BMW sucks

[Alexg]

.com

 

Found on a random bored at work net surf

 

http://site.bmwsucks.com/index.php?user ... ea80185e7e

[pogweasel]

I bet Team_Shitz will love it.

[Cavcraft]

Seven reasons why BMW sucks...

•They still produce some ugly cars and cars with faults.

•In order to keep that share price rising they need ever greater profits. This means that they are now very expensive, playing on the significant fleet, rather than private ownership. This is OK while the residuals are good, but if they should start to slide...

•They are particularly expensive in the UK in comparison to other countries.

•Options are overpriced.

•They mismanaged the whole Rover fiasco.

•Their environmental credentials while superficially impressive are fundamentally flawed.

•As a company, they are a model of corporate arrogance and this ethos seems to rub off on most BMW drivers

 

I'm no BMW lover but most of the above seems to be a load of shit to be honest.

 

1) So do almost (if not all) other marques.

2) Must apply to any company with shareholders. Would it not also be fair to say that's crap because if they're expensive (and if they lose value rapidly they're less appealing) to the fleet market?

3) Nobody makes anyone buy yhem and are they really that much more than Jag, Audi or Merc?

4) Ditto all makers.

5) Probably true.

6) Name another manafacturer that isn't the same in this respect.

7) Debatable how their 'arrogance' rubs off onto the buyers. Althought a lot od BMW drivers do seem wankers at times.

[Station]

It's easy to feel bitter about BMW shitting on Rover, but that's business. Even if they saw them as a competitor, isn't that more reason to do this? It makes total sense. I doubt they saw Rover as a good business investment - I'm sure they're aware of how dodgy the past 40 years of BL, etc was.

[ashmicro]

That's just it, Station. If Rover had been as bad as the BL days, BMW would (a) never have bought it and ( not seen it as a threat. I was pretty cynical about the whole thing at the time, and I reckon I was right.

 

BMW axed the Maestro van, for example, which people and organisations were buying and there was a waiting list for. Vehicles of this type are a cash cow in the motor manufacturing business.

 

IMHO, BMW torpedoed Rover. But, as you say, that's business. Just not cricket.

[morris_ital_lover]

BMW saw an interesting prospect in Rover, that was to buy company and strip the assets, IIRC Rover was originally "saved" by the Phoenix Bastard brained wankers four after BMW wanted to just be shot of the whole affair, but BMW got what they wanted, MINI, and arious other brand names (riley/triumph/clubman/countryman) and left it that.

 

m0rris

[Lacy]

Business is business.....

 

As someone once quoted about Ford, They aren't in the business of making cars, they're in the business of making money; they just happen to do that by making cars.....

 

Some companies are more passionate about their products than others, though, and BMW have always struck me as better than most in that respect.

 

I have only ever owned two BMW's; a 1989 325 cabriolet and an E46 320 diesel.....both excellent cars and almost infallibly reliable and well built.

 

Their current line up of diesel engines (particularly the 2.0....180 odd BHP and mountain moving torque coupled with a zillion mpg) are engineering masterpieces..............

[ChinaTom]

Do they really get the mpg they claim? If I bought a 530d would it really return >40mpg under normal everyday driving? A friend of mine has an auto 520d company hack and he gets less than 40 on average - a far cry from the published stats. If they really are as good as they say, then a 60 reg 740d will be in the stable in 5 years time.

[Pete-M]

My brother had an E60 530d that didn't manage anywhere near BMW's stats. He used to get around 34 mpg from it, I got closer to 26. 26 isn't that good, as his infinately nicer to drive E39 528i used to get 28-30 with me driving.

 

The E60 didn't manage to get far between turbo and head replacements, but even when it was right it wasn't that good on juice. Quick enough for something fuelled by Dr. Diesel's Evil Invention.

 

Weird really, his E280 CDi Mercs have both averaged considerably more MPG than the BMW. Even I get 45 mpg from them.

[RedSparrow]

I know they were shitty with Rover, but they are a business.

 

I love my E30, its 21 years old and drives as well as a modern car. It is a little thirsty though.

[ChinaTom]

Is the 280 Merc a 4 or 6 pot? May be one to add to the maybe list.I've been playing with the idea of a CLS 320d, but then I really need an estate. I don't like searching for Mercs on Ebay - too many CL600's to tempt me.

 

My old man keeps threatening to by a new car (which means I'll take his Rover 75, which I genuinely adore). He may have a new 320d in the drive by the time I see him next, so I'll watch the mpg on that.

 

As for BMW's behaviour with Rover, we can moan all we like, but Rover was a lost cause long long ago - no-one with any business sense would have tried to make a go of it as a brand. I reckon they've probably paid back with the mini already. MG will be the subject of many a rant here before too long - my dear old Chinese friends still do not really "get" the MG thing in UK. They are expecting us to lap up the next offering and are perplexed as to the failure of the TF.

[RedSparrow]

I guess in this country the TF has been on the road for 15 years - British buyers see it as an old car, even before they find out how much in common it has with the old Metro.

 

Buyers of new cars don't want to buy an old design - so yes, I guess this is what the Chinese haven't quite realised yet.

[Alexg]

IMHO, BMW torpedoed Rover. But, as you say, that's business. Just not cricket.

A few years ago I was offered a job at a BMW dealer. I thought about, I would be earning a lot more than I am now, but refused. Main reason, I couldnt bring myself to sell for the company that IMO brought about the downfall of the British car industry, the industry that I dreamed of being a part of. Yes, I was being silly. Yes, I should accept its just business. Yes, it is time to forgive and forget - But I can't. For what they did I fucking hate BMW with a passion, and I probably always will....

[warren t claim]

My families E60 545 V8 has only covered 130,000 with one driver and already needs a replacement autobox due to a dodgy cooling system. The bits you touch are of a higher quality than a Ford but the engineering underpinning it seems worse than anything the blue oval sell.

 

Isn't BMW still owned by the Quandt family?

[Mr Lobster]

BMW didn't kill the British motor industry. They didn't help but the industry killed itself by spending 50 years with the wrong business model and building cars that not enough of the public wanted and that export markets weren't interested in and that weren't good enough for those markets.

 

BMW helped Rover along the way, Phoenix 4 finished the job.

[Pete-M]

Is the 280 Merc a 4 or 6 pot? May be one to add to the maybe list.

Lateish ones (like my brothers ones) are 3.0 V6. Make sure you get the 7 speed autobox if you ever buy one.

[Owain-328i]

I cant get more than 36 mpg out of my old dears e60 520d no matter how i drive it, its not helped by the autobox and being a 'touring'.

 

I can answer the question on autobox's failing rather early on in life though. BMW have this 'shit' they call 'lifetime' oil in all of their transmissions these days (been going on about a decade now), which aparantly never needs changing...... hmmmm yeah right.

 

Any good BMW forum will recommend changing transmission fluids every 30k even on transmissions with lifetime oil.

[eddyramrod]

For what they did I fucking hate BMW with a passion, and I probably always will....

Thank goodness! I thought I was the only one. At least mine is (additionally) born of having driven a modern one and owned a 1987 5-series, which on paper should have been perfect for me. The reality was like wearing someone else's shoes. It was never going to be right, so I flogged it off quick and spent the money on the 1978 Daimler I'd just bought. Now there's a car I would have liked to keep!

 

As for BMW drivers being idiots, just ask any trucker. Braking space? Nah, it's a truck, doesn't need braking space, I can get my 316 in there... yeah right. 316 weighs a ton, my ERF weighed 12 unladen. I win.

[Tayne]

.

[Richard]

Yes, but they were just beginning to get it right when BMW shafted them.

[Alexg]

Yes, but they were just beginning to get it right when BMW shafted them.

^ makes you wonder where it would be now if they had continued their relationship with Honda. But we'll never know....

 

OMG, I just thought- imagine a Rover based on the current Civic

[Mr Lobster]

They might have been getting some things right, but there wasn't the income to ever fund decent new models. BMW realised that the decent bits were Land Rover and the Mini brand.

 

When BMW took over they still had the 800 and Metro / 100 on sale even though they were in no way able to match the competition. The 600 wasn't a bad car (being mainly Honda) but fleet buyers and business wouldn't touch them because of the horrific depreciation. I remember being offered 6 month old top spec 620i models for about £6k each that were ex Thrifty car rental with full history and 12k miles back in about '99 but we couldn't get anyone to take them on even at that money.

 

When the Phoenix 4 bought Rover they had the potential to make it work. Instead they spent money developing a Le Mans entrant and building a supercar (the X Power thing or whatever it was called) that nobody wanted. If they had spent the money more wisely, they *might* still be with us. Instead they offered a massively overpriced Indian supermini that was light years behind the competition in every way other than price.

[Guest Leonard Hatred]

Actually the CityRover was comically overpriced, not far off the price of Pandas etc

I think it's nice that they went out with a bang, developing ridiculous cars like the ZT 260.

They might have survived a couple of years longer without doing that, but on the Honda Domani/Honda Civic/Rover 400/Rover 45's tenth terrible facelift, Project Driven to death.

[Station]

I thought the last line of MG cars was a good way to go out, the 75 was a really nice wafty car as well, and MGTF was also a really solid motor that handled well. Probably the only company who used the same wiper/indicator stalks over 20 years (apart from Honda - which were the same).

[Jazzy Jeff]

MGTF was also a really solid motor that handled well.

Solid motor? Are you on drugs?

[Guest Leonard Hatred]

I thought the last line of MG cars was a good way to go out, the 75 was a really nice wafty car as well, and MGTF was also a really solid motor that handled well. Probably the only company who used the same wiper/indicator stalks over 20 years (apart from Honda - which were the same).

Today's Land Rover Defender still has what I think are Rover SD1 stalks.

[Alexg]

MGTF was also a really solid motor that handled well.

Solid motor? Are you on drugs?

suprisingly the TF has a 4 star safety rating. Though the interior hardly felt solid...

[myglaren]

I had an Accord 2.0 iLS that I thought was fine once I got used to it and expect the 200 would have been the same.

Drivers seat was a torture instrument for the first couple of months and it was very sluggish until I learned to boot it around.

 

Last weekend I passed a ZT estate (I'm sure it was badged ZTF?) on the A1M south, crawling along at 50.

Then another, or possibly the same one, on the A1M north the following evening.

I thought they were supposed to be quick?

[Alexg]

Some were quick, some were average depending on engne choice. All drive and handle well. I overtook a 911 turbo the other day doing 60, but I bet it's still fast....

[ashmicro]

Last weekend I passed a ZT estate (I'm sure it was badged ZTF?)

That'll have been "ZT-T"