V70 with mayonnaise

[forddeliveryboy]

I presume a serious case of mayonnaise can wear the top end of an engine? Was a little mystified with a new neighbour's straight 5 Volvo engine which her specialists, having serviced for over a decade, pronounced as dead - having charged her £90 for a compression test.

 

She happened to mention the mayo in passing, and I realised what had possibly happened. Ok, so 230k is a fair mileage but these are good tough engines and this one had been serviced to the book. I then wondered how gently she drove - rarely more than 2500 revs, gentle commute most of the time. And nothing but Morrison's finest petrol. No smoke under power so the bores should be ok.

 

Anyone else come across mayo-knackered engines, or have working knowledge of these 5 pot Volvos at higher mileage?

[Cavcraft]

Probably condensation from short local journeys.

[scooters]

Usually very robust. Mayo can be from short journey giffer type journeys which can cause the mayo.

I would be less than impressed as top engine wear would take a very long time in such an environment and the garage could have checked it.

I'd be inclined to bung in a bottle of k seal and see what happens...

That or a replacement head should do.

R

[forddeliveryboy]

Her specialists said it had 40% compression showing on 4, only 20% on the fifth. Certainly sounded low on compressiom, smoking a little when booting the gas after idling a couple of minutes.

 

I've a feeling the whole thing's gummed up, internally - Morrison's petrol, low revs, rarely up to temperature. Wouldn't be surprised if a 200 mile blast on the autobahn with some Shell in the tank wouldn't see it much improved. I took it up the lane and she was aghast I revved it to 4000 - didn't do any more, think we'd have needed an ambulance! No smoking under load, no smoke on a trailing throttle or when rebooting (at least none visible in the rvm).

 

A blow-by test would tell more, but I'd be surprised if the lump was worn with meticulous servicing - although they should have mentioned the cure for mayo. No sign of HGF, either.

[Spiny Norman]

No sign of HGF, either.

 

Surely the presence of mayo and seriously reduced compression in two adjacent cylinders would tend to suggest that very thing, or a I missing something?

These Volvo lumps are tough, sure, but they're not everlasting and at high mileage HGF isn't unknown on them.

[NorfolkNWeigh]

I ran an early 20v 2.4 S80 to about 250k and I'm notoriously lax at proper servicing, having learnt long ago it's cheaper to repair what's actually worn out than waste money 'servicing' bits that are working. It was running perfectly although did like a drop of oil,about 500ml every 2000 miles. In common with all my cars it was driven hard and barely had chance to cool down overnight .

I'm inclined to agree with you about the Italian Tuneup, if it's knackered it'll still be knackered but it might do some good.

I sold my S80 to a Lithuanian pimp/ people trafficker who kept it for about 6 months of going back and forth to Vilnius until he got a proper gangster 740iL . He now drives a Q7 ands got half a dozen Car Washes- who says crime doesn't pay.

[beko1987]

I'd try and get it out on your own for a bit and drive at 70 on the mway going between 4th and 5th! Should help it out. Can you take the top of the engine off easily on these and Mr muscle them clean? Had to do that on Amy's corsa when I met her as it was gummed up! I then took it to work for a month which helped even more

[forddeliveryboy]

If I had it for a couple of weeks, it would definitely be better - there's every sign of death by gentle driving. Thing is, they're brand new neighbours and although I think affinity has grown massively over the last few days, using the car isn't really on the cards. I've offered a fibre-optic view of the bores to prove they're not worn, as I suspect - and as the specialist has been inferred to have suggested. 

 

It really does sound as if this car hasn't been revved over 2.5k in recent years, has burned nothing but Morrison's cheapest and has spent most of the last dozen years in an easy commute.

[dollywobbler]

You keep on going on about the fuel, but that seems a relevant as the colour of her shoes. I'm with Spiny Norman on HGF, in which case further Italian tuning might well finish it off completely. Mayo indicates moisture in the oil either because of a leak or because the oil isn't getting up to temp - ie short journeys or a failed 'stat.

[forddeliveryboy]

Yep, as mentioned, every sign of HGF is absent. Including exhaust sniffer in the coolant and the rest. I do mention the cheap fuel, since I reckon (along with driving like a sloth) it's a little like devouring nothing but Morrison's economy burgers all your life and never walking further than round the superstore to buy 'em. Of course, some humans survive on this for a while, but its your veggies who live longer and healthier - that's a fact, and I for one love a good steak.

 

Not really worth getting into the fuel debate, it's for another thread and there's no doubt only 'hearsay' on the side of those who suggest supermarket fuel can lead to engine problems, since it's all to minimum British Standards.

 

My original question was whether or not it's possible - or likely - that a severe case of mayo can lead to premature valve guide and seal wear. Of course, at 230k, this is highly subjective.

[Richard]

I would expect wear, whether to the bores or head, to affect all five cylinders to some extent. HGF would always be the first guess for compression problems in adjacent cylinders. If the gasket is blown between cylinders it won't affect the coolant or the oil, the mayonnaise probably is just down to the engine not being worked hard enough.

 

It could be that the specialist does think it's HGF but doesn't think it's cost-effective to strip the engine down and possibly find other issues, I think a blow between cylinders can eat away at the block and/or head, which could be costly to put right.

[Tetleysmooth]

Any smoke coming out of the dipstick hole? This could just need a good breather service, or just sell it to dollywobbler

[scooters]

Here's what to do...

Bung in some k seal

Some engine cleaner a tin of Wynns should do

After 20 mins of gentle take it for a 2 hour high rev Italian tune up.

On return change the oil.

 

If it is hgf and it does sound like it the it won't be a huge one and the k seal will fix it once the engine reaches temp.

[jonathan_dyane]

I don't see how K seal is going to fix it if the head gasket has blown between the cylinders?

[AlabamaShrimp]

I prefer my volvos with tomato sauce

[KruJoe]

Where are you Ford'boy?

 

I have a good engine available, 151k, was clean and quiet when it last ran a couple years back. Has been kept in the car in a shed since.

 

 

2.5, from a late-ish 850.

Location BD23.

[forddeliveryboy]

Thanks, Krujoe - I'll let the owners know if it ends up needing a complete engine. Would you be interested in fitting it?

 

Richard, yes - it could be beginning to go between cylinders - I've listened to engines where this has been the case and usually could hear the problem once your ears are tuned in, both at the tailpipe and engine end. This one sounds normal, just flat, sad, gummed up/worn out. Obviously at this mileage, anything could be worn badly or damaged - but from what I know these are tough engines and shouldn't be worn out to the point of fubar having had regular oil changes. I've known higher mileage engines which have given reasonable leak test results but relatively poor compression readings at cranking speed, but which go beautifully and use little or no oil.

 

My approach would be to give it some hard work to do throughout the rev range over a couple of weeks - if for no other reason than to clean it up internally and so rule out one factor and make other factors more obvious. There's nothing to lose, as I see it. But I'm not sure there's much chance of re-educating the driver after a dozen years of gentle driving.

[KruJoe]

Would you be interested in fitting it?

No, I'd rather not get that involved.

 

If they need it, I would consider taking the head off and sending just that if they made it worth my while.

[forddeliveryboy]

Ta v much, helpful to know of whereabouts of Volvoid bits. What's the plan for the rest of the car?

[Junkman]

Morrisons gets their petrol from the very same refineries as anyone else, and the assumption theirs would be inferior to any other is solemnly based on urban legend.

In fact, the Morrisons across the street from me gets the fuel delivered by a colourful mix of BP, Shell, Esso, Texaco, Morrisons own, and unmarked tankers.

A few minutes spent at a refinery will reveal, that tankers in all conceivable liveries dock on for filling up.

 

Re. the Ovlov: The first thing to do is an oil change, secondly the spark plugs should be inspected, especially the ones of cylinders 4 and 5.

I don't believe in OMGHGF, based on the symptoms mentioned, it all sounds like lack of proper use and sooted valves. So with fresh oil and good plugs, an Italian tune up will very likely work wonders.

[forddeliveryboy]

Morrisons gets their petrol from the very same refineries as anyone else, and the assumption theirs would be inferior to any other is solemnly based on urban legend.

In fact, the Morrisons across the street from me gets the fuel delivered by a colourful mix of BP, Shell, Esso, Texaco, Morrisons own, and unmarked tankers.

A few minutes spent at a refinery will reveal, that tankers in all conceivable liveries dock on for filling up.

 

Re. the Ovlov: The first thing to do is an oil change, secondly the spark plugs should be inspected, especially the ones of cylinders 4 and 5.

I don't believe in OMGHGF, based on the symptoms mentioned, it all sounds like lack of proper use and sooted valves. So with fresh oil and good plugs, an Italian tune up will very likely work wonders.

 

My knowledge of supermarket fuel is that they buy via brokers when prices are low, and use different additive packages. Buying petrol at the lowest price, I'm told, means that it's often the bottom 5% of the holding tanks. Not always, just more likely to be.

 

Certainly, in the days I could afford to pay tax on tax on tax, different cars often ran slightly better on different fuels including 2 or 3% better economy - but these fuels were never those bought from Morrisions or Asda, although I sometimes bought it from them.

 

 

 

Re V70 - Agreed, JM.

[KruJoe]

What's the plan for the rest of the car?

 

I still have the good saloon shell and many bits. It has been broken, some bits sold, and many more have gone to Thailand in my suitcase over the last few years, to fix up my 850 there.

Need rid of the engine, auto box, and shell to free up some shed space.

[HH-R]

Between me and my parents we must have spent thousands of pounds at ASDA on fuel. It's cheap, but also there's not a great deal of choice. It's pay by card 24 hours so GR99 4 avoiding the general public by filling up at unsociable times. Never had any bother, well except from my two Pandas, but I think the fuel choice the least of that car's worries.

[forddeliveryboy]

No, I've never had engine failure either - but I don't drive like it's 1910. From what I can gather, some engines are more prone than others to fuel with less/different detergent and other chemical packages, when constantly driven very gently.

 

I seem to remember when multi-valve heads first appeared, it was only in Britain where coking-up became a significant problem, due to low speeds.

 

In the opposite vein, didn't Formula Shell back in the mid-80s wreck mainly Vauxhalls, due to too many additives?