Looks as if GM has finally killed off Saab...

[Wilko220]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-16242115

[messerschmitt owner]

a shame but hardly unexpected!

[ashmicro]

Heard it was final on the Today programme. Perhaps the pre-GM ones will now be seen for the good stuff that they are.

[Luxobarges_Are_Us]

Having received 'job-saving' bailouts in the US and a big fat subsidy to keep a factory in Belgium, they now send a probably viable carmaker down the drain. Is the taxpayer not going to pay for the dole and retraining of the Saab employees?

 

Same old story of socialising losses and privatising profits. TWATS.

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

It was inevitable. GM didn't kill Saab - it was a dying breed for years and they kept it going for as long as possible. The GM 900's were good robust cars and anyone that thinks the pre GM stuff was really any better is living in dreamland.

[scooters]

Bloody shame for all the folk who have lost their jobs. Whilst Saab may have been going down the Kharzi for years there was no need for this to happen. Interesting article in FT last year about US companies having an ingrained model that ENORMUZ is best - many examples of this but GM is a classic as is Cable & Wireless - what usually results are large multinational conglomerates which devalue the brands they absorb by standardisation - a slow process which whilst it may make for cheaper better quality products ignores the fact that certain brands are bought for other reasons (Saab is a classic example).

 

Decades off pisspoor management - with the right team in place this company could have survived.

 

What is especially sad is that there was interest from China in saving the brand but GM did not wantr to selll because they did not want to disclose technical secrets to the Chinese...

 

one wonders what secrets...

 

"Hell Bob, we can't let those goddam Chinese get their mitts on the plan for the Insignia!!! They might do somthing daft like make the windows bigger than the roof pillars!"

[morris_ital_lover]

What makes it pretty silly is for all the talk of not wishing to release their "secrets" they've set up shop in China, IIRC. Which means that IDC the local management and engineers will all go their merry way taking with them a much material and practices as they can and sticking two fingers up to GM.

 

It is a shame that one of the most iconic brands is now down the Swanny along with Rover, Morris, Humber, Talbot etc etc.

 

Out of interest has anything actually changed in recent times at GM or are they still making a load of shit cars poorly all around the world?

[dieselnutjob]

went with a mate to buy a 9-3 diesel on Saturday.

nice car

he'll probably be a bit pissed off when he hears this

[Spiny Norman]

No surprise given the events of the last few years but it's a real shame that yet another iconic car company (well. it was before the Yanks got their mitts on it and f**ked it up) goes to the great scrapyard in the sky.

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

What makes it pretty silly is for all the talk of not wishing to release their "secrets" they've set up shop in China, IIRC. Which means that IDC the local management and engineers will all go their merry way taking with them a much material and practices as they can and sticking two fingers up to GM.

 

It is a shame that one of the most iconic brands is now down the Swanny along with Rover, Morris, Humber, Talbot etc etc.

 

Out of interest has anything actually changed in recent times at GM or are they still making a load of shit cars poorly all around the world?

 

GM are just fine. They've got through their crises and are making plenty of decently made and good to drive cars that are selling in huge numbers.

 

Saab was a great make back in the 50's, 60's and 70's but they couldn't (and didn't) make it. Thyey had too small a model range that couldn't make enough profit to sustain themselves. They made the wrong decisions, ran it into the ground and GM came along and tried to save it. But even in 1994 Saab was on it's arse. Audi had slipped neatly into the space where Saab used to be, game over. Now perhaps it can be left to die in peace without becoming another Chinese MG Rover style joke.

[Cavcraft]

In these modern times how difficult would it be for the Chinese (or anyone else really) to buy a brand new car of any type, ship it to the far East and then strip it down to check what's what?

Ok, they'd have to knock tooling up etc but that isn't going to be a problem to a country like China.

[Luxobarges_Are_Us]

They wouldn't even need to do that. Bosch et al have factories there- they can buy all the internal bits from them and only work on the body-in-white.

 

GM are just fine. They've got through their crises and are making plenty of decently made and good to drive cars that are selling in huge numbers

 

They got through their crises using public money. They need to either pay that back (fat chance) or be forced to act in good faith and attempt to safeguard every last job. Perhaps not a lot can be done about the US bailouts, but this game of playing Belgium against Germany against Poland against Sweden has to stop sharpish.

[Cavcraft]

Don't forget to add England into that mix too. GM's old game was telling Belgium/Germany/Ellesmere Port that if they wanted the new model of a range they had to up their game and then GM would decide who got what.

Luckily (at least for the local economy) Ellesmere Port got the new Astras a few years on the bounce, though I'm hearing rumours sales aren't what GM would like and there's the chance of a reduced shift system for now.

[Luxobarges_Are_Us]

True- I'm sure they've creamed off NW "regional development funds" and such...

[marcello-gandini]

I'm not surprised GM didn't encourage the Chinese deal, they have some interests in China like Shanghai GM.

They sold the designs for the old 9-3 and 9-5 to a Chinese company called BAW(s).

[Felly Magic]

It was always going to end in tears, but I always liked the pre GM 900. The other big Swede is in Chinese hands, and odds on the assets of Saab will end up there too.

[AnthonyG]

Not sure it will be resurrected as MG was, Saab Aero own the rights to the brand. The' new' 9-5 belongs to GM and the rights to the old designs including the current 9-3 have been sold off to the company mentioned in a previous post.

 

Remember SAIC/Nanjing couldn't use the name 'Rover' as that was owned by BMW, then Ford, and now Tata, in order to protect the Land Rover brand. 'MG' however, was owned by MG Rover Group and belonged to the highest bidder for the assets.

 

I don't think there is anything of Saab cars left to sell, bar the factory and equipment.

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

I'm hearing rumours sales aren't what GM would like and there's the chance of a reduced shift system for now.

 

They're joking? The new Astra is EVERYWHERE. I don't think car sales are very good for anyone right now but the new Astra comfortably outnumbers the old one. And it's a seriously good car as well.

 

As for using public money - well, whatever as long as it does some good. Labour pissed millions up the wall keeping BL going and what a waste of time that was - they may as well have shut it down in 1977 for all the long term good it did. GM has a much brighter future.

[Guest]

GM are still cunts, and their cars boring and shit. The Chinese would copy their technology no matter how litigious they get, so why deny Saab the chance of a future?

 

So I can't buy a new Saab, but I can buy a new Astra. WOW. Jesus Christ, that very thought fills me with joy.

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

GM are still cunts, and their cars boring and shit. The Chinese would copy their technology no matter how litigious they get, so why deny Saab the chance of a future?

 

So I can't buy a new Saab, but I can buy a new Astra. WOW. Jesus Christ, that very thought fills me with joy.

 

What do you drive at the moment?

[Guest]

GM are still cunts, and their cars boring and shit. The Chinese would copy their technology no matter how litigious they get, so why deny Saab the chance of a future?

 

So I can't buy a new Saab, but I can buy a new Astra. WOW. Jesus Christ, that very thought fills me with joy.

 

What do you drive at the moment?

 

A MK6 VW Golf with leather seats.

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

GM are still cunts, and their cars boring and shit. The Chinese would copy their technology no matter how litigious they get, so why deny Saab the chance of a future?

 

So I can't buy a new Saab, but I can buy a new Astra. WOW. Jesus Christ, that very thought fills me with joy.

 

What do you drive at the moment?

 

A MK6 VW Golf with leather seats.

 

WOW. Jesus Christ, that very thought fills me with joy.

[Guest]

Yeah. I left it at home because it bored me to death, you remember? x

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

Yeah. I left it at home because it bored me to death, you remember? x

[M'coli]

 

They were less successful with their copy of the BMW Mini.

 

Lifan 320

I'm not sure it was the BINI they were copying, it looks like the pre-Landcrab prototype!

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

 

 

 

MINI Chinkman

 

[Wilko220]

Link for SAAB fans: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-16252503

[Futuramic]

 

They were less successful with their copy of the BMW Mini.

 

Lifan 320

I'm not sure it was the BINI they were copying, it looks like the pre-Landcrab prototype!

 

 

That appears to be an enlarged Daihatsu Sirion with added gash factor.

[Mr_Bo11ox]

Heres half an hour's entertainment if anyone wants to read a reasonably detailed report on the death of SAAB, though its a bit 'GCSE business studies'.

 

http://www.business-school.ed.ac.uk/__d ... 9-2011.pdf

[gtd2000]

The Chinese have made direct GM knock offs for about 8 years now...

 

 

The QQ became the center of an industrial copyright and intellectual rights controversy, as General Motors claimed the car was a copy of the Daewoo Matiz (which is marketed outside South Korea as the Chevrolet Spark). GM executives demonstrated the extent of the design duplication, noting for example that the doors of the QQ and those of the Spark are interchangeable [2] without modification.