I am going to buy a 2011 Mercedes S500...

[Peter C]

.... but not until the year 2028, for the equivalent of £500.

 

I expect the wheel arches to be rusty, with holes in the front wings. The sills will be patched with Hammerite and various pieces of trim will be missing. Alloys will be kerbed and tyres will be borderline legal.

 

The interior will be tired but the leather will be intact and most of the electrics will still work. The a/c will be long gone as will the voice operated controls.

 

The engine will initially run on 7 cylinders, with the eighth kicking in once the temperature gets past 60 degrees. Once warm, there will be idling issues. The seven speed autobox will be jerky and leaking ATF all over the underside. Suspension will clonk and the steering will groan.

 

Still, a lot of car for £500.

 

[messerschmitt owner]

That'll be a long time after I buy a 2005/6 Citroen C6 for £300. I expect this to be in 2016, and expect my Citroen to have dropped windows, buttons not working, a leaky sunroof, cracked leather upholstery, a couple of bits of trim missing, a drooping rooflining, at least three dashboard warning lamps visible at all times (but not necessarily the same three all the time), a broken glovebox hinge, but a wedge of history from the first careful owner and nothing at all from the four that followed him, all of whom kept the car for exactly three months each, two and a half of which it was on Ebay for what they had paid, before it was finally sold for half to get rid of it. It'll come with budget supersaver tyres and the bulb for the low tyre pressure warning will have been removed.

[dieselnutjob]

Peugeot 607s are now being scrapped because of electrical issues that people can't be arsed to diagnose.

[face]

The thing is, come 2028, the SL's from the 70's and 80's will probably be in much better working condition than a 2011 vintage

[Peter C]

Peugeot 607s are now being scrapped because of electrical issues that people can't be arsed to diagnose.

 

A lot of post 2000 built cars will be scrapped well before their engines expire or bodywork corrodes due to electrical issues.

 

Take old Mercs, for example:

 

My W123 230E has a basic fuel injection system, electronic ignition with a distributor and that's it.

 

My previous W124s had a more complicated fuel injection system, with idle control valves and other gubbins that go wrong.

 

My current W124 E200, fitted with the later 16 valve engine, has coil packs in place of a distributor and sensors for everything. It runs sweet but once it stops it will be a swine to fix.

 

Yes modern electronics do bring benefits when it comes to emissions, economy and performance but as far as long term liability is concerned, I am keeping my old W123.

[Albert Ross]

Wouldn't it be great to buy up loads of these disposable "supercars" and put them in a "garden" rather like the Kraut with the crispy Roller did. Imagine a little grotto with a Quattroporte left with all of it's "quattro portes" open to the elements, Range Rover Sport left half in a pond, windows open, a couple of these big Mercs, a Maybach, R-R Phantom, some bigger Beemers, Jags, Audis, etc... chortle. And run around in a Reliant Ant, as it seems to just keep on going. I would love to do it. millions of quids "worth" of metal, just left to rot.

[Peter C]

You don't need to dunk a modern Merc in a pond to get it to rot! Just leave it locked and parked up on your drive for a few years.

[r.welfare]

I thought M-B had finally got their act together, and started fully galvanising their cars from around late 2004 onwards? Why it took them so long (Porsche have been doing it since '74, Audi since '85, etc) is beyond me, but having said that when I read the W210 was designed to be a full 25% cheaper to produce than the W124, it kind-of answers that question.

 

I think I'll be steering clear of anything that's diesel and EU4 compliant - DPF's seem to be a pain in the arse.

[Gompo]

It's a shame the current S-Class looks a bit cack, although atleast that'll mean it will be more shite in 20 years time.

 

There should be some about though. The W221 is very popular in London although I'm guessing most of them are private hire/chauffeur efforts.

[warren t claim]

I can see DMF failure being a prime cause of scrapping cars in the near future.

[Tayne]

.

[HillmanImp]

I have been waiting for the BMW Z3M coupe to drop for years but I don't think they will. Good ones seem to still go for about 12 which is twice what i could ever afford.

 

Quite tempted by a Volvo C70 though. You can pick them up pretty cheap these days if you look around. Have no idea what they are like to drive though. Probably gash. Not wanting to be a girl i love the look of them. They still look modern whilst keeping the proper Volvo 'Pink Panther' look.

[Pete-M]

I thought M-B had finally got their act together, and started fully galvanising their cars from around late 2004 onwards? Why it took them so long (Porsche have been doing it since '74, Audi since '85, etc) is beyond me, but having said that when I read the W210 was designed to be a full 25% cheaper to produce than the W124, it kind-of answers that question.

 

M-Bs have always rusted, it's just that some rust a lot less than others.

 

As for Porsche's galvanising, it wasn't very good in the '80s. Check everywhere on '84-86 911s.. especially the inner sills.

 

Don't see rusty Fiats nowadays though.

 

I've got a mild hankering for a W210 E55...

[overheadvalve]

It's a sad idea but today's modern (new) cars will, i feel simply not be around to make the Shite charts.

I think that the government will outlaw cars with dodgy (i.e. non working) parts connected to emissions like idle conrol vavles and i believe that we will see vosa frequently doing spot checks to check emissions and roadworthiness etc. Fix it within a week or scrap it will probably be the tagline.

I think oil leaks will become a part of the mot too, sadly.

I am somewhat cynical with regard to the powers that be in government, my friendly mot man is too. He feels that he will not be able to bend the rules (on this eco shit) for much longer and these /\ are his reasons.

The golden age of shite motoring is here and now, enjoy it whilst you can i say.

We, the country not me personally (i'm sure you understand) scrap around 2 million cars a year apparently, all manufacturers have to do is to stop making vital parts for older cars, pretty much like vag do now, or make cars with dodgy expensive to fault find and fix electrics like Peugeot, Citroen and Renault do now.

I tried getting parts for a 1984 Ur Quattro from the main dealers, the vast majority are obsolete. Why would you go to a main dealers anyway? well no one else seems to do track rod ends for my brothers Quattro, wankers i know!

I think i'm going the other way i might buy a mid 60's VW Beetle, as a keeper to blat around in perfect shite forever.

Plenty of pattern parts made by some one else.

Mind you i think Mercedes are a little better, iirc you can still get seat cloth (to repair) for your 1954 Mercedes 180

[Guest Leonard Hatred]

I tried getting parts for a 1984 Ur Quattro from the main dealers, the vast majority are obsolete. Why would you go to a main dealers anyway? well no one else seems to do track rod ends for my brothers Quattro, wankers i know!

 

http://www.quattrocorner.com/parts.htm ?

[Torsten2001]

We use Mercedes S320's at work and my advice is to NEVER buy one unless it has full warranty, my advice on Mercedes Viano's is NEVER buy one, they are proper shit. They need a lot or warranty work and Merc service and customer relations are woeful!

Alas we need them for R'n'B people but we're replacing one S320 with a new XJ-L Jaguar, which is a proper drivers car.

[dieselnutjob]

they only stopped making brand new Peugeot 504s a couple of years ago

I should have bought one and imported it

I could have dipped the whole thing in waxoyl from new and it would probably last 40 years if looked after properly

it could have been my last ever car

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

The cars to buy are late eighties/pre 1993 stuff. No airbags, no catalyst and probably no ABS - or at least ABS you can throw in the bin. If you can find one, a 1990 2 litre Carlton, 525i, 230E etc are all pleasant trams that are still fast enough, comfy and cheap to fix.

Trouble is, they're dying out rapidly which is why I've saved one ('89 530i) as a keeper along with a few spare parts. I've kept it nice for 6 years or so, waxoyl it every now and ten, do 6000 mile oil changes and VOSA can go fuck themselves.

 

If you need to know how mad the western world is.......

 

 

 

[Autoplas]

I thought M-B had finally got their act together, and started fully galvanising their cars from around late 2004 onwards? Why it took them so long (Porsche have been doing it since '74, Audi since '85, etc) is beyond me, but having said that when I read the W210 was designed to be a full 25% cheaper to produce than the W124, it kind-of answers that question.

 

I think I'll be steering clear of anything that's diesel and EU4 compliant - DPF's seem to be a pain in the arse.

 

Yes they did

 

On the W211 (E-class), all body panels forward of the cabin are aluminium as is the boot

 

The rust issues were on the W210 not the W211 on. For a short while, Mercedes did get it wrong and they did have a rust problem. For a short while.

 

Seems to have developed into a bit of an urban myth that all 'modern' Mercedes will rust and have less reliable mechanics,'the bean counters have taken over' and similar rubbbish from those who don't like Mercedes. It is just wrong I'm afraid.

 

Avoid the W210, but the W211 is superior in every way to anything in its class as is the W212.

[Torsten2001]

Seems to have developed into a bit of an urban myth that all 'modern' Mercedes will rust and have less reliable mechanics,'the bean counters have taken over' and similar rubbbish from those who don't like Mercedes. It is just wrong I'm afraid.

 

Avoid the W210, but the W211 is superior in every way to anything in its class as is the W212.

 

Horse cack!

Our fleet has included within the last year S320L / A8 / XJ / 735L Range Vogue & Sport, what needed the most warranty? Mercedes, one is on its 2nd Gearbox, one has a new dif.

We have 2 2010 E250 diesels, both were off the road with fueling problems within 3,000 miles, one was off the road for 6 weeks, one for 4 weeks. We had to fight Merc initially as they said it wasn't a warranty issue (this is normal).

People carriers consist of VW Caravelle, Mercedes Viano, Renault Grand espace 2.0, VW Shuttle. Renaults replaced Previas but have proved to be excellent as have the VW's, Mercedes Vianos are just woefully built, electrical faults with door relays, driver displays, trim falling off, windows being stuck open. They always seem to move under their own steam though.

 

Mercedes quality is I'm afraid, pretty poor. BMW, VW & Audi are just better cars and I prefer Mercedes, I have to say Jag and RR are better because we have had a better experience with them.

The E250's have no equivalent on the fleet but everybody would drive a Passat in preference.

Above all though Mercedes customer service is just dreadful. Their attitude stinks so much that we have gone elsewhere when we can in terms of vehicle acquisition. Crafters have replaced Sprinters (regular HGF), Caravelles are replacing Vianos, BMW will relace the E250, an S320 will be lost to a new XJ-L in March. We have pointed quality issues out to the Mercedes Reps but the problems remain.

[Magnificent Rustbucket]

I thought M-B had finally got their act together, and started fully galvanising their cars from around late 2004 onwards? Why it took them so long (Porsche have been doing it since '74, Audi since '85, etc) is beyond me, but having said that when I read the W210 was designed to be a full 25% cheaper to produce than the W124, it kind-of answers that question.

 

I think I'll be steering clear of anything that's diesel and EU4 compliant - DPF's seem to be a pain in the arse.

 

Yes they did

 

On the W211 (E-class), all body panels forward of the cabin are aluminium as is the boot

 

The rust issues were on the W210 not the W211 on. For a short while, Mercedes did get it wrong and they did have a rust problem. For a short while.

 

Seems to have developed into a bit of an urban myth that all 'modern' Mercedes will rust and have less reliable mechanics,'the bean counters have taken over' and similar rubbbish from those who don't like Mercedes. It is just wrong I'm afraid.

 

Avoid the W210, but the W211 is superior in every way to anything in its class as is the W212.

I suppose you can be lucky or unlucky with cars but my brother has had several Mercedes over the last ten years and all of them have suffered appalling rust and electrical problems, so for him the stories have been very far from an urban myth. His last Merc, a W220 S500 lwb, was so taking the piss bad he has moved to Jaguar and been pleased with the huge leap in quality.

[Magnificent Rustbucket]

Seems to have developed into a bit of an urban myth that all 'modern' Mercedes will rust and have less reliable mechanics,'the bean counters have taken over' and similar rubbbish from those who don't like Mercedes. It is just wrong I'm afraid.

 

Avoid the W210, but the W211 is superior in every way to anything in its class as is the W212.

 

Horse cack!

Our fleet has included within the last year S320L / A8 / XJ / 735L Range Vogue & Sport, what needed the most warranty? Mercedes, one is on its 2nd Gearbox, one has a new dif.

We have 2 2010 E250 diesels, both were off the road with fueling problems within 3,000 miles, one was off the road for 6 weeks, one for 4 weeks. We had to fight Merc initially as they said it wasn't a warranty issue (this is normal).

People carriers consist of VW Caravelle, Mercedes Viano, Renault Grand espace 2.0, VW Shuttle. Renaults replaced Previas but have proved to be excellent as have the VW's, Mercedes Vianos are just woefully built, electrical faults with door relays, driver displays, trim falling off, windows being stuck open. They always seem to move under their own steam though.

 

Mercedes quality is I'm afraid, pretty poor. BMW, VW & Audi are just better cars and I prefer Mercedes, I have to say Jag and RR are better because we have had a better experience with them.

The E250's have no equivalent on the fleet but everybody would drive a Passat in preference.

Above all though Mercedes customer service is just dreadful. Their attitude stinks so much that we have gone elsewhere when we can in terms of vehicle acquisition. Crafters have replaced Sprinters (regular HGF), Caravelles are replacing Vianos, BMW will relace the E250, an S320 will be lost to a new XJ-L in March. We have pointed quality issues out to the Mercedes Reps but the problems remain.

 

You posted at the same time as me, but your experiences are very similar to my brother's. His S500 was truly dreadful. It suffered a huge number and variety of electrical problems which recurred and were never fixed, despite spending weeks off the road stricken with warranty work. The aircon spent more time broken than working and he simply abandoned it in the end. The electric windows had an up a centimetre, down a centimetre nervous twitch every time they were used - sometimes for up to a minute, sometimes they went down and stayed down and wouldn't come back up. That was great in the rain. When they did this all the dash lights would come on at once then slowly dim... He didn't even dare to open the sunroof. The ABS failed and needed to be replaced twice - one time at huge cost, the other under warranty. Neither the seat heating nor cooling worked and the passengers would not move forwards - only backwards.

Then there was the rust. The bulkhead was so bad the footwells filled with water. There were rust blisters on all four wheel arches. There was a rust hole in the boot lid. The sills bubbled on bith sides. This car was made in 2002 and sold in 2007!

Before this he has a late S320 of the previous series. That didn't seem to rust quite so badly but had lots of electrical problems and stranded him several times with an electrical problem no one could find. Again, a newish car. His wife had an SLK. That just rusted.

[Torsten2001]

We did have a 2002 car which was almost entirely replaced, engine, box, dif, suspension, PAS. Unfortunately people just think that Mercedes is the pinnacle of automotive luxury so we have to have them!

[Albert Ross]

The best good Merc was the W126. The W124 was good, right up until they facelifted it. Then it all went tits up.

[Magnificent Rustbucket]

Agreed. I love the W126.

[Torsten2001]

^^^WHS

[warren t claim]

I'm surprised how well Mercedes have managed to keep their image intact over the electrical and corrosion problems they've suffered with. I'm old enough to remember Lancia sales being decimated almost overnight through similar issues causing them to withdraw from the UK market altogether.

[Albert Ross]

It's cos pikeys don't keep them long enough for it to be an issue.

[morris_ital_lover]

/\/\/\WHS/\/\/\

 

Not having had any direct contact with them on a day to day basis I was of the understanding that the issues lay with the lower end of the Merc's range, but it looks like I was wrong.

 

Certainly on the van front, merc sprinters et al always look alot more shagged when compared to similar vintage transits (i.e. evidence of much more body rust etc), but, if they are encountering cross range problems Jag needs to get ready to take their spot (OK, its just a dream ATM)!

 

m0rris

[Pete-M]

Mustard mitt, my experiences with Mercs haven't all been wonderful.

 

We've got '09 Vitos in work which are pretty fucked after 40k, embarrasingly so. Rattly gearboxes, shafted dashboards (top bit with heater controls has fallen apart on both) and a few other bits and bobs. However, as bad as this is, it's no worse than my 190E was. I wouldn't wish a 190E on anyone. My 190E almost soured my MB experience for good, yet people go on as if they're good. They're not.

 

I ran a W124 260E for nearly a year and it was great, a w126 500 SEL which was ace other than the rust, a W123 280TE which was a good thing other than the gearbox being a bit thumpy and a habit of snapping front coil springs. My brother is on his 4th or 5th E class and has never had any problem with any of 'em, and he does close to 70k a year.

 

I'd have another W126 and I've got the urge to try a W210 E55... and might do just that.