Rip off? I don't think so ........

[Pete-M]

On the other side of that coin are all the lazy, rip-off mechanics (and plumbers/electricians/tilers*).

The garage that "changed the cambelt" on your BMW

 

That's also true. The 'cambelt' on my BMW I suspect to have been a fanbelt. I bloody well hope it was.

[Autoplas]

A major on my E-Class including having the auto transmission fluid changed cost me £600 earlier this year, and thats on a FSH low mileage 3.2.

 

Tell him to stop being such a dick and pay up !!!!

[Luxobarges_Are_Us]

The loan car for two days is worth a good 60 quid on its own. He really is taking the piss.

[Magnificent Rustbucket]

I don't think the bill is rediculous - I have spent far more but then I have an old Jag...

 

I think quite a few people have only a dim concept of what maintaining a car involves and scant regard for the consequences of not maintaining their car. That way, a bill of several hundred quid feels like they have spent money for nothing, rather than spent £380 avoiding some mechanical failure which risks at best stranding them somewhere, and at worst causing a serious accident.

[Cheggers]

Hence why I have been known to take newly purchased shite to the main dealer for an 'interim service'. Invariably, the following week something would go wrong (e.g. split hose- haven't had anything really serious happen as yet) and the dealer would end up receiving a letter heavy on legalese and comments about how it could have been a safety-critical component, and coerced into doing a few repairs "as a gesture of goodwill" in order to avoid media attention and potential legal claims.

 

 

And this, folks, is why Main Dealer work is so expensive...subsidising "gestures of goodwill" for people bright enough to write a bit of "legalese".

 

Good work

[Luxobarges_Are_Us]

Alternatively, they could make sure they employ non-clueless technicians who can get things right first time, saving everyone time and money in the process. How selfish and irresponsible for me to want to get what I paid for!

[Cheggers]

Alternatively, they could make sure they employ non-clueless technicians who can get things right first time, saving everyone time and money in the process. How selfish and irresponsible for me to want to get what I paid for!

 

It isn't selfish at all to expect what you paid for. It's "coercing them" (your words...) into carrying out additional repairs FoC that, for me, steps over the line. That work IS paid for, by an increase in the labour charge for everyone.

[Luxobarges_Are_Us]

So, if I have paid for them to check everything and they haven't done what they'd been paid for, what would you suggest I do? Just take it on the chin like I would do with the local friendly mechanic that charges 1/3 of their hourly rates?

[Cheggers]

I'm not sure an interim service constitutes a full mechanical inspection complete with a guarantee that nothing they have inspoected will fail for a set period of time. As I said before, if it came out faulty, get them to fix it as that's what you've paid them for. I obviously didn't make myself clear - it's using "legalese" to "coerce" them into doing additional repairs that adds ££ to everyones bill.

[Luxobarges_Are_Us]

But that's what happened to me. They ticked a box that says they have checked part X, part X fails the following week and it had been thoroughly fucked all along. Hence, instead of quibbling over a possible partial refund, I just demand they fix it for free.

[Cheggers]

Maybe it's me...

 

When you talk about:

 

"coerced into doing a few repairs "as a gesture of goodwill" in order to avoid media attention and potential legal claims. :mrgreen:"

 

Is this just getting them to put right the fault they missed, which shouldn't need threats & coercion, or is this using the threat of the media and the law to carry out extra works FoC ('coz that's how it reads...)??

[RobT]

To prevent issues with garages it isn't difficult to get a word of mouth recommendation, try them out and if you're happy stick with that garage for ever more. I’m lucky in so much that I know of three decent independents that I use for MoTs or the stuff I can’t do myself (or can’t be arsed doing ‘cos it’s too cold!).

 

I have respect for the decent blokes out there who are traders, as I wouldn’t fancy dealing with the great unwashed who suddenly become an expert on cars, plumbing etc. On the flip side I’ve used the odd bad trader before, but all you do is tell them they are shit and move on, That’s Life innit.

 

 

[Guest]

I worked in a garage for years. Respect to you for dealing with 'customers' and their 'expectations' the only blue sky thinking is when they've been knocked flat on their backs looking at it!!

 

The complete fucknuts who come in with a blowing exhaust are what I cite whenever anyone asks why I left the trade.

 

F. Ucknut comes in "my exhaust is noisy"

Have a look, "yesir, blown a hole but the whole thing is trolllyed, do the worst bit say £40 or do the lot for £60"

"errr well I take my car for granted every day and when it needs 10p spending on it I moan and think oooh I'll sell it and buy a new one for £102021 when the repair is less than a ton and I want to spend my money on chineses and sky tv."

"righto so the back box only then sir"

"yes"

 

FFWD two weeks

"that exhaust you fitted is blowing"

Look at exhaust"

"no it isn't sir the rotten front has now blown as advised"

"but you fitted a new exhaust"

 

Blah blah blah feck orf with your legal shit and threats you fucktard I tried to help but you think if you can spend less it's better.

 

2x £40 = £80

1x £60 = £60

 

They cannot understand the above simple math, mouth breathin cretins, it's the shock that in one day out of 365 the car goes wrong!

[Luxobarges_Are_Us]

Maybe it's me...

 

When you talk about:

 

"coerced into doing a few repairs "as a gesture of goodwill" in order to avoid media attention and potential legal claims. :mrgreen:"

 

Is this just getting them to put right the fault they missed, which shouldn't need threats & coercion, or is this using the threat of the media and the law to carry out extra works FoC ('coz that's how it reads...)??

 

Well, it's both, depending on how you view it. Had they found the problem to begin with, I would have to pay to get it fixed. When you complain about it, they just say "we are sorry this happened, we will note your feedback and be more careful in the future". Which is when you coerce them to actually sort it FOC. I wouldn't dream of doing that to a self-employed guy or a small business, but IMHO dealers are fair game for this kind of thing.

[garethj]

It isn't selfish at all to expect what you paid for. It's "coercing them" (your words...) into carrying out additional repairs FoC that, for me, steps over the line.

What he said

But that's what happened to me. They ticked a box that says they have checked part X, part X fails the following week and it had been thoroughly fucked all along. Hence, instead of quibbling over a possible partial refund, I just demand they fix it for free.

I think the issue is really how well they can check parts by an external visual inspection. How are you supposed to check if a hose clamp won't come loose? The only way is to loosen it and re-tighten it to see if it grips properly. If you want the garage to do that with every single hose, you might need to arrange alternative transport for the month that they'll have it.

 

What about the state of the brake pipes? They can have a look to see if they're rusty on the outside, but if you want to be sure it won't burst then you need to take it off and pressure test it.

 

Here's the headlines, broken down into bitesize, easy to digest chunks:

 

1. Cars are made up of thousands of parts, a few of these parts will go wrong over time

2. Find a garage that knows what they're doing and stick with them. They'll probably make a mistake at some point, but they should sort it out honestly

3. If you want to run a car on a shoestring, you probably won't have a Merc or something that was £20k new, and you'll be doing all the work on it yourself

 

I think ColC's checks sound very thorough and an experienced mechanic can tell you what's wrong or what's likely to go wrong with visual inspections. If you want something that will never go wrong buy a spade, but budget for a new handle and flat end every so often.

 

I wouldn't dream of doing that to a self-employed guy or a small business, but IMHO dealers are fair game for this kind of thing.

Why?

[fiatdaft]

This is turning into a dishonest customer thread !

[red5]

Because all main Dealers are composed of faceless, heartless individuals who just rip you off, therefore are fair game.

 

You may as well demand money with menaces by that yardstick.

 

If, and it's a big if, it is an item the tech has failed to check properly, most dealers/repairers will honour a repair/come to a agreement. If it's not then I'd have refunded your costs and advised you to seek alternative repair arrangements as we 'can't meet your needs, Sir'.

[andrew e]

Boolocks.

[fiatdaft]

I have seen twats try to do this before,there car is usually worth less than they paid for it by the time they get thrown out and go back to it.

[RobT]

 

I wouldn't dream of doing that to a self-employed guy or a small business, but IMHO dealers are fair game for this kind of thing.

Why?

 

Well, quite. If you've paid for something you have a right for it to be done properly, irrespective how big the firm is. But if that payment was £50 for a full service, then don't expect the world

 

Edit: back to the Merc bloke. I wonder if he cited the fact that his car is German, and surely nothing should ever go wrong on it!

[Luxobarges_Are_Us]

Because all main Dealers are composed of faceless, heartless individuals who just rip you off, therefore are fair game.

 

No, it's because they can afford to take the hit because I've already paid them top dollar in the first place, and also because they've failed in their job (even if I do agree that there is some mitigation because of the multitude of parts etc). As with the OP, it's just a case of expectations. And yes, I 've been shafted by dealerships too many times in the past, and will freely admit that I'll never have much good faith towards them!

 

Here's the headlines, broken down into bitesize, easy to digest chunks:

 

1. Cars are made up of thousands of parts, a few of these parts will go wrong over time

2. Find a garage that knows what they're doing and stick with them. They'll probably make a mistake at some point, but they should sort it out honestly

 

I am in total agreement with the above, however I move around a lot and it's not always possible to do it.

 

3. If you want to run a car on a shoestring, you probably won't have a Merc or something that was £20k new, and you'll be doing all the work on it yourself

 

I'm not that concerned about price, but I do have a bit of an obsession with value for money.

[Cheggers]

No, it's because they can afford to take the hit because I've already paid them top dollar in the first place.

 

So, I should make that slightly dubious whiplash claim because my insurance premium is so high???

 

I think you're mixing up cause & effect

[HillmanImp]

Hence why I have been known to take newly purchased shite to the main dealer for an 'interim service'. Invariably, the following week something would go wrong (e.g. split hose- haven't had anything really serious happen as yet) and the dealer would end up receiving a letter heavy on legalese and comments about how it could have been a safety-critical component, and coerced into doing a few repairs "as a gesture of goodwill" in order to avoid media attention and potential legal claims.

 

Sorry to go off topic but this is exactly what is wrong with this country. Always trying to grab something. If its not claiming for pretend whiplash because someone tapped your bumper, its threatening to sue someone everytime they make a small mistake.

 

Somethimes things don't go to plan and you just need to build a bridge and get fucking over it. Lifes too short to spend your whole life trying to do everyone else over.

 

Now if there is evidence of repeated failings or sheer negligent and dangerous work that has resulted in accident or injury then yes there is a case but because you are slightly put out in having to go back to the garage to get it done properly then its a joke.

 

And re the work on the Merc. The price is right. . They guy is obviously a muppet. There is the case for maybe giving an estimate of the costs beforehand based upon the standard service and there may be a couple of small things on top but if he did not have any money he should have asked.

[Luxobarges_Are_Us]

No, it's because they can afford to take the hit because I've already paid them top dollar in the first place.

 

So, I should make that slightly dubious whiplash claim because my insurance premium is so high???

 

That is the 'tragedy of the commons'. Dubious claims make premia more expensive, which in turn gives people more incentive to make dubious claims and so on...

 

Not applicable here, however, as the work itself is a lot cheaper than the price charged and you pay extra for the 'peace of mind' of having things done in the best possible way (in theory). Which is why you should have a 'zero tolerance' attitude to failure (unlike what you'd do with the local mechanic).

[Cheggers]

No, it's because they can afford to take the hit because I've already paid them top dollar in the first place.

 

So, I should make that slightly dubious whiplash claim because my insurance premium is so high???

 

That is the 'tragedy of the commons'. Dubious claims make premia more expensive, which in turn gives people more incentive to make dubious claims and so on...

 

Not applicable here, however, as the work itself is a lot cheaper than the price charged and you pay extra for the 'peace of mind' of having things done in the best possible way (in theory). Which is why you should have a 'zero tolerance' attitude to failure (unlike what you'd do with the local mechanic).

 

I've had 3 tries at responding to this, but frankly am struggling to know where to begin...

[red5]

The charge is irrelevant - the attitude towards a dealer as opposed to a independant is all too common these days. 'Top dollar' isn't going to make a tech be able to allow for lack of maintenance any more if he has a badge on his overalls anymore than one who doesn't. Unreasonable expectations from people who seem to asume a motor vehicle is a white good (fridge etc) instead of a complex machine requiring reasonable care and preventative maintenance is the norm, as in the case of the OP Merc customer.

 

There are plenty of one man bands/small independants who are utterly clueless and without any morals or scruples when it comes to customers, just the same as chains/dealers. The irony is that half of those halfwits end up taking customers cars to the 'rip-off' dealers after they have plugged in the Guess-a-Maticâ„¢ and replaced everything it 'said'.

[Luxobarges_Are_Us]

I've had 3 tries at responding to this, but frankly am struggling to know where to begin...

 

I reckon we should just agree to disagree. There is no objectively right or wrong way to deal with these things. More than anything else, it's a question of opinion, conscience, and life philosophy in general. I do respect those of you who live by "do unto others as you would have others do unto you" irrespective of context or past experiences, and I certainly think it's a valuable yardstick, but I admit I am unwilling/unable to abide with it 100% of the time and sometimes want to get my own back.

 

Let the one without sins and all that!

[M'coli]

I've had 3 tries at responding to this, but frankly am struggling to know where to begin...

Hmmm, let's try; for example, this incident from the service history of Pete-m's BMW:

On the other side of that coin are all the lazy, rip-off mechanics (and plumbers/electricians/tilers*).

The garage that "changed the cambelt" on your BMW

 

That's also true. The 'cambelt' on my BMW I suspect to have been a fanbelt. I bloody well hope it was.

and

Hence why I have been known to take newly purchased shite to the main dealer for an 'interim service'. Invariably, the following week something would go wrong (e.g. split hose- haven't had anything really serious happen as yet) and the dealer would end up receiving a letter heavy on legalese and comments about how it could have been a safety-critical component, and coerced into doing a few repairs "as a gesture of goodwill" in order to avoid media attention and potential legal claims.

Both of these types of behaviour sound like a cunt's trick.

[Cheggers]

I've had 3 tries at responding to this, but frankly am struggling to know where to begin...

 

I reckon we should just agree to disagree. There is no objectively right or wrong way to deal with these things. More than anything else, it's a question of opinion, conscience, and life philosophy in general. I do respect those of you who live by "do unto others as you would have others do unto you" irrespective of context or past experiences, and I certainly think it's a valuable yardstick, but I admit I am unwilling/unable to abide with it 100% of the time and sometimes want to get my own back.

 

Let the one without sins and all that!

 

I think agreeing to disagree is a reasonable conclusion

[Rocket88]

Well, he's coughed up [still grumbling] he insists he's not going to get the prop joint done, so I hope I'm around when it fails, and he pole vaults merrily through a hedge. What pisses me off most of all is that I sold him the car about 5 years ago, and it was mint, and I've watched it slowly deteriorate. In that time he's replaced the water pump [he moaned about the cost of that as well......] and 2 tyres.

As an aside, I've driven a few 190s and they all seem to be reluctant to kick down [auto obv] Is this a common fault [if it is a fault]

Bearing in mind how his has lasted, despite such epic neglect, I've decided to hunt one out for myself, as mint as I can afford, just to piss him off further.........