New shite, new danger - Pug 309 EXORST FALE

[Hertz]

My first car was a 309 (1.6 GR) and it was superb, it also had the large sunroof like yours which was great in the summer. Had an Escort XR3i MK 4 after that and thought I had "arrived". It's was a bag of shite compared to the Pug. The french car love affair continued after that.

[dollywobbler]

It's still pinking quite badly. I retarded the ignition to try and stop it, but this just made it refuse to start and it backfired through the carb at one point. Scary! Tried finding the timing marks again, seeing as I've got a strobe, but can't see anything that looks likely. The carburettor has an anti-tamper thing on the mixture, which was a suspect in my mind. Guess not! Also, the plugs look healthy and giving it a dose of choke doesn't stop the pinking. I'll try and get to the local garage tomorrow or Wednesday and let them have a go at timing it up. Anything else it could be? I've been moving the dizzy tiny amounts and can't believe that such a small change goes from pinking to retarded. Suggests to me that it was timed correctly and was pinking when it should be fine. Maybe I should try and tank of super.

 

Also, the magic sunroof is leaking water. Gah!

 

On the plus side, fitting the rear wiper blade to the front has improved wiper performance and I still love the feel of the thing when driving. So basic, so pure.

[M'coli]

I was thinking that the fuel might be a bit shonky and some super might help, it'll allow you to eliminate the fuel quality from the equation.

[e287yba]

My mum got a 309SR new in 1988, replacing a 1983 VW Golf 1.3CL. It made the Golf feel like a tractor; the 309 was better than the Golf in every way.

 

I've got a 1987 309SR. A cracking car - perhaps a bit anonymous, maybe, but very competent.

[HillmanImp]

I've got a 1987 309SR. A cracking car - perhaps a bit anonymous, maybe, but very competent.

 

What's its number plate E287 YBA? Its not D701 SWL is it? My dad bought that new.

[retrogeezer]

Does it need some of that LRP additive?? That is supposed to stop pinking.

 

I'll get the manual weighed and shoot you a pm Mr DW!

[Minimad5]

Ian,

The timing mark is on the flywheel and can be seen from the small inspection hole on the top of the gearbox (There are lines there to also show degrees)

You will also see a reflector on the crankshaft pulley, this was used to get the idle spot on before timing and then again adjusting it after the timing was done.

I don't know if the flywheel has ever been replaced, but when it was timed up last time it ran spot-on, so if you get MEGGA stuck then i will try help.

 

Sunroof Leaking:

Have you closed the sunroof propperly ? , as this happened to me and i simply didn't push the sunroof 'home' enough.

Other than that i know there is some clear silicone around the head of the screws (top side) of the handle for the sunroof, it might be worth pulling the handle off and cleaning the area up and applying some fresh silicone.

[AlsoMike]

Sunroof Leaking:

Have you closed the sunroof propperly ? , as this happened to me and i simply didn't push the sunroof 'home' enough.

Other than that i know there is some clear silicone around the head of the screws (top side) of the handle for the sunroof, it might be worth pulling the handle off and cleaning the area up and applying some fresh silicone.

 

Totally agree with that last idea, my 309 leaked through the sunroof handle.

[dollywobbler]

Super. Thanks chaps. I can see the slot for timing in the gearbox case, but can't see anything that looks like a timing mark. I will try a tank of super unleaded though, as even the weaker stuff is 97RON, which is the same as 4 star was. The sunroof tip is much appreciated too!

[e287yba]

I've got a 1987 309SR. A cracking car - perhaps a bit anonymous, maybe, but very competent.

 

What's its number plate E287 YBA? Its not D701 SWL is it? My dad bought that new.

 

No, sorry - it's E838 VJO. It can be seen at Tatton Park classic show once a year usually, and at a few other sundry North West shows as well.

[Magnificent Rustbucket]

The 309SR must be quite rare now, I imagine. It wasn't common when it was new.

[TagoraGL]

 

'The reality is even better than the dream.'

 

Odd that they highlight the 309's bland looks as the major selling point.

[Shep Shepherd]

I actually saw a 309 today for the first time in quite a bit, a silver H-reg GL. Judging by the sound of it, it had just been started from cold or was suffering from carburettor issues.

[Pete-M]

Judging by the sound of it, it had just been started from cold or was suffering from carburettor issues.

 

That's normal. Peugeots and carbs are a bad combination...

[Shep Shepherd]

Judging by the sound of it, it had just been started from cold or was suffering from carburettor issues.

 

That's normal. Peugeots and carbs are a bad combination...

 

I know. Took me straight back to the mid-1990s, it did!

[e287yba]

 

'The reality is even better than the dream.'

 

Odd that they highlight the 309's bland looks as the major selling point.

 

Not as good as the UK ad (at launchtime I suspect) where it shows 567.9 miles flipping over to 568.0 on the trip (the maximum range as per the launch pack bumph) and the (knackered-looking) driver purses his lips as he glances at the trip meter...

 

Regardless, the few 309s I see around nowadays are diesels - no petrols at all. Can always get a wave off the driver of one of 'em . Think there's a 205 lives in the village too but he's an ignorant sod.

 

EDIT: Must laugh at comments elsewhere on this thread about Peugeots and Carbs... This bugger has tried to kill me at junctions or just after hot restarts generally on a daily basis in the past (fuel vaporisation) but - on the bright side - keeps running for ever in traffic (when Montegos stop DEAD from the same issue) and ALL the piss-poor carburation problems can be driven around with a bit of patience...

 

I love it really !

[dollywobbler]

I must admit, PSA petrol engines were not their finest during the 1980s, as Scooters is finding out I think.

 

Struggled to get it started again today. Seemed to catch with bugger all choke, and then needed more to run. One day, I'll get the starting procedure right. All manual choke cars tend to be different, even from the same manufacturer some times. Like Scooters, I seem to get bad misfiring under load at lower revs. I shall be trying some fancy fuel when I next fill up. Only problem is this thing doesn't seem to be very thirsty at all. Either that or the tank is about 200 litres.

 

One oddity is the temp gauge. It rises up to 1/4 as soon as you turn the ignition on. In use, it rises a little more than that (haven't had chance for any traffic jam testing yet).

[Father Ted]

Only problem is this thing doesn't seem to be very thirsty at all. Either that or the tank is about 200 litres.

 

 

Or the fuel gauge is borked - I had a ZX that used to do 400 miles before the gauge left full, then it went to half, then it stopped because you had run out of fuel.

[dollywobbler]

If I'd driven further in it, I'd be concerned Ted. You're probably right not to trust French electrics though!

[Minimad5]

I can safely say that the fuel gauge works 100% !

 

As for starting - it used to fire straight up, as it did when we handed keys over and set-off.

 

When i've fitted this master cylinder and got insurance stuff through, i shall head up and help you out.

 

If for now you set the timing by ear (As i don't know if the flywheel has been off) Then go from there.

If i remember rightly ... Move the Dizzy clockwise a tiny amount and the revs should pick up (Ensure choke is off) lock everything up *14mm spanner* and go for a little drive and keep adjusting it till you're happy with the feel and the way it starts and drives - Obviously no pinking.

 

Don't want to sound daft, but you are driving it like a french man ??

As you know it doesn't have bags of torque, so the rev range does need to be used.

 

 

Hope that doesn't come across as me trying to teach you how to suck eggs so to speak, just from experience and so on

[messerschmitt owner]

in theory (according to the label on my screen) - and it works for my 1.6 BX!

 

to start from cold - it should start without touching the accelerator at all, then I give it some revs once it is going to prevent it stalling.

 

 

Once it has started, the label recommends foot to floor (no pumping) and then let it start before removing foot from accelerator - works like this once it has started and is even verging on being warm.

 

The label also recommends that you do not pump the accelerator pedal at all and that you may have to turn the starter for more than 10 seconds - this is supposedly normal.

[dollywobbler]

10 seconds? I shall give that a go next time...

 

Mark - don't worry about heading over here! I shall continue my experimentation as time allows. I'd meddled with the timing before we even left Bala (it was pinking really badly) so I suspect most of the issues come from that. You're wrong though. It has loads of torque! Clearly you've never sampled the 29lb/ft of torque that a 2CV offers...

 

When I put the timing back roughly where it was when we did handover, it started instantly with choke and no throttle. Retarded enough to not pink, it really isn't keen on starting. Bring back steering wheel mounted ignition timing controls I say!

 

I'm more frustrated that I haven't had that much chance to put any miles on the Pug yet. Might be going to Birmingham next week though, so that might be about to change. I really do need to seal those sunroof screws though...

[barefoot]

Best of luck finding a garage that can fix / has ever heard of a carburettor.

 

I'd just like to take this opportunity to recommend Shenpar in Melbourne, Derbyshire - turned my fluffing wanky twin dual dellorto 40 beetle into a monster & charged me nothing because it was only a "natts" out!

 

My mum got a 309SR new in 1988, replacing a 1983 VW Golf 1.3CL. It made the Golf feel like a tractor

 

I think that the 309SR was the GTi of its day whereas the 1.3CL was not.

 

... I will try a tank of super unleaded though, as even the weaker stuff is 97RON, which is the same as 4 star was....

 

no it's not, see if you can find a garage that still sells proper 4 star petrol, there are still some about.

I use the Cottage garage near Swarkstone, Derbyshire.

Its hellish expensive but will convince you that not all RONs are the same.

If proper 4 star works, a bit of a retard & some additive may be in order - if you are prepared to pay for a tankfull, you may well be astonished.

Back to my stupidly fast beetle for a moment, it is set up to run on this stuff & it flies - out accelerating a Corrado until it hit its limiter at 93mph,

It will function on Superunleaded, but runs on, fluffs & runs on some more on boggo unleaded.

A tankfull will hurt you financially, but may show where your problems lie.

[dollywobbler]

I can only assume the Peugeot is not happy to have crossed the border. It's been squealing like a stuck pig for most of today - alternator belt is adjusted as far as it'll go, so I went to Halfrauds to get a new belt and some wiper blades. I can now have a wiper happy! Alternator belt still to be fitted, but it's amazing how much attention a squealing belt generates these days...

 

Not quite as much as failed exhaust though! I thought it was starting to sound a bit rorty, but then it sounded a LOT rorty. Pulled over, middle pipe is no longer connected to back box. Great. Not a lot I can do as I had no tools with me. Oh well. It's only 12 miles home. We'll just have to live with the noise.

 

2 miles in and scraping can be heard. The back box is trying to fall off now. Pulled it off, stashed it inside the car. Middle pipe is now hanging down entirely unsupported apart from where it's clamped up front. There's about an inch of ground clearance and 10 miles to go. Here goes...

 

I get caught out by a few compressions (where downhill turns into uphill) which presumably created sparks judging by the noise. We do make it back home though, very, very noisily. I guess I will not be using the Peugeot for a trip to Birmingham tomorrow then. At least it failed now rather than when I was on my way to a funeral...

[messerschmitt owner]

Ian

 

I'd be writing a snotty letter to the last owner demanding your money/car back.

 

It's obviously not a safe car and should be taken off the road now - and you reimbursed for the dosh and cost of repair.

 

Oh - if its engine fails - demand Peugeot fix it under warranty!

 

lololololol

 

The BX's exhaust did the same on the way back from Exeter - you need to eat some beans tonight and get two exhaust clamps ...

[Minimad5]

Ian

 

I'd be writing a snotty letter to the last owner demanding your money/car back.

 

It's obviously not a safe car and should be taken off the road now - and you reimbursed for the dosh and cost of repair.

 

I hope thats a joke

[messerschmitt owner]

Ian

 

I'd be writing a snotty letter to the last owner demanding your money/car back.

 

It's obviously not a safe car and should be taken off the road now - and you reimbursed for the dosh and cost of repair.

 

I hope thats a joke

moi, make a joke about something so serious!

 

 

 

it is Christmas though so I'll let you off...

[dollywobbler]

Mark - I'm not entirely sure how to take that comment either. Needless to say, legal letters will not be forthcoming! T'is purely the joy of Autoshite, though 'Donkey' is going to have to sit in disgrace for a bit until I can get on it.

[messerschmitt owner]

Mark - I'm not entirely sure how to take that comment either. Needless to say, legal letters will not be forthcoming! T'is purely the joy of Autoshite, though 'Donkey' is going to have to sit in disgrace for a bit until I can get on it.

it's a joke - honest, guv!

A flippant comment designed to make light of the situation.

 

Ian, have you had your baked beans yet? When my BX exhaust went 100 miles from home, I jacked the suspension up a bit - and drove on home, sounding like a tractor with the front pipe dragging half an inch off the deck.

 

Sorted next day with beans can, and ready to get a new exhaust in the new year.

 

Peace and love to you both.

 

xxxxxx

[Skizzer]

Sorted next day with beans can, and ready to get a new exhaust in the new year.

I did this on a Metro once, with a can of Lilt and some mastic. Traded it in a month later with the can still there and got £200 over Parker's top trade-in price from a Ford dealer against a breadvan Polo Metro had been pranged and jigged as well.

 

Mind you, that's the one and only time I traded a car in to a dealer without having to get the Vaseline out. I R negotiator fail

 

Edited to add: I got the joke MO. It made me chuckle.