Insurance Insanity.

[Pete-M]

Mate of mine, he's a 25 yr old A level maths teacher. Sensible bloke. Owns his own house, doing quite well for himself.

 

He's taking driving lessons now, and I've spent most of today helping him look for a first car that ain't gonna cripple him with insurance. Been going through quotes online, all the usual suspects, the singing bloke with the tashe, the large animal, the meerkat etc.

 

Cheapest quote we've found all day for him, car in secure parking all day and in a secure private compound at night (with security) is £2500 TP,F+T, and that would be driving a 900cc Cinquecento, which he ain't gonna be doing.

 

Tried all sorts of different vehicles ranging from old Marinas to MX-5s to Mondeos. Tried Cinquecentos, 104s, 106s, 205/6/7/8s, Kas, Pandas, Fiestas, Focuses, Mazdas, all kinds. Nothing comes in at anywhere near sensible money. Even if he names his mum as a second driver (she's also a teacher) it's still mental money, £2200+. Tried limited mileages, huge excesses, classics, everything. Still insane money. Googled a list of 'cheapest cars to insure' from Adrian Flux and their recommendation - an old Beetle still hit £2k.

 

Even accounting for the massive loading Liverpool gets from insurance companies, that's still a huge chunk of money to place on a compulsory bet.

 

Whilst searching, an ad came on telly for Peugeots "Just add fuel" thing where you lease a Pug 207 for £200 a month for three years and get free insurance, servicing, road tax, breakdown cover and the option to just give it back after three years. Limited mileage on it, but it's still cheaper than insuring a Fiesta would be going by todays online searchings.

 

Unfortunately, to qualify you must have been driving for a year, so it's no use for him..

 

So, how the hell is he meant to get on the road? Spend £3000 a year on insurance? That seems more than a bit steep for a 25 yr old, even as a first time driver.

[Angrydicky]

Austin A35 or Citroen 2CV FTW. Insurance around the £500 mark through FJ (have to be an Owners Club member though).

 

It was the only way I could afford to get on the road. 2k seems ludicrous, Admiral and Elephant are meant to be cheapish for first time drivers.

 

In fact, thinking about it you have to be 25 to have classic insurance from RH, and that is talking mega-cheap.

[bones96]

i passed my test 3 years ago and started of with a m reg nissan sunny the insurance for that was £1172 a year third party and i was 44 when i passed ffs how do they expect youngsters to get insured there should be a limit on the amount they charge

[Mr Lobster]

I heard a thing on Radio 4 t'other day about how insurance has gone up, and how it has gone up massively for anyone who is seen as higher risk. I guess your man being relatively young and with little experience, plus being in Liverpool is considered to be enormously high risk.

 

I noticed that all the cars in the Peugeot offer look like the sort of stuff thats not that easy to retail in the first place. And also, as a little experiment put my current motoring costs for the SEAT in to see how it compares....

 

 

Ha! Take that Peugeot. I'll keep the £250 a month ta and I don't fancy a 3008 at all either.

[Pete-M]

I've just done a couple of quotes for me to drive various cars. I'm 40 in a few weeks, a fleet manager for a company, no points, no convictions, one crash two years ago. No NCB as I have a trade policy and have done for years. Car parked in a garage overnight in a decent suburb of Liverpool.

 

'95 Mondeo 1.8 Ghia saloon, value £500, TP,F+T £1250.

'94 Jaguar XJR auto, Value £2k, TF,F+T £1928.

 

That's mental money. Now, no doubt I could knock a fair chunk off that with 'as earned' NCB, but still. £1250 for a Mondeo? Fuck off. I'll keep my traders policy, TYVM.

 

Oh, and this is the Peugeot thing in comparison to my XJR outgoings a month (not including fuel, obviously).

 

[warren t claim]

Well Pete, the thing to remember is that when we were young insurance companies used the old 9 group system. Even then I thought I was being shafted paying £700 a year to cover an XR3i (group 5 IIRC), mind you I was 19 with a few points. The only car that every company resused point blank to insure me on was a Sunbeam Lotus, even the well shagged RS1800 I was offered for £350 was insurable.

 

Bike insurance was always far easier. No questions asked other than what size engine. The local broker was known as having "The Only Tagora In The Village".

[Father Ted]

1.0 K11 Micra Vs 1.0 107

[Station]

I was nailed up the anus with a scary 1k+ on a shitty old Merc I was getting a quote on. I generally get good quotes of around 400 quid on those rubbish markup sites, a mk3 Supra Turbo was 600 quid with the lowest possible level of cover and 2000 quid excess. I think they've let the whole MANDATORY TO HAVE INSURANCE IF YOU OWN A CAR thing go to their heads, the cost of it now solely outweighs the benefits of owning a car. It's just a free for all with the cost.

The insurance companies charge this, because we will pay it, just like the petrol - of which I paid 126.9 per litre of up here. Rubbish country.

[Pete-M]

Problem for the insurance companies is the whiplash claims, they reckon that they're paying more out in injury claims than they receive in premiums.

 

I don't doubt it. The number of people claiming out there for injuries for the slightest little tap is astonishing and now the insurance companies are having to get it back in premiums. Can't blame them for that really. They're in it to make money after all.

 

Average injury claim is something like £2k nowadays, and there are some 'unlucky' souls out there who're in crashes twice a year....

[Station]

Wouldn't it be a good idea to have a separate policy for glass-back compo nobheads? There's surely a make a claim advert between every set of programmes on ITV3.

[Pete-M]

Wouldn't it be a good idea to have a separate policy for glass-back compo nobheads?

 

You may be on to something there...

[stephend]

ouch, i paid about 2.5k to insure my MG when i was 18, then when i got a 205 that was still about 8-900 quid. TPFT

 

My self and the wife pay approx 350 quid fully comp, protected ncb, and 3 claims in the last 7 months I'm 26 been driving since i was 17.

 

I had a quote on a herald and it came back at 135 quid for the year!

 

stephend

[warren t claim]

Problem for the insurance companies is the whiplash claims, they reckon that they're paying more out in injury claims than they receive in premiums.

 

I don't doubt it. The number of people claiming out there for injuries for the slightest little tap is astonishing and now the insurance companies are having to get it back in premiums. Can't blame them for that really. They're in it to make money after all.

 

Average injury claim is something like £2k nowadays, and there are some 'unlucky' souls out there who're in crashes twice a year....

 

Plus £1500 in solicitors fees and a couple of grand for a car on credit hire.

 

Hit a private hire car and you insurance gets stung for something like £100 a day for a replacment vehicle.

[dieselnutjob]

I'm sure I paid something like £600 or £700 per year back in 1992 when I graduated and got my first job.

With inflation would that be near equivalent to £2000 today?

 

My sister studied in Liverpool and could not get insurance. I think in the end she used our parents address on the basis that she only lived in Liverpool "temporarily" whist studying.

[Pete-M]

I paid £368 I think it was to insure a Cortina back in '88. I thought that was pretty steep at the time.

[dieselnutjob]

I'm sure I paid something like £600 or £700 per year back in 1992 when I graduated and got my first job.

With inflation would that be near equivalent to £2000 today?

 

Apparently the answer is "NO". It's maybe a grand in today's money.

see http://www.bankofengland.co.uk/educatio ... /index.htm

[cms206]

22 at the time, no NCB (no ownership history due to having driven Motability cars for my dear old ma'), 3pts for speeding, Cavalier 2.0SRi in the centre of shithole of a town but kept in a driveway at night, used for Social, Domestic, Pleasure and Commuting.

 

Fully comp, in summer 2009... £797, with £100 compulsory excess. This year it was £781 with one year's NCB. Buggered if I know how I managed it, because even Volvo 240s are well over a grand for me to insure...

[CIH]

My Gp16 Silvia was approx £300 on a classic policy, my gp5 1.6 bluebird £55 a month on a "normal" policy. I had no idea how that worked.

[VWPowered]

Mk1 Golf 1.1 C (UK 10 years ago) 1200notes TPFT

Scirocco Mk2 Scala (2.5k TPFT, a golf gti would of been cheaper)

 

mon assurance francais

 

Mk2 Polo MODDED 1.3 no no claims, 200euros

Honda limited mileage classic policy 93euros

Renault 21 was 600 a year

got the Passat (newer, slightly smaller lump) 250euros a year

[Rusty Pelican]

£385 on a 86 318i Beemer , im 46 FFS , Fully comp with three points , robbin bastards

[Richard]

A few months ago I pretended my son was 17 and entered his details on some insurance quote websites to see what kind of quotes he would get. I had him almost down to three figures for a Fiat 126/Panda 750 or a 2CV and the more mainstream choices were around the £2k mark I think. There must be a massive loading for Liverpool.

[Pete-M]

There must be a massive loading for Liverpool.

 

Yup, if memory serves me right, it's close to 100%.

[peter9000uk]

Got to be the area, Pete

 

Son passed his test in June this year, 22 yo, 1.4CL Polo 1167.00 fully comp with 250 excess. Got his mum as a named driver which knocked a couple of hundred of the price.

 

A couple of years ago I had an Abbot Racing tweaked 9000 turbo insured thru the owners club for 186 fully comp. My current diesel C5 costs nearly double that at the moment. Go figure

[jaycey001]

try looking for "pay as you go" policys. i used to be on one when i first started driving (they are expensive BUT you only pay for what you use and you still earn NCD

Direct line used to do one but cancelled it. somone did buy the contract tho and i have seen them advertising. a small black box is installed in your car you pay per mile and the fee is based on peak and off peak times. my first car was a mazda 323 1.8 and i payed an average of £600 a year based on 3000 miles. worth a look!!

 

I dont know if anyone else has had the same but my insurance has increased every year even though i have 4 year ncd, 4 year experiance and no points... IT makes me so angry that im paying for all the uninsured drivers. no wonder there are so many of them with the costs of insurance!!

 

The australian system automaticaly gives you third party insurance with your tax disk (that seems sensible to me!! )

 

moan over

 

James

[aled]

i ahve a 52 plate 1.4 carolla with me and the wife to drive - fully comp, i have been driving 30 years but my wife has only been driving 2 years, direct line £140.

 

then i have the imp, the hillman husky, singer chamois, and the celica 2.0 on a classic policy- unlimited milage- me and the wife to drive £127. peter d james insurance. worth a try as cheaper than footman james.

 

i would try and get something small and late 80s early 90s on a classic policy and peter d james is worth a try.

my nephew is selling a mk 1 fiesta that needs a bit of work.

[Cavcraft]

This worries me deeply. My lad is having lessons and has his heart set on a Corsa C 1.0* and I've offered to match every quid he saves. Trouble is (and I've tried telling him) he's going to get royally turned over come insurance time.

Ironically when he's 18 he's due some compensation** which will cough towards some of his insurance, but assuming he passes his test in the next three months or so he probably won't be able to afford to get a car because of the insurance. It's no wonder people don't bother with insurance, it really must be cheaper to wing it and pay the fine if you get caught. Trouble is this leads to cars not being registered in the owner's name, wankers involved in accidents driving away and police chases.

 

I'd fucking to love to see Direct Liars (and all the others) post their gross profits then be taken to the cleaners by some sort of ombudsman like the bank charges malarkey.

 

I'm on trade insurance too Pete and like yourself have no plans to change this anytime soon. Paying about £450 a year, gone up seventy odd quid despite no claims/accidents/convictions.

Oh, and as regarding postcodes our insurance went up a few years ago when they decided Birkenhead, Ellesmere Port and surrounding areas should not be an 'L' anymore but a 'CH'.

That's the insurance companies taking the piss again in my opinion, as there is sure to be areas of Liverpool, Birkenhead etc which are low crime rate decent areas.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

*Debate on their shitness not required.

**Debate on compo not required.

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

I've just PM'd PeteM, but this is worth a go for anyone who thinks they're paying too much. yes, insurance is getting more expensive but the bigger brokers are taking the piss with their cuts.

 

A mate of mine runs a small broker called Need To Insure. They only have a small office, three staff and that's it. They've done me well for a few years - £260 comp for a '93 318iS Coupe, is pretty good, even for a 41 year old fart like me.

 

01623 720081 and no, I don't get a kick back.

[Lord Sterling]

I think I paid about £1500 for a Rover 827 manual a few years back, 24 years old, no 'no claims' and parked in a secure covered parking at work (As I worked nights, car parked inside factory)

 

Now a few years later, I'd be looking to pay more than that even with a few years no-claims. I've also noticed they've stopped the 'drive any other vehicle' for second drivers.

 

When one of my past classic insurance policies came to an end, I was told they 'could not offer' the same policy anymore due to thier own "changes" and tried to sell me normal fully comp for £2000+ after I had been paying £500 a year for the classic. Twats.

 

One of my current policies is ending, I didnt have enough money at the time which I informed them about and told them when I could pay, they stated because of this I would be charged double. I told them to fuck off.

 

Insurance is going to get ever harder to get, become more expensive and have more restrictions.

[Barry Cade]

I was £1700 a year for a BX GTi back in 1993- I was 19, insured by HyPerformance, the only company that would touch me. My 2 Mercs are about £180 a year each now, fully comp with 2 drivers.Just had to add £120 on the 200E for business use. My 1100CC bike is £89 a year... Merc insurance is going up due to the amount of them getting pinched for export-as both mine have risen this year.

 

The lads I teach are all dreaming of getting their licence and getting their first car- they come in with "Fast Car" and Max power" and talk of Imprezas and Evo's.. little do they know the realities of it all

[Cavcraft]

Get your boots on son, you're walking:

 

Elephant: £7,568.50

 

Quotezone: Best? 'Just' £4471.56

 

Worst? £10, 306

 

For a fucking 2001 Corsa 1.0

 

*Edit: we have a new winner. This is now quoted for a 1998 Corsa 1.0 five door. Stand up 'The Green Insurance Company' as a mere fucking £13,756.58 is a bargain. I assume they're called 'Green' because they never have to use any paper as no fucker can afford their insurance.

I'd rather set fire to every fucking forest in Britain and wash the streets with aviation fuel than pay that, thieving bastards.