"Classic Insurance": Real product or marketing trick?

[Luxobarges_Are_Us]

In preparing to move back to England, I've realised that my no claims bonus will only expire a couple of days after my arrival (it doesn't seem that any insurers accept NCD notes older than two years). I'm obviously keen on buying a nice big barge ASAP, but the logical thing to do would be to get a hire car for 4-5 days in order to be able to go shite-hunting (as an added bonus, I have a Sixt loyalty card that often results in a nice upgrade, so it could be possible to shock sellers of scruffy old Sonatas by turning up in a brand-new Merc). Then I thought "sod the NCD rubbish, I'll just make sure to buy something 15+ years old and get myself a classic insurance policy".

 

Alas, all online quote systems I've tried have been either "unable to quote" or given normal-policy quotes from old-school underwriters like Saga, which, even with the NCD, is well over a grand...almost 3 times the Shitcover/tesco insurance price. Alright, I may be (just) under 30, but does this really prevent them from quoting me on a 2-litre Granada or whatever that has about as much raw POWA as a new Ibiza 1.2? Or is the "classic insurance" tag just a way to convince people that they should get bummed by some insurer that can't get "normal" customers anymore? There were also a few policies that were restricted to those owning (and insuring!) another car (what's the point of mileage limits, then?).

 

If the above wasn't bad enough, some non-classic insurance policies seem to exclude cars older than 16 years old!

 

Of course, it's possible to buy the first heap that I come across, insure it with Shitcover (which still costs about 600 quid) and then go looking for something that actually suits me, but can anyone enlighten me on the workings of classic insurance?

[Rod/b]

When i had classic insurance they wouldn't accept NCB anyway. It had limited mileage usage (which they actually asked for speedo readings) and had to be a second car (ie needed to be one other car in the household). Worked out cheap mind.

[Luxobarges_Are_Us]

yes, NCD avoidance was the main reason I thought of classic insurance. But having to own another car is bonkers when there's a mileage limit- I mean if you were going to be commuting 120 miles a day, you'd reach the 7500 maximum in 2.5 months (although, now that you mention it, it may be cheaper to just buy a Group 1 wreck and insure it as a way of both being eligible for a classic policy AND keeping the NCD).

[Guest Leonard Hatred]

Disconnect the speedo.

[skattrd]

As far as I can gather most classic policies want you to have the classic as a second car, so if I was you I'd look at buying a cheap (grp1/2) car as your official modern/daily.

Then you can get a classic policy for whatever you want.... As said most will be limited mileage so disconnect speedo. I bought a digital gps speedo for motors with broken speedo's, plugs in to fag lighter and sits on the dash.

 

I have a mixed (modern/classic) policy which works out at £26 a year for me to insure a classic but I need to have at least one "modern" on it, which I pay £3-400 to insure; In total I pay £550 for 8 cars This however doesn't use NCB (so yours would lapse) and you would still need a cheap/modern/low insurance car to get something like that. On the plus side though some mixed policy have unlimited mileage on everything..

 

If I was you I'd get a cheap to insure shitter (I'd go for a Perodua Nippa or small diesel) just to keep the NCB on, and then get a classic policy on an old Jag/Merc/whatever.

[Rod/b]

Skattrd, which provider do you use?

[skattrd]

Skattrd, which provider do you use?

 

Footman james, but Peter James and others do similar policies. You need to phone for a quote as they don't quote for this sort of thing online.

[HereHareHere]

Do you live amongst gypsies, tramps and thieves in a solvent-fuelled urban wasteland (eg Chiswick W4)?

 

If so and you intend to park on the street, it is my experience that no classic-policy insurer will offer you a quote under four figures.

[dieselnutjob]

I only pay £100 per year to insure the 604, but it is as a second car.

I got it through moneysupermarket or confused, I can't remember which.

 

If it wasn't on as a second car then the cost would go through the roof.

 

Maybe the cheapest thing is to get something that's group one like an old Fiat Panda, Fiesta 950cc, Saxo 1.0 or whatever and insure that full fat, and then get the second car classic insurance for your barge.

[Luxobarges_Are_Us]

Cheers for the suggestions- keep 'em coming!

 

I guess I'll probably start off staying in Leicester (BTW, isn't it the mecca of AS?) for a while, but I need to eventually get a job that's semi-relevant to my degree and work experience, so I have to keep my location options open. Of course there are pikeys there, but I guess it's not THAT bad. I guess the most likely scenario is to get a place without a garage but with a driveway.

 

Looks like I can get the "modern" premium down to about 400 quid if I buy a Seicento or some other hateful little thing, and I guess I need another 250 for a semi-knackered one...Therefore not a bad route to go down, because I can buy whichever old thing takes my fancy, and I wouldn't be totally shafted through lack of NCD if I ended up with something that was 12-13 years old.

[Cavcraft]

Everyone's circumstances are different obviously but the first quote I tried for the Cortina (based on no no claims bonus, the car being kept in a carpark and a 5,000 mile per annum basis) was £119.50 TPFT from Lancaster, so they may be worth a bash.

[dieselnutjob]

Looks like I can get the "modern" premium down to about 400 quid if I buy a Seicento or some other hateful little thing, and I guess I need another 250 for a semi-knackered one...Therefore not a bad route to go down, because I can buy whichever old thing takes my fancy, and I wouldn't be totally shafted through lack of NCD if I ended up with something that was 12-13 years old.

 

the downside with this approach is that you need two lots of road tax. But then don't some of these modern tiny cars get really cheap tax as well?

My neighbour was telling me he only pays £30 a year tax for their 1.4 diesel

or get something that has a tiny engine and is pre 1973.

 

something like an AX or a 106 is actually quite fun for hooning around in and useful when the barge spectacularly fails its MOT or whatever.

[Luxobarges_Are_Us]

oh bollox! Hadn't thought of road tax. IIRC, it used to be something like 120 quid a year for under 1500cc...and I guess you really have to have it, as the insurers will start asking questions if there needs to be a claim under the classic policy...

 

I have to confess I quite like the AX- I 'd rented one many moons ago, and it really was fun to drive... It's just that I always approach small cars with caution as I have been traumatised from an experience in my youth when I bought a Mk2 Fiesta. I only managed to live with it for 10 days before I went out and bought an 820...As I already had the Fester, it was left decaying on the driveway for a year owing to the useful "driving other cars" clause in its insurance!

[dieselnutjob]

I suppose that if the small car is 2002 or newer (I think) then it's emissions based, so if it's tiny it might get really cheap tax as well as cheap insurance

[Luxobarges_Are_Us]

true, but the little buggers tend to hold their value quite well (owing to the perception that they are "cheaper to insure"- yes, you save fifty quid a year and you have to endure the bloody thing for 365 days), so the purchase price of a car that looks at least somewhat useable would be higher...

[meggersdog]

From 2001 the emissions are on the V5.

At the weekend I sold an X300 Jaguar to a young lad (he's 20) and because it's a 15 year old Jag I told he should try getting a classic policy.He has a company car so it would be a second car even so a classic policy was more than the £1100 he was quoted for a normal policy.I think that was a good quote considering my nextdoor neighbour's grandson,who's 19, pays almost two grand for a Fiesta.

[sporty-shite]

I've got the XR2 on a classic policy as my only car, they count the second car as me being named driver on Mrs S's Alfa. Unlimited mileage, commuting cover and driving other cars. They even asked if it woiuld be my daily, and I told them it would. £136pa with no no claims.

 

This is with Footman 'James, but all my best quotes were through phoning brokers who advertise in PC. On a side issue, swiftcover.com were cheapest by far on the Alfa when I went through their website. Took £180+ off the cheapest comparison site.

 

Also, an insurance broker told me, on the quiet, that if you renew a policy then cancel within the 14 days cooling off period, this will restore your NCB, so you can effectively have another 2 years "off".

[Claypole]

So you need something to insure to keep your NCD then you can use it when you do buy a car?

[Luxobarges_Are_Us]

So you need something to insure to keep your NCD then you can use it when you do buy a car?

 

I'm a bit baffled really... I hate the ABI cartel with a passion!

I was thinking about ditching the whole NCD concept and just sticking to classic insurance. However, since I'm going to be living on my own for the foreseeable future (and I don't really want to bother more my mate who's been receiving ridiculous amounts of post on my behalf while I'm away), a classic policy doesn't really seem to work as I only need one car. On the other hand, the normal policy quotes I've been getting have all been on the high side, so it seems sensible to buy a little, barely functioning car and just use it as a way of becoming eligible for a classic policy and maintain my NCD into the bargain.

[Pillock]

Exactly the scenario I find myself in - I need a "modern" car within the next few months, or I lose my NCB as it's been nearly two years since I used it. Either that or insure the BMW as a regular car which looks to be £800 min.

 

Having said that, Footman James realised they fucked up - I insured my Golf GTI on a classic policy, complete with limited mileage and ClubGTI membership. £220. Changed it to the BMW mid-term and they just charged the admin fee - I've since been racking up the miles since they have no idea how many it's done, and obviously my ClubGTI membership has no bearing on the E36. So the renewal has come through at £330. Stuff that, I can insure a "modern" diesel hatch for £400 or so and pay half the road tax on it.

[Luxobarges_Are_Us]

Exactly the scenario I find myself in - I need a "modern" car within the next few months, or I lose my NCB as it's been nearly two years since I used it. Either that or insure the BMW as a regular car which looks to be £800 min.

 

Having said that, Footman James realised they fucked up - I insured my Golf GTI on a classic policy, complete with limited mileage and ClubGTI membership. £220. Changed it to the BMW mid-term and they just charged the admin fee - I've since been racking up the miles since they have no idea how many it's done, and obviously my ClubGTI membership has no bearing on the E36. So the renewal has come through at £330. Stuff that, I can insure a "modern" diesel hatch for £400 or so and pay half the road tax on it.

 

I think that you should definitely consider the "14-day cooling-off" trick mentioned earlier in this thread. I had also thought about it, but in my case it still is quite a bit of hassle, as I don't have a car on which I can readily practise it.

[Rhythm Thief]

I pay £112 fully comp on my 1968 AMi 6, with Peter james insurance. It's not a limited mileage policy (at least, it wasn't mentioned and I did tell them I used it as my daily car) and I haven't been asked for proof of NCD. There's no point to this post, I just thought it might help.

[Luxobarges_Are_Us]

I pay £112 fully comp on my 1968 AMi 6, with Peter james insurance. It's not a limited mileage policy (at least, it wasn't mentioned and I did tell them I used it as my daily car) and I haven't been asked for proof of NCD. There's no point to this post, I just thought it might help.

 

Of course there IS a point to your post! The point is that there is at least one classic policy that doesn't require the holder to insure a modern car, too.

 

I'll give them a call and see what they say!

[gtd2000]

Where are you moving back from? Did you insure a vehicle there?

 

I'm sure that there is a new EU law (or suchlike) that prohibits the insurance companies from saying your earned NCB expires now - I'd double check this but I heard that last year from some of my German friends.

 

I had no UK insurance for many years and when I finally took out a policy (with supposedly expired NCB) back in 2008 they accepted my then 3+ years old proof of NCB for a car I used for 2 months.

 

I think they use robots to check the proof but of course YMMV.

[gtd2000]

Forgot to say that I was insured with Swiftcover since 2008 - cheapest by far for me - even this year when I renewed I used them but I got a quote via http://www.beatthatquote.com which gives £25 or £30 cash back after a couple of months. Took me down to £138 for my Hyundai Coupe SE 2.0L - fully comprehensive.

 

Also note that Comprehensive cover is sometimes the same price or even cheaper than TPF&T

[Luxobarges_Are_Us]

Where are you moving back from? Did you insure a vehicle there?

 

I did a fair bit of travelling, but I'm originally from Greece so my "permanent address" was there. Was driving my mom's Sirion for a while, but cover in Greece is vehicle-based, so I didn't even reach the heady heights of being a "named driver".

 

I'm sure that there is a new EU law (or suchlike) that prohibits the insurance companies from saying your earned NCB expires now - I'd double check this but I heard that last year from some of my German friends.

 

The UK normally delays the implementation of EU directives, and waters down their provisions. It is my undestanding that governments usually are very friendly with the ABI. That (and not the ambulance-chasers, uninsured drivers or whatever else claimed by the man down the pub) is why the same driver pays 3 times more to insure the same car in rural Linconshire than they would in Madrid!

[gtd2000]

Ah OK - I know that German/Austrian NCB is accepted by UK insurance companies, as several of my colleagues (I work for a German Co.) have used their's when insuring vehicles bought and used in the UK.

 

Knowing the Spanish attitudes towards accidents and liabilities (e.g. who cares?) one would could assume any policy wouldn't cover much - hence the lower premiums?

 

As for EU insurance rates - my Austrian colleagues paid more per month than I pay for my annual premium in the UK. My German colleagues found it to be around a third of their rates.

[Luxobarges_Are_Us]

Knowing the Spanish attitudes towards accidents and liabilities (e.g. who cares?) one would could assume any policy wouldn't cover much - hence the lower premiums?

 

There's all kinds of types. Of course, you're free to get third-party only cover, which, of course, is the most appropriate level for a shiteist...and you can't do it in the UK!

When I'm shopping around for insurance, I just want a policy that will let me drive legally and pay out in case I cause some spectacularly catastrophic accident (if I have a small bump, I'd much rather pay the other driver the cost of getting it sorted as and when s/he wants).

 

As for EU insurance rates - my Austrian colleagues paid more per month than I pay for my annual premium in the UK. My German colleagues found it to be around a third of their rates.

 

Well, 188 quid is hardly typical. In my case, 6 years NCD only get it down to 400 for a 1.0 or 600 for a half-decent motor. And if I don't manage to find a house in the neighbourhood I'm thinking of and have to rent in the next one (which is not more dangerous, or actually that much different in any respect), I can expect a nice 30% increase on top of that.

 

Edited to add: read your post again and it's 138!! Goodness gracious me, how is that even possible? what am I doing RONG?

[gtd2000]

£138 was pretty good I have to say but I was paying £119 per year (for two years) for my previous shiter fully comp (Proton Persona 1.3 Si).

 

I think the logic today is that if you only insure third party/tpft you must be a very dodgy bet - hence the higher premium - my stance is that I take the fully comp but have no intention of ever claiming on it as most cars I buy don't cost a lost of money - or should I say don't Costa lot of money

 

I normally use http://www.moneysupermarket.com to do a comparison but I think they are all pretty much about the same these days.

 

Anyway, it's time for bed here in Cowboy land - night all

 

You could always send in the Greek no claims discount and see what they say