 

If you don't expect a sports car, but want something with a bit of poke and engine refinement they're not a bad thing. Utterly pants on fuel though, I've never managed more than 21 in town from one, 30ish on a run is possible if you're gentle. 17 if you're not.

[Bren]

V6 motor also used in Sharan and galaxy - rather quirky in that the timing chains are at the wrong end of the engine, necessitating an engine / box separation to do the chains, and they do wear. Used to see a few V6 galaxies for sale because the chains were noisy - not cheap.

[Morgan84]

I have NEVER seen a rotten MK3 Golf yet,but have seen a few with scruffy wheel arches,and lower bodywork,but thats untreated stone chip damage in most cases. The MK3 Golf is the last of the " you don't need to plug it in to fix it " Golfs,and are quite plesant to drive,and parts not a fortune.The 2.8 VR6 engines I have heard can suffer headgasket failure,and when they go,the heads are usually corroded,meaning big expense,or the big carpark in the sky ! A nice all rounder is a 1.8;nippy,yet still fairly economical

[MrDuke]

I've never managed more than 21 in town from one, 30ish on a run is possible if you're gentle. 17 if you're not.

 

A friend once achieved 8mpg in one, without exceeding any speed limits.

[cms206]

I have NEVER seen a rotten MK3 Golf yet,but have seen a few with scruffy wheel arches,and lower bodywork,but thats untreated stone chip damage in most cases.

 

 

Go big from flickr and look at the sills...

 

Servisair 29-3790 - R212 JPN by cms206, on Flickr

[cobblers]

The (Ex Pillock of these shires) early MK3 Golf GTI my pal bought to engine rape was the most rotten car I've ever seen with an (admittedly only about 8 hours worth) MOT. Jacking on either of the front sill jacking points resulted in the jack moving up with a crunch noise and not a lot of movement from the car! There were no inner sills left at all from memory, and the floorpans were only connected to the sills by that thick rubbery stuff VW spray all over the place which quite handily can cover whacking great rusty holes.

 

 

I bought a tidy looking 1996 MOT failure GTI for the same engine rape reasons, and it had about £15 worth of yellow crayon scribbled all over the underside.

[TimothyClaypole]

Get a Corrado instead.

[KruJoe]

Corrados are phit as phuq, and are overlooked somewhat.

 

 

However that high boot lip is probably not ideal for this application!

[Cavcraft]

I have NEVER seen a rotten MK3 Golf yet,

 

Tomorrow when I'm sober I'll show you pictures. Hand on heart ,I've never seen a non-rusty one.

[Betaphile]

When they're running as they should the VR6 lump is a great engine, although they don't suffer being thrashed from cold or infrequent oil changes. The rest of the Mk3 Golf, however, isn't particularly wonderful.

 

VR6 suspension is in no way 'sporty'. They're soft, tend to wallow and they feel like the shocks must be knackered. Excellent on the motorway, because that's what they were designed to do. They were built to be a small fast car for German businessmen to blast along the motorway in when the Germans went insane on being "green" in the early '90s. Otto the accountant was meant to give up his 3 series, buy a VR6 and it'd give the illusion that he was being environmentally friendly. Which is why 96> VR6s lost the GTi arches etc.

 

The gearchange is pretty crap in 'em. Electrically they're better than a Renault or Fiat most of the time, but a lot of the electrical issues I've discovered with 'em tend to be related to people fitting Thatcham alarms and / or big stereos in the past. Sensors etc tend to be Bosch so no more or less reliable than on anything else really.

 

If it's a 3dr the A pillars weren't up to the job of supporting the huge heavy doors. I've seen a fair few needing repairs around the hinges.

 

Suspension bushes at the front wear pretty quickly. A Mk3 VR6 is no lightweight.

 

I'd have a nice highline 5dr in a dark metallic with leather and aircon. Something like this.

 

 

If you don't expect a sports car, but want something with a bit of poke and engine refinement they're not a bad thing. Utterly pants on fuel though, I've never managed more than 21 in town from one, 30ish on a run is possible if you're gentle. 17 if you're not.

Pretty much this exactly. Which is a pity, since I always liked the idea of a VR6 when they were new and regarded them as a really desirable car. That desire vaporised the first time I drove one. Engine is nice, makes a lovely noise etc, but the chassis is mismatched to what the car was sold as (at least here in Oz) and nothing particularly special. Prevailing feeling of underdamped-ness is the abiding memory I have of the car. I wanted it to be good but I have to admit I was disappointed.

 

On the other hand, if your mate understands it's no sportscar, and the example in question is non-rusty and cheap... you could do worse, I suppose.

[Station]

They're quite tidy looking cars but deffo bottom of the list on cars I'd like to own, for the engine I'd rather have a Corrado. A few people have told me how much they hated their mk3, defying motoring press opinion that vw can't do anything wrong.

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

Buy one of the many cheap and cheerful N-R reg 323i or 328i Tourings instead. Just as worthless as a VR6, and about 9 times better.

[Mr_Bo11ox]

When CAR got one in the early 90's they went to town on dissing it, think they even called it a Lemon on their front cover!

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

Oh they were crap alright. My Mum had three, a 1.8GL which was reasonable, a 2.0 GTI which was just rubbish and a VR6 5 door which was a collection of squeaks and rattles in close formation. All were bought nearly new.

 

As a stop gap until a new Polo diesel arrived, I got her a 100'000 mile K reg Alfa 155 2.0TS which was a vastly higher quality car. It wasn't until the Mark 4 that the Golf became half decent.

[stormee]

Golf III were built during the Lopez-era, same tragedy happened to Opel/Vauxhall, hence the bad quality.

[tatmeister]

I owned a 1993 3-door from 2001 to 2007.

 

Tailgate and passenger door were rusting, I left it for a couple of years, but good second hand parts and paint were reasonable. It passed the MOT first time year on year.

 

I went in with my eyes open, MPG was 18 average around town, absolute best was 32.

 

Mileage was 133k on purchase (FSH), 165k on selling.

 

My best advice would be regular (~3000 mile) oil changes, and let it warm up before giving it some.

 

I also changed the shockers to gas, without lowering it, and tyre choice is essential. I was happy with the results.

 

A Ramair filter gave it a fantatstic sound.

 

The most annoying thing was the regular failure of the electric window mechanisms.....

[Pillock]

Never seen a rusty one?

Tinworm is by far the most common reason to see then in the scrapyard, that and the fact they're in limbo between the OMG Mk2 with all the scene tax, and the Mk4 which is still considered a "new" car and inexplicably expensive for what they are. I bought sporty's 8v GTI for a few hundred, it served me well for a year and then got scrapped by someone else on here (cobblers?) after the MoT man laughed down the phone at me due to some rather large holes in the floor. Sills and floor are main issues, tailgates can rot around the window although this should have been sorted by a recall - they rust due to some sort of electro-chemical reaction with the rear window bonding.

 

Anyway, the VR6. Lovely sound, great in a straight line. It should tell you something that a good friend of mine is on her second, but uses them for drag racing - they'd be awful at roundy-roundy without a serious amount of suspension work. They were only really intended to be a small luxury cruiser though and the 170-odd bhp is delivered all wrong for "spirited" driving, or whatever it is the advertising people call driving like a lunatic. I'd certainly rock one if I could stomach the petrol bills for a 2.8 V6 every day.

 

Electric window regulators are absolute crap but not too hard to swap - keep a look out for 3rd party ones, I got a "compatible" motor for mine which looked nothing like the VAG one but was much better quality. Interiors aren't usually too bad quality, although the seat bolsters will sag like most VWs from that era.

 

They look pretty uninspiring but the price is starting to be in the right area for a shitist so can't really see how you can go wrong if you want a V6. My only thought would be that with 170bhp and a really heavy engine they're not actually that much quicker than a 16v 2.0 (150bhp) and are probably less fun around corners.

[Guest]

I have NEVER seen a rotten MK3 Golf yet,

 

Tomorrow when I'm sober I'll show you pictures. Hand on heart ,I've never seen a non-rusty one.

 

Agreed Billy, this kid's living in another dimension. All of the non scene bummed Mk3s near me have galloping rot on their bootlids, rear wings and door bottoms. If they all rotted away it would be a good thing indeed, because they're all complete shit without a shadow of a doubt. O LOOK I HAF SUSPENDED JUDGEMENT BECOZ I R STUCK TO THE FLOOR WID PINEAPPLE JIZ.

 

Urrrrrrrrrrrrrrgh.

 

Although the VR6 does make a fit noise. But VW even managed to fuck that up by claiming it was the first narrow angle V6 to make production. So Lancia didn't manage it 40 odd years before then? VW then tried to claim that compound super \ turbocharging was their idea too. Clearly the Delta S4, ECV and Nissan March Hyper Turbo never existed either.

 

[Madman Of The People]

When CAR got one in the early 90's they went to town on dissing it, think they even called it a Lemon on their front cover!

 

 

 

 

CAR, April 1994. I have this issue up in my attic. If anyone is interested, I can dig it out and post some of the more embarrassing comments.

[Betaphile]

Although the VR6 does make a fit noise. But VW even managed to fuck that up by claiming it was the first narrow angle V6 to make production. So Lancia didn't manage it 40 odd years before then? VW then tried to claim that compound super \ turbocharging was their idea too. Clearly the Delta S4, ECV and Nissan March Hyper Turbo never existed either.

 

Haven't ever checked out the relevant bit in the engine bay to confirm this, but I was once told that if you know where to look on a VR6 there is a patent licence referencing Lancia. Equally, it could be complete bollocks.

 

The specific bit about the first narrow-angle V6 might be right, though - Lancia's V6s were always conventional 60-degree affairs, it was the fours and eights that were narrow-angle stuff.

[morris_ital_lover]

Whilst not a VR6 my family's experience of the Golf MK3 was much the same as everyone else is pointing to... Not too bad a car but it suffered from visible rust by 2003 (car was bought in 1996) when it was moved on for looking like a feckin shed. The most annoying "feature" was the electric windows, one of the reasons it was shifted on was that it had no aircon and you couldn't open any windows with any guarantee of getting them closed again instead you'd get a ballet as all the windows and eventually the sunroof would join in the shuffle dance for hours upon end. (Oh and VW couldn't fix it as everytime we gave it to them another window would have gone).

[Craig the Princess]

CAR, April 1994. I have this issue up in my attic. If anyone is interested, I can dig it out and post some of the more embarrassing comments.

 

Yes please.

[Morgan84]

Maybe its just a case of my Golf driving customers taking care of them,and the fact I baptise cars in oil perhaps !