K-Series headgaskets

[garethj]

A bloke in work has a habit of buying Rover 400s, he's now on his third at least and the previous ones have all been junked due to headgaskets going.

 

There's almost more about K Series headgaskets on the www than there is about porn, so can anyone give me a concise explanation of how to keep your headgasket in good shape? I recall there was some extra coolant sensor you could fit or something?

 

I know that the best way to avoid the failure is not to buy the damn car but he's pretty much addicted to them. Trouble is that when the HG goes again, it's not worth throwing £500-£800 at a repair when the car is barely worth £400 to buy.

 

Is there a compression test or leakdown test that's worth doing before buying his next one?

 

It's this sort btw

[dollywobbler]

Why doesn't he just opt for a 1.6 with the Honda engine?

 

The main issue is infrequent coolant changes and thrashing when the engine is still cool. That and the fact that radiators can literally fall apart. As with most things, maintenance is the key, though the rather compromised design means that HGF isn't necessarily impossible to eradicate.

 

Have to say though, I would have thought it'd make more sense to get a head gasket changed than keep just junking the cars.

[Rocket88]

Normal stuff; Check rad, thermostat, water pump, change coolant every year. One of the easiest way to tell if it's on the way out, is to run it up until thermosat is open, then feel the top hose. If it's rigid, the system is pressurising, and the Herman Goering it's probably fooked

[Station]

As soon as he gets the car, he should just check the head and get it skimmed if it needs it, then put a Payen multi-layered head gasket on. There have been only a hand ful reported once this is done.

 

Also jack up the back end, bleed the engine pipe coolant bleed screw, then the valve on the bulkhead, then the screw on the radiator.

 

I had mine go again but it wasn't bled properly. TBH, I'd just sack off KSeries as they are COMPLETE nightmares because the manufacturer = SHIT, as much as I like them, I'll probably never own another again.

[garethj]

Why doesn't he just opt for a 1.6 with the Honda engine?

How do you tell which ones they are? I'm guessing there's a price premium?

Normal stuff; Check rad, thermostat, water pump, change coolant every year. One of the easiest way to tell if it's on the way out, is to run it up until thermosat is open, then feel the top hose. If it's rigid, the system is pressurising, and the Herman Goering it's probably fooked

Good tip, thanks.

As soon as he gets the car, he should just check the head and get it skimmed if it needs it, then put a Payen multi-layered head gasket on. There have been only a hand ful reported once this is done.

Maybe, but that's several hundred quid innit? It's still probably worth doing nothing and waiting for it to blow up, financially speaking. Although it would be handy to be able to check before buying his next one.

Also jack up the back end, bleed the engine pipe coolant bleed screw, then the valve on the bulkhead, then the screw on the radiator.

Ta, I'll pass that on. Sounds like a ballache to do so I can believe it’s not always done.

I had mine go again but it wasn't bled properly. TBH, I'd just sack off KSeries as they are COMPLETE nightmares because the manufacturer = SHIT, as much as I like them, I'll probably never own another again.

I concur

[Cavcraft]

I think any from this shape on badged as 416 had a Honda engine.

 

I had one, it cracked the block.

[dollywobbler]

I think any from this shape on badged as 416 had a Honda engine.

 

I had one, it cracked the block.

Yup. Any 416. With the later shape, only the Auto had a Honda engine. But as you point out, any engine can go wrong. I mean, lots of BMWs blow head gaskets but you don't get people going on about it all the time.

[Station]

My ex's MGF is already having overheating problems 500 miles after the last head gasket change. I'm hoping the engine does warp beyond use so she will get rid of it.

She's done just less than 5000 miles since 2007 when she bought it. An airlock keeps appearing in the engine to rad piping, the heater goes cold when you corner.

Nothing is quite like keeping one eye on the road and the other on the temp gauge.

[meggersdog]

Easiest way to tell the difference regarding the engines is the layout.The Honda engine has the cam cover on the passengers side and the gearbox on the drivers side the Rover engine is the other way round.

[ashmicro]

As others have said, change the coolant every year, and use the OAT type coolant. I do this, and I've had quite a few K Series cars over the years - never blew a gasket. I look after my mates Rover 25 too (we bought our cars the same day) and his is OK as well.

[Milford Cubicle]

I think any from this shape on badged as 416 had a Honda engine.

 

I had one, it cracked the block.

Yup. Any 416. With the later shape, only the Auto had a Honda engine. But as you point out, any engine can go wrong. I mean, lots of BMWs blow head gaskets but you don't get people going on about it all the time.

The Honda D16 isn't infallible either, as Cavette suggests. it has a low coolant capacity like the K-series and will blow a head gasket quite easily.

 

The 1.4s don't seem to be as HGF prone as the enlarged Ks, your workmate must have bought a few wrong 'uns.

[Rusty Pelican]

And they Imps had H/G problems ( having said that mines just gone )

[Station]

I didn't even check the coolant in my Cavalier from buying it to getting rid of it (three years). All I'm saying is, it's a PITA having to check these things so religiously (every day).

[Guest]

The main issue is the cost/difficulty of a "proper" repair rather than how often it does it - 8-valve Astras can blow them all the time, but they just get fixed.

 

One interesting bit of trivia is that on later ones, they did some clever engineering to reduce the coolant capacity, which in turn means that even less coolant has to be lost before you reach the limits. Puzzled as to why they thought that was a good idea.

[Cavcraft]

Don't the five layer headgaskets mean there's more room for error though? Seem to recall the crucial thing with K-series headgaskets is that they have to be lined up with precise tolerances and the fiver layer gaskets could sort of 'cure' this?

 

Incidentally has anyone else spotted vendors of later model versions advertising them as 'BMW engines and not MG Rover'? Surely this is complete bollocks?

[Station]

Think the multi layered gaskety thingies have a proper impregnated bead/seal thing, the centre layer has proper fire rings for the cylinders, and the layers sorta fills in the gaps when it's torqued if the head is slightly warped/pitted from it's 20th 5000 kelvin overheating session. They appear to work anyway.

There's loads of theories including the old plastic dowels replaced with metal ones ... to stop the head from moving . The latest one is the thermostat plumbing, which means when it opens, the hot engine is flushed with radiator cooled water, which leads to possible thermo-shock due to rapid temp changes. I think the Rover's suffer from neglect and checking water, and the MGF's suffer from near impossible bleeding/airlocks due to the coolant hose plumbing.

I'm not sure if the Elise chappies get the same problem as the MGF's do, which probably points to most as not doing the standard checks (which is common territory with Lotus').