Renault 6TL "Crapaud"

[Squire_Dawson]

When I had to have the rear screen re-fitted to my car, I phoned a professional who gave me his business card at a car show. He came to my house and I was very pleased with the job. He demonstrated to me the metal 'lip' is actually lower down than the corner drain holes, so in heavy rain they become overwhelmed. Some cars are dry sealed from the factory and leaks develop over time but he used some old-school black flexible sealant and it has been dry ever since.

 

I have re-used head gaskets many times without trouble, about 3 times is as much as I will though due to them being compressed. It's not really a problem on a 'cooking' engine.

[ruffgeezer]

What size tyres do you need Vulg?

[vulgalour]

145/80/13  Priced them up online and they're around the £25 a corner delivered mark.  Surprisingly cheap.

[vulgalour]

It finally stopped raining today!  Time to crack on with some sealing jobs on the Renault.  I was going to squidge some more sealant into the windscreen seal but it sits in so snugly I can't, instead I ran the tidiest bead of sealant I could manage over the edges of the seal where it seems to be letting water into the car and we'll see if it does the trick.  If not, I can clean it back and try and different approach.  That was fairly quick to do, if a little messy, and left me lots of time to get on with the next bit.
 
I'd put a shout out on various fora for suggestions on where to get some door seals and after looking at the various wares on offer, it was http://www.woolies-trim.co.uk/ who came up trumps with their larger arrowhead profile foam door seals.  This isn't self adhesive so sealant is required to fit.  12.5 metres were needed in total for all four doors, I bought 13 because you can only buy in 1 metre multiples and it's always best to have a little bit extra, just in case.

 

 

 

I worked on one door at a time, stripping off the old seal and fitting the new one.  The drivers side was still sealing fairly well so I could have probably got away with not doing it, but I'd rather fit new all round.  The old seals were quite tired.

 

Remember, these are the GOOD old seals.  It's no wonder the rain was getting in really.

 

One thing I did learn is that a lot of the glue holding the old seals on had also failed so water was getting in not just around where the old seals were shrunken but also where they just hadn't bonded to the door frame.  Not any use to anyone so in the bin they go.

 

To make sure I had enough seals to go around, I applied the polyurethane sealant to the door frame and then fed the new seal on from the roll I'd bought.  Starting at the centre of the bottom edge so the join was in the least visible place and least likely to cause sealing problems, I worked my way around the door frame, holding the seal in place with tape.  I swear I ended up with more sealant on me than on the door and this stuff only seems to clean off with thinners.  Got there in the end.

 

Here we see a rare display of a Renault 6 "peacocking" in a vain attempt to attract a mate.

 

There wasn't much seal left over.

 

Ages ago when I jacked up the car, water came out and we couldn't figure out how it had got in to where it was coming out as there didn't seem to be an obvious point of ingress.

 

On rolling the back seat forward and lifting the floor mat to check for water to mop out - it rained LOADS yesterday - I noticed the blanking plate over the fuel sender was loose and quite a lot of water had got in underneath.

 

The boot seal is next on my jobs for replacement, look how flat this is.

 

It got a bit cold so I'm hoping the sealant cures okay, if not I can always reglue things.  The doors are more difficult to shut now than they were and you can see the seals are squishing into the places they need to so I'm cautiously optimistic.

[plasticvandan]

having the doors shut tight against the seals should work magic in keeping them in the right place,just leave them shut for a day or two

[vulgalour]

Renault's new boot seal arrived today, again ordered from Woolies.  The Laguna one that might have been available suddenly wasn't so I ordered a length of suitable edge seal from Woolies which arrived today.  Really easy to fit you just peel the old one off and push the new one on, trimming to size where the lock latch is.

 

Flat old one can go in the bin.

 

Again, not a lot left over.  I needed just shy of 4 metres to do this and I wish I'd done it ages ago.

 

It doesn't make that odd crunchy noise when closing the tailgate now and it feels like it seals, the test will be when it rains.  Mike had been kind enough to clean up the access plate from under the back seat.  I need to glue some sort of strip seal to it and clean up the car side so this makes a good seal when reattached. I'll likely drill an extra hole in it too so it can be clamped down better, there's no visible hole to screw it into the floor that matches that on the plate itself.

 

Next thing then was to check how the doors had actually sealed.  We've had a small amount of rain and I had noticed the car wasn't fogging up as much so I was hopeful the new seals were working.  Started with the best sealing door and yep, that seal is working lovely.  The door made that satisfying new seal noise when the door was opened too and there wasn't signs of moisture in the door opening.  Good job!

 

Front door on the driver's side not as good.  I really should have removed the mirror before putting the seal on so I have a small section that needs resealing once I've done that.  I didn't have my allen keys to hand when fitting the new seals and thought I could get away with it.  The leading edge of the door where it joins the lower A pillar also hasn't stuck so I need to reglue that too.  Not the end of the world, just niggles and easily remedied.  The good thing is that there wasn't really any obvious water ingress on the floor this side now.

 

The worst door, that being rear passenger side, is still causing problems.  Water is still getting past the seal here but it's not clear how.  The seal is channeling the water as it should but a small amount is still getting down the back of it.  I may have to just push the top of the door frame in a bit like I did on the front door this side so that it meets the bodyshell better.  The doors on this car are quite flimsy things.

 

I did find a small hole.  At first I thought it was just black paint.  That will need some attention and I'm not sure how I missed it when I did the gutter removal.

 

I also noticed the headlining at the windscreen edge was dry now so I may have sealed that succesfully.  With the exception of the rear passenger door, the cabin was dry inside so I've certainly significantly reduced the water ingress problem.  I can't do anything on the Renault's engine today as I have none of my tools at home and my loan car was taken back a couple of days ago so I haven't the transport to go and get them in a timely fashion.  I can pick them up on the weekend as I'll hopefully be helping Mike put the Rover back together.

 

 

[Rocket88]

There's little more annoying that a leaky car..............well done, young sir...............

[daveb47]

You need some

Captain Tolley's Creeping Crack Cure

[Rocket88]

Can vouch for the efficacy of Captain Tolley's wares................

[vulgalour]

Yeah, I suspect some Tolley's will be used eventually, I just need to slow the water ingress enough to make sure it's worth the effort, not much point using it if the water is just pouring in through the door holes.

[michael1703]

Can you adjust the striker and see if it pulls the seal a smidge tighter?

[vulgalour]

That's a good point actually, I'd dismissed it as there's not really any adjustment to be had on the body side but perhaps there is on the door?  It's possible the striker is in the wrong place, both door openings have had substantial patches added with the strikers relocated as a result and given that this rear door doesn't offer as much resistance as the other side when closing you've probably identified the issue.

[michael1703]

Or.... push it in a bit at the 'B' post to give it a tighter angle

[vulgalour]

Mike and I brought the engine crane home this afternoon.  I might go out and tinker with the engine tonight or I might do it tomorrow because it's cold and my garage has no heating.

[vulgalour]

Had a poke around at the door seals today to see if I can figure out why that little bit of water is getting in and found that the seals haven't glued fully in a few places.  I was worried this might happen as it got very cold while I was doing the job.  They're good enough for now to keep most of the weather out and certainly a vast improvement over where we were.  If we get a warm-for-winter day I'll redo the bits that need it, if not I'll wait until after the MoT and do it at the unit where I have enough indoor partially heated space.  That can wait.

 

I wanted to get further with the engine, I'm eager to get it back in the car and tried out.  First job was to get the boxes of bits out and lay them out on my useful table in my bombsite of a garage.  Unfortunately I have lots of bits of Renault and nowhere to really store any of it while things are on and off the car.  This is slightly compounded by having my tools and the engine crane at home after Mike and I fetched them from the unit so space is something of a premium as it's quite a narrow garage and not really designed to be a working one, just a car storing one.

 

There's not a huge amount to go back on.  My goal before the head gasket arrives is to get the sump and gearbox attached to the engine.  I can't set the timing or put the other bits on until I've fitted the new headgasket.  

 

Got the sump on and the engine stood up again.  The crank turns easily now, you can do it by hand without tools.  Didn't get the gearbox on, the engine isn't really stable enough to do it on my own so Mike and I will likely have a crack at that tomorrow.  Valve cover plonked on just to keep anything from falling into the top.

 

Eagle eyed viewers may notice one of the studs for the rocker assembly and rocker cover are missing in the above picture.  The other thing that's gone walkabout are the bolts and special washers for the timing chain cover.  These will no doubt be in the same box together, all of the Renault engine is in the garage, it's just that my garage is a bit of a mess at the moment, and some of the boxes of bits are under other bits of Renault.  Progress is progress though, even if it's only a tiny little bit.

[320touring]

Glad to hear it turns by hand now:)

[vulgalour]

It's pretty annoying that I have to take the car apart to put it together again.  Mike lent me a hand today getting the front end undone and then it rained and meant we couldn't finish the job.  I need to remove the bumper to get the face and bonnet off so the weather meant I had to leave the car looking like this.

 

On the plus side, I can now see that the car is definitely leaking a lot less.  The new boot seal appears to be working to keep a lot of water out, I just need to redo the side windows  properly as that is now the main point of ingress at the back.  The weather has been quite annoying today, just showers on and off so I called it quits.  I hate working in the rain.

 

The last thing Mike helped with was getting the gearbox located onto the engine.  We've got it held on with two nuts for now.  The stud for the rocker bar turned up... in the rocker bar.  I still can't find the bolts and washers for the timing chain cover which is annoying me as I've got everything else and I'm not sure how they've got misplaced given that all the components were kept together.

[plasticvandan]

Me no understand why you don't turn car around and push nose into garage

[vulgalour]

It doesn't push that easily because of the new brakes and after the last time Mike and I manhandled it around I don't want a repeat performance of the faff.  This way is easier.  Installing the engine will be loads easier on the drive than in the garage too as there's actually room to move about.

[They_all_do_that_sir]

Really like this wee car. It's very you. I take it the plan is to have it roadworthy for the summer?

Are you going to modify it or is the Princess the artistic outlet?

 

Sent from my D6603 using Tapatalk

[vulgalour]

Only modifying as necessity dictates rather than aesthetics.  Make do and mend but try not to bodge.  I've come to the conclusion today that I really don't enjoy engine work at all, it's frustrating and difficult and expensive and I'd far rather someone else did it in the future.  I'm much happier doing bodywork, paint and retrimming, that stuff is much easier and on the whole far less frustrating.

[PhilA]

Nice to see you back at it. I fail to see the enticement of doing interior work. I can get along just fine with the oily bits though.

 

We'll do a transatlantic Renault swap. Mine runs but needs interior and paint. Send me this with the interior all nice and I'll fix the engine.

 

Deal

 

Phil

[vulgalour]

I can think of no obstacle to this perfect Renault sorting plan.  No obstacles.  Not one.

[vulgalour]

These boxes no longer have bits of engine in them.  That's good.

 

The boot is staying dry enough for me to keep what few spares I do have in it so the garage isn't so cluttered.  This is also good.

 

My table of nuts and bolts and such is emptying.  Another good thing.

 

The engine is looking like an engine properly, which is really the best thing.

 

Today, I got lots of things back on the engine.  The sump bolts are all tightened up, the gearbox is bolted on properly, the engine-to-gearbox braces are done up and the bellhousing guard thing is bolted on.  Alternator was taken off when I removed the head to fit the new gasket, then refitted once the head was torqued down as per the instructions in the workshop manual.  While the alternator was off I put the spark plugs in the holes more so I don't misplace them than anything at this stage.  The rocker bar was bolted on except for the outer two bolts which require a 11mm spanner which I don't have at home.  Likewise, I haven't set the distributor properly as that also needs an 11mm spanner. The straightened pushrods were put back in their holes and the camshaft pulley bolted back on.

 

There's not a huge amount to do:

- fit timing chain tensioner

- fit timing chain

- set timing, both static and ignition

- fit timing chain cover

- bolt down rocker bar

- set tappet/rocker clearances

- fit belts

- fit any hoses with new jubilees that are going to be difficult to do with the engine fitted, like the fuel pump hoses.

 

Once that's all done I can plonk it back in the engine bay after the bumper and whatnot has been removed.  Nearly there, I'm most likely to be held up by the short daylight hours as I need Mike to be a second pair of hands when it comes to removing bodywork and fitting the engine and he's only available in the evenings and weekends.

 

Quite anxious about the engine going in and firing it up.  I'm fully expecting it to all go horribly wrong somehow and have to come out again at which point I may just lose the will with this car.  We shall see what happens.

[michael1703]

Nearly there

 

Think positive!

[DeeJay]

vulg

 

[Uncle Jimmy]

Great to see the progress on the '6', I suspect many of us are crossing various appendages in expectation!

[vulgalour]

The next obstacle is one of manpower, really.  There's so much I can do on my own, almost all of what's left in fact, but I shan't be able to refit the engine without assistance.  The bodywork I need to remove is a two person job in part because of where some of the bolts and nuts are and the length of my arms, and in part because things like the bonnet/front panel assembly is impossible to stabilise and unfasten without risk of it cartwheeling down the drive.  The other issue is installing the engine itself.  There's no lifting eyes on the Renault's engine and the only way to get it in and out is to wrap straps around it.  Doing this always runs the risk of straps slipping and the engine falling on the floor which is not something I want to have happen and besides, fitting an engine with two people is always much easier since one can guide the engine and the other operate the crane.

 

Where this puts a crimp in proceedings is that the only assistant I have is Mike and it's winter so it's dark before he gets back from work.  The other issue is that the Rover can only be sorted on the weekend/after work which eats up Renault time (we finally got the last component through the post for reassembly on that one).  So the Renault will likely be on the verge of completion this weekend but won't actually be test run until at least the weekend after.

[PhilA]

Scrapyard trip and go get a couple of lifting eyes off another engine?

 

Might be worth it to avoid broken toes?

 

Phil

[vulgalour]

There's nowhere to bolt the lifting eyes to.

 

In other news, I found the missing bolts!  They were on my desk in front of me the whole time.  I now feel quite, quite stupid but also relieved.