Weird machining/lathe question

[MrDuke]

It's been many many moons since I messed about in the machine shop at college, so apologies if this sounds really stupid.

 

I've just had a new track rod through the post for the Proton, and yet again it's the wrong one. Last time it was too long, whereas this one is the right length but the 'inner' end is too wide to screw into the rack arm. It took me an hour of searching online to find this one, and I've totally lost my patience with it, so if it can't be made to fit, I'll probably make with the petrol and matches.

 

Is there any way to turn down the width (and re-cut the thread obviously) on the end, bearing in mind that there's over a foot of rod the other side of the joint? The way I'm remembering it, you'd have to clamp the 'outer' end in the chuck - there is a conical indent on the 'inner' end to locate a shaft - but surely the joint would still be too wobbly to machine it accurately? Or are there 'floating' chuck setups so you can clamp it anywhere along the length?

 

By way of premature and frankly presumptuous thanks, here's a picture of something:

 

[DSdriver]

Erm inverse logic, would it be easier to drill out the rack arm and tap a new thread in that?

Nice piccy by the way.

[Tamworthbay]

A four jaw chuck would do it as long as the bit you have fits through the bore and isn't too long or it will flail about. But centreing on one can be a pain until you get the knack.

[jakebullet]

Not sure turning down is a good plan. Won't you destroy any hardness doing it, and your new thread be weak / easily destroyed?

[derskine]

Drilling out the rack arm is likely to weaken it by thinning the walls of it. Since the TRE is presumably a solid cast item then it would certainly be better to turn that down.

[MrDuke]

Erm inverse logic, would it be easier to drill out the rack arm and tap a new thread in that?

Nice piccy by the way.

 

It would be possible, but then the metal would be worryingly thin. 

 

 

A four jaw chuck would do it as long as the bit you have fits through the bore and isn't too long or it will flail about. But centreing on one can be a pain until you get the knack.

 

Well, whoever I take it to should have the knack... I won't be doing it myself, I just don't want to look a complete twat when I walk in somewhere and ask them to do it!

 

 

Not sure turning down is a good plan. Won't you destroy any hardness doing it, and your new thread be weak / easily destroyed?

 

If that's the case, I could just ask them to heat-treat the thread after they've turned it? 

[MrDuke]

Drilling out the rack arm is likely to weaken it by thinning the walls of it. Since the TRE is presumably a solid cast item then it would certainly be better to turn that down.

 

Yep - the rod is solid so no problem there.

[vaughant]

You(they) could also clamp the rod on the threaded end as its circular and the threads are to be dealt with anyway, turn down a section of the square/odd cast shaped end to fit in the chuck jaws( probably about an inch max) reverse it around and do as they please with the threaded end.

4 jaw chuck sounds good but obvs any casting points could throw it out when trying to center it up with a dti.

There's a few ways they can do it, should be pips.

[Uncle Jimmy]

Weld a temporary piece on that can go in the chuck, when done machining chop off.

[buckbuckbuckie]

Take both bits to any place that has a decent lathe and say make this screw in that.

 

It wouldn't take very long at all for anyone competent but it is a bit of a faff for the money you are probably expecting to pay

[Tamworthbay]

It won't be a fiver job though unless you have a mate who can do it.

[Uncle Jimmy]

Not sure turning down is a good plan. Won't you destroy any hardness doing it, and your new thread be weak / easily destroyed?

I may be wrong but I don't imagine parts of this sort will be heat treated nowadays; I'd imagine they are homogeneous and drop forgings made from chrome molybdenum steel or somesuch.

Reminds me of the 'Casenit' my old man had in a tin in the garage, he told me how it worked and I thought he was pulling my leg.

[MrDuke]

Take both bits to any place that has a decent lathe and say make this screw in that.

 

It wouldn't take very long at all for anyone competent but it is a bit of a faff for the money you are probably expecting to pay

 

It won't be a fiver job though unless you have a mate who can do it.

 

Yeah, that's the frustrating thing - the old track rod is totally fubar'd and can't be refitted to the car, so a new part is the only option. I actually thought I'd got lucky this time, as the seller listed all the dimensions on the ad, including both thread diameters (at least they got the other one right).

[Timewaster]

I understand you have scoured the internet for this, but could a proper good old fashioned motor factor find something closer?

We used to have Quinton Hazel and AP catalogues as thick as phone books which had all the dimensions and thread sizes for all the track rod ends and ball joints. It was a painstaking task but we could usually find what people needed.

I remember one small agricultural firm built some sort of contraption that had Talbot Horizon ball joints.

Parts for bitsa kit cars and things were always a challenge.

 

A Proton part probably fits a Mitsubishi or maybe a Dutch Volvo.

 

Of course most factors nowadays are staffed on minimum wage and "computer says no" is the likely response.

[MrDuke]

Worth a try, if I could find one. The 'local' Unipart (20 miles away) were quite good for leafing through gigantic catalogues until they found the right part, but I don't rate my chances now they're wearing ECP shirts. There is a Mitsi dealer on the island, but I doubt they'd have 1st-gen Lancers on file still. I know Fatha_Duke has a decent indy factors near him, so I might ask him to go in and inquire for me.

[chodweaver]

Scouring my equally patchy (and distant) school metalwork shop memories, I think the die could go in the chuck and the workpiece only needs to be clamped so that it is square on to the tool. (This is after the o/d has been turned down to the right size ready for the thread that you need to be cut into it.) Or I could be dreaming of engineering that does not exist. Find a local machine shop and ask their advice - I've always been pleasantly surprised at how much effort these guys will put in for beer money.

 

Nice pic. Want.

[buckbuckbuckie]

Yeah, that's the frustrating thing - the old track rod is totally fubar'd and can't be refitted to the car, so a new part is the only option. I actually thought I'd got lucky this time, as the seller listed all the dimensions on the ad, including both thread diameters (at least they got the other one right).

 

 

Take the new wrong part and the existing part that you need it to screw into with you

[hpi_matrix]

I go to Malaysia in the Summer, if you can hold on and give me some details I can probably get you a genuine one.

[overrun]

I go to Malaysia in the Summer, if you can hold on and give me some details I can probably get you a genuine one.

 

This place etc

[MrDuke]

I go to Malaysia in the Summer, if you can hold on and give me some details I can probably get you a genuine one.

 

 

Unfortunately if the car's not gone in the next month or so, I'll be sleeping in it. Obviously that would be fine if it was a hatch with folding seats, but it's a saloon.

 

Thanks for the offer though!

[PhillipM]

Have you got some rough dimensions and thread sizes, etc?
 I can probably custom make you one if I have a suitable joint hanging around.

[MrDuke]

That's very kind of you, PM on its way.

[tooSavvy]

There is a guy on Proton Owners Club has a container full of NOS....

 

Say 'TS sent you' [waited a lifetime to say that!]

 

 

TS

[Jikovron]

I got some new OEM trackrods for iirc a tennerish each from a man of mystery who specialises in these very comprehensively, he says he has loads of good used ones and can still pick them up new he trades on ebay as the username protobishi_@_gmail_co_uk,probably the same gent i think as TS is pointing towards

[tooSavvy]

I got some new OEM trackrods for iirc a tennerish each from a man of mystery who specialises in these very comprehensively, he says he has loads of good used ones and can still pick them up new he trades on ebay as the username protobishi_@_gmail_co_uk,probably the same gent i think as TS is pointing towards

 

se325919 is the guys POC handle.. ??

 

TS

[MrDuke]

Cool, I'll try and message the eBay guy, looks like he's breaking them so might have a used one.