Yank poor starting, fixed it!

[Bren]

I had a bastard of a job getting my SD1 to run after removing the dizzy to prime the oil pump.

 

Incorrect timing, an under par battery and wet plugs would'nt let it start.

[hauserplenty]

Try disconnecting the vacuum line from the distributor. Plug it with a golf tee, and see if it makes any difference. If it's ignition related, the distributor or parts of it could be at fault. The centrifugal weights can cause this, if they're seized. It could also be time to look under the timing chain cover...if it has stretched or jumped, nothing else you do will work.

Also try putting a mirror over the carb, so you can see the fuel stream. Then slowly move the throttle all the way back. If you don't see a stream of fuel, it could be the accelerator pump. No throttle response, you see.

Good thing I'm not a betting man.

[danthecapriman]

I've tried plugging dizzy vac line, no change.

I've ordered a new condenser, cheap enough and easy to change! Odd though that I do have a nice blue spark. Possible that spark isn't strong enough or breaks down under load? Or the condensers intermittent and it worked when I checked it?

It does occasionally burb and backfire a bit (after a lot of cranking) but not a lot.

[alf892]

This..........

 

Kept trying and eventually it would fire but not run for more than a few seconds. Kept trying and now it will fire and run but the starting is very hit or miss, sometimes it will sometimes it won't.

Once it starts there is no throttle response, and idle is very rough. It splutters and misses and eventually just stalls. If it's running and the throttle is used, it won't rev and often will instead cause the engine to stall.

 

 

Really points to fuel but with condenser as 'worth a try'

[Bren]

Sounds like fuel/supply problem.

[Asimo]

Condensers (and coils) can fail so as to give a spark on a plug in free air but not a spark man enough to run an engine.

They can also fail so as to allow the engine to start and tickover but as soon as the cylinder pressure increases when the throttle is opened the spark dies and the engine with it. 

This is because a much higher voltage is required to spark in the higher pressure which in turn asks more of the coil and the condenser.

[steve_earwig]

Sounds like fuel/supply problem.

I was going to suggest a weak fuel pump but I don't even know if it's mechanical or electric and I didn't want to appear foolish. Well fuck, when did that ever stop me? Fuel pump hasn't got enough suck to pull fuel all the way from the tank but can somewhat from a, er, can because it's closer.

[Taff]

Condensers (and coils) can fail so as to give a spark on a plug in free air but not a spark man enough to run an engine.

They can also fail so as to allow the engine to start and tickover but as soon as the cylinder pressure increases when the throttle is opened the spark dies and the engine with it. 

This is because a much higher voltage is required to spark in the higher pressure which in turn asks more of the coil and the condenser.

 

For the sake of a few quid, new condenser. I would suggest a timing check but I think it ha ran (and well) previously, so unless you (or someone who hates you - Mrs Dancapriman for instance) has moved the distributor, leave it be.

 

Leave the vac disconnected, it's one less thing to think about. Like I said earlier, mate, imagine it was on the deck and you were starting from scratch.

 

As for fuelling, don't forget that too much petrol can cause as many problems as not enough petrol. The Galaxie has an over-fuelling problem at the moment, took me a while to find it

[oldcars]

I don't know much at all but on the Reliant i had starting issues and bogging down, it was due to the mixture being far to lean, could this be the issue?

[danthecapriman]

Thanks again for the help.

 

The fuel pump is mechanical, it looks fairly recent and I think it was replaced before the car came over to the UK. Can easily test it though, just to see.

 

The timing hasn't been touched since I adjusted it all last year with the timing light. And it has run well as is recently. I don't want to touch it incase it introduces another problem. There's a lot of people who hate me, but nobody has access to the car but me!!

 

Mixture, is a possibility but it has run perfectly as it is currently set. This was set with a gas analyser. I've tried altering it both ways with little if any difference.

 

The condenser is on it's way (I had to order one in) so should have it by the weekend to try. Fingers crossed it's the problem. A little annoying having to get one only for me to replace it all with electronic kit soon but if it gets it running it's a small price to pay!

It does seem like occasionally it's man enough to make a feeble attempt to go, but only just. Once any load is asked of it, it just can't cope and dies.

[oldcars]

Thanks again for the help.

 

The fuel pump is mechanical, it looks fairly recent and I think it was replaced before the car came over to the UK. Can easily test it though, just to see.

 

The timing hasn't been touched since I adjusted it all last year with the timing light. And it has run well as is recently. I don't want to touch it incase it introduces another problem. There's a lot of people who hate me, but nobody has access to the car but me!!

 

Mixture, is a possibility but it has run perfectly as it is currently set. This was set with a gas analyser. I've tried altering it both ways with little if any difference.

 

The condenser is on it's way (I had to order one in) so should have it by the weekend to try. Fingers crossed it's the problem. A little annoying having to get one only for me to replace it all with electronic kit soon but if it gets it running it's a small price to pay!

It does seem like occasionally it's man enough to make a feeble attempt to go, but only just. Once any load is asked of it, it just can't cope and dies.

Mine was funny, when i got it it ran fine, but gradually got really bad. I had replaced some poor fuel hose and fixed the carb overflow system. I thought it was a blocked fuel filter so changed that, checked the dashpot oil level, points etc and never thought about the mixture as it ran fine from new too. When i did check it it was way out, the two nuts on the su carb should have been 9-10mm apart and it was 6mm so very lean. Not sure how it ran ok from the start but its much better now. Would be worth a check.

[danthecapriman]

I'll try the condenser first, if this doesn't cure it then I'll try rechecking mixture. Might be hard though as I need it running to check the mixture!

[steve_earwig]

With the dizzy cap off I think you should be able to see the points arcing if the condenser's dead.

 

Does your grandmother know how to suck eggs? Before you start wind the mixture screw(S) in counting the turns, then put it/them (I have no idea) back, so at least you know where to put them if the mixture doesn't turn out to be the issue.

[OwdChina]

Many years ago on a Mercury Monarch we had a similar problem. I didn't work on it, but the guy who did had a bitch of a time. I remember him saying something about a stuck damper in the manifold. Two days to find it.

[alf892]

I wouldn't fuck about with timing/mixture adjustments till it is running again......like you say it was running nice.

 

Ok the mixture may need doing if you cure carb faults as it may have been set up to overcome a combination of errors but other than that leave alone for now.

 

Have you tried dropping a good bit of fuel straight down the carb to see if it fires? (If it takes your eyebrows off the timings out lol)

[danthecapriman]

This is it, it was running well, nothing has been changed or altered and it has intermittently run well very recently. So in theory all the basics must be at least good enough to run already.

It has got to be something that has deteriorated and now has a fault. Like an ignition component or connection failing.

The way I see it at the moment based on this, if I change the mixture or timing in an effort to fix the problem it's highly likely all it will do is give it one more reason not to start, then it's more than one reason it won't run.

 

I haven't tried chucking any petrol down the carb, worth a go though.

 

It's getting incredibly frustrating!

[oman5]

Def. try putting petrol down the carb. It sounds like fuel starvation to me, maybe there's crap in the fuel tank blocking the pipe

[purplebargeken]

Coil or condenser. It always is*

[Bren]

Has it had a whiff of easy start?

[danthecapriman]

Has it had a whiff of easy start?

Yes, and it will sort of very briefly run or at least fire on it. But easy start is very easy to light, even compression alone can light it. I don't like using it to be honest.

 

The plan today is/was to put my new condenser in and try that. But it's raining here so until it stops I'm stuck for now. Bloody weather, it's been nice most of the week while I've been at work!

[PhilA]

Had similar problems with the Renault. Felt like fuel problems, had a nice fat spark.. problem was the rotor arm and cap were gibbered and the spark would track along the arm, to the cap and go to the wrong plug, giving the impression that the ignition system was all well. It would crank and crank and occasionally sneeze and fart but wouldn't run.

 

If you don't know the provenance of cheap plastic bits.. if you got a condenser, how about the arm and cap? Even if not, spares of those aren't ever bad to have.

 

Phil

[Squire_Dawson]

Yes, I agree with that - check the carbon brush is present and sprung aswell.

[Pete-M]

Where about are you Dan?

[danthecapriman]

Where about are you Dan?

South coast, about 10 miles north of Portsmouth, just off A3.

 

 

The rotor arm and cap are both nearly new, I put new ones on after I got the car home. The old ones were just old and dirty but seem to work still. I've tried swapping the rotor arm back to the old one with no difference. Maybe worth trying swapping back to the old cap aswell. And I'll check the carbon brush, didn't check that! The new cap isn't cracked etc and the contacts are all clean.

 

Haven't had chance to get the condenser changed today due to the shitty weather but hopefully tomorrow will be a bit better.

[Squire_Dawson]

Any progress, Dan?

[steve_earwig]

Indeed. No news is... worrying.

[danthecapriman]

Not had chance to try anything new yet. Combination of work getting in the way, shit weather and now I've come down with some vile chest infection!

 

I've got a new condenser ready to fit so I'm really hoping this cures it.

 

Also got the new brake master cylinder from yank land so that needs fitting aswell. Get tomorrow out the way then it's a 4 day weekend for Easter which will mean car tinkering time (which actually means me getting angry with the car as it won't work!)

I'm fairly confident it's the condenser in hindsight, fingers crossed. Most of the road salt seems to have washed away down here and I want this on the road!

[steve_earwig]

Ah good, I thought maybe tipping fuel down the carb had turned it into a flamethrower...

 

Take your time, if you feel anger rising go do something else, even moan on here. I lost my rag with a tiller a while back and now I have even more repairs to do. Although I don't think there's much chance of you being able to pick your car up and throw it...

[Taff]

Ah good, I thought maybe tipping fuel down the carb had turned it into a flamethrower...

 

Take your time, if you feel anger rising go do something else, even moan on here. I lost my rag with a tiller a while back and now I have even more repairs to do. Although I don't think there's much chance of you being able to pick your car up and throw it...

 

I've stood over a car holding a hammer aloft and counting to 100 before now. No idea where I would get a new screen for mine if I properly lost my rag with it.

 

Dan, are you going to Wheels Day or the Popham alternative mate?

[danthecapriman]

I had to walk away the other day. I was laying under the front re tightening the fuel pipe, got up too early and smacked my head hard into the bottom of the bumper. Right on the boney bit around my eye. Still really hurts now! Lost my temper and had to walk before I unleashed fury on the car!

 

I've stood over a car holding a hammer aloft and counting to 100 before now. No idea where I would get a new screen for mine if I properly lost my rag with it.

 

Dan, are you going to Wheels Day or the Popham alternative mate?

Tbh I haven't thought much about any shows etc yet. Trying desperately to get it working again just so I can use it!

I might try to get to the Solent Renegades season opener in Portsmouth this month (if it gets fixed) it's a local show but there's been some really nice stuff there in the past.

Never been to Wheels Day before. I don't tend to get to go to many shows since I don't know that many people that share my interest in cars. Most of what use my cars get is just cruising about on my own for something to do!!