I'll get round to it at some point - The ongoing saga of The Green Bastard

[wesacosa]

2 minutes ago, Rust Collector said:

There’s a new thermostat in here; you’ll have to take my word for it.

On to the water pump then. They’re the same, but different:

But I think they will work. I don’t think anything fastens into the hole that’s missing. Possibly.

Idler pulley, again, the same but different:

The new one is plastic, presumably to save money. The old timing kit was INA, and so is the new one, so it’s interesting* to see that there are some differences between the two.

Idler and water pump fitted:

This was my regular reminder that I need to buy a tap socket, as chasing the threads was a ball ache. Watch me forget to order one, and have this thought next time.

Next up, the tensioner went on:

Top Tip: don’t do what I did when removing it, and accidentally completely undo the Allen screw, causing the tensioner bolt to fall off. Instead, undo the Allen bolt (red) by one turn, then use a socket to turn the 10mm bolt (green) all the way clockwise. That will lock the tensioner in the ‘released’ position. Conversely, turning the 10mm bolt all the way anti-clockwise will allow the tensioner to tighten itself once the new belt is on.

Next I transferred my marks to the new belt:

Then fitted it:

Then realised I left the engine mount cradle thing off . Bollocks. Oh well, I do things right because I do them twice…

I found that the cradle didn’t want to go home with the tensioner bolt refitted, so I had to remove the rubber mount from the chassis leg. I’d left it in place as I was convinced the bolts/nuts would snap if I tried to remove it. However, in life’s quest to forever prove me wrong, it came out effortlessly.

Big bastard mount thing on. Again, in the spirit of doing things twice, I tightened this down… turns out you can’t get enough sideways movement in the timing belt on the idler to fit it if you do this, so I had to back out all the bolts again after I did this.

Round 2:

I did the required turns of the engine to set the tensioner; no valves were knowingly harmed in the process, and the timing bolts/drill bit went back in place. Whilst the belt is no longer slack, I didn’t think the tensioner moved that much… What do you reckon @wesacosa?

Ive turned it over loads since and it keeps in time, I just thought the tensioner would move more. Knowing that it’s now locked off and cannot self adjust further, I don’t feel 100% about that.

Either way, I’m calling that done and I’m now drinking beer in the garden with my family, and a trailer chassis.

Tomorrow we will observe the day of chocolate, and on Monday I’ll be back at the XM to attack the fuel pump in anger.

Some of those errors are coming back to me now. Pretty sure I made them all too

I can't really remember how much the tensioner moved to be honest but I just did the 1/4 belt twist test

I can't remember if I just let the spring set the tension or gave the it a little extra turn of the cammed bolt 

 

[wesacosa]

 

 

[wesacosa]

mine perhaps a big tighter coming off the crank pulley? although I guess there might be a bit of variation depending where in the cycle it is

 

 

[Rust Collector]

@wesacosa thanks mate, that’s reassuring.

My tensioner is sitting in a similar position to yours, so I’m feeling happier that it’s set to where it should be.

The picture of my crank pulley is before I tensioned the belt, which is why there’s some slack.

At the top of the belt I can’t get more than a quarter turn, and on the section which the tensioner acts on I cannot get more than an eighth of a turn.

Just a rebuild of the pump to go, and I will get to start it up. I’m unsure if I want to rebuild the original pump, or the spare pump (which is the one currently fitted). I can’t remember which one I’ve fucked around with the adjustments on more 😂

[wesacosa]

11 minutes ago, Rust Collector said:

@wesacosa thanks mate, that’s reassuring.

My tensioner is sitting in a similar position to yours, so I’m feeling happier that it’s set to where it should be.

The picture of my crank pulley is before I tensioned the belt, which is why there’s some slack.

At the top of the belt I can’t get more than a quarter turn, and on the section which the tensioner acts on I cannot get more than an eighth of a turn.

Just a rebuild of the pump to go, and I will get to start it up. I’m unsure if I want to rebuild the original pump, or the spare pump (which is the one currently fitted). I can’t remember which one I’ve fucked around with the adjustments on more 😂

Nice one.  I was looking back through some of my xm forum posts at the time and the consensus was to wind the spring up as far as you can to get the belt on then let the spring tension the belt and that would be enough. Pretty sure that's the factory procedure too 

 

[Rust Collector]

2 hours ago, wesacosa said:

Nice one.  I was looking back through some of my xm forum posts at the time and the consensus was to wind the spring up as far as you can to get the belt on then let the spring tension the belt and that would be enough. Pretty sure that's the factory procedure too 

 

The Haynes manual was really unclear - it seemed to suggest releasing the tensioner before fitting the belt?! It was tight enough with the tensioner compressed.

I went with keeping the tensioner compressed, fitting the belt, releasing the tensioner nut and Allen bolt, turning the 10mm adjuster fully anti-clockwise, turning the engine over a couple of times, nipping the pulley nut up, turning over again, slacking the pulley nut off then tightening it up along with the Allen bolt.

Seems like an overly complicated process for what is effectively just a big fucking spring that pushes on the belt.

[wesacosa]

1 minute ago, Rust Collector said:

The Haynes manual was really unclear - it seemed to suggest releasing the tensioner before fitting the belt?! It was tight enough with the tensioner compressed.

I went with keeping the tensioner compressed, fitting the belt, releasing the tensioner nut and Allen bolt, turning the 10mm adjuster fully anti-clockwise, turning the engine over a couple of times, nipping the pulley nut up, turning over again, slacking the pulley nut off then tightening it up along with the Allen bolt.

Seems like an overly complicated process for what is effectively just a big fucking spring that pushes on the belt.

hmm maybe that was the case then, I might be mixing it up with another one I've done which just used the spring. either way if it passes the 90 degree twist test and keeps hitting its marks I'm sure its fine 

[High Jetter]

Doing things twice means you remember them better, always an advantage.

[Rust Collector]

After a day off yesterday, I was back on the XM today.

Fuel pump out for what feels like the nth time in my ownership.

They really are a twat to remove, although seeing as I stripped a lot out of the engine bay already it wasn’t as bad as usual. Still shite though.

I washed it half arsedly with carb cleaner, then pushed everything from my workbench motor the floor and placed down a new growbag tray in order to create a clean* space to work.

I then realised that I would need a vice for a lot of the work, so I took the really shitty and bent vice from the shed and drilled/bolted it to the bench in the garage. My clean space was now full of sawdust; great success.

The best way to commit to a job is to immediately break something, so I set about ruining the seal for the driveshaft.

Then fitted the new one. I found a hammer was better here than the press.

The bulk of the process was just that, a million times over basically. Building up the internals wasn’t too stressful, everything was waxy though so ended up spending a lot of time cleaning.

It was quite fascinating to see how the guts of the pump worked.

One tedious part was refitting the governor lever. There were a few ways suggested online, none of them worked for me though. I ended up building everything else up that interacted with it, bolting the meter head down, then using a steel rule to compress the return springs whilst slipping the lever in place. Once you get one of the pivot bolts in, it’s much easier to fit the second.

Fitting the governor itself was a bit of a bollocks. I didn’t realise I had the opportunity to drop a washer into the bottom of the pump at this point. So of course I did.

It was my lucky day though:

Another shit job on these is refitting the top cover. The technique I find useful is to just keep repeatedly swearing and trying again, and eventually it just goes together like there was never a problem at all.

I got to about 10pm and called it a day. The pump looks like this:

Everything that had a seal or o-ring in has been replaced. I’m really hoping it doesn’t leak once it goes back on the car - I did my best to avoid pinching anything as it went back together, but some parts I found you had to work blind and they were a bloody tight fit… it won’t be until next weekend that I get this all back together, so we will find out then I guess.

Edited Tuesday at 08:06 by Rust Collector
Speeling

[Rust Collector]

Why is it that when you take one car off the road to do work on it, the remaining car decides to shit its pants?

I went to get beer, ready for finishing the pump off tonight, and the Clio wouldn’t restart outside of Morrisons. I got the red ‘Stop’ lamp plus a red check engine light when I continued cranking/swearing.

A quick check showed nothing obvious, bar fucked return lines. Again.

Priming it and cranking it half to death got me home. I guess I’ll be sorting that next then.

In the meantime, I opened a beer and finished this bastard thing off:

 

It truly is a thing of beauty* now.

And more importantly, it’s ready to go back on the car.

Hopefully I’ll get that done tomorrow or Thursday, then it’s just the tedious job of reassembling everything I pulled out the engine bay, filling the coolant up, then we are good to go.

Which reminds me, I need to order new drive belts!

[Rust Collector]

I forgot to add, this is everything that I could find to replace in the pump (minus the driveshaft seal, which I think I lobbed in the bin):

Im pretty sure the main offender was the largest O ring, this is the one that seals the head to the body.

I’m praying I didn’t kill the new O ring when I fitted the two together, the fit was ridiculously tight.

[rob88h]

I’m praying to the Diesel Gods that all your fuels remain where they should be from now on. 

[Rust Collector]

I’m renaming this car The Green Bastard. My ongoing attempts to improve the present situation are met with resistance.

The pump is back on the car. I even found a lost bolt for the rear bracket, which has somehow survived a thousand miles resting on a piece of the block webbing.

Fitting this without the woodruff key falling out is a bastard of a job, even with a dab of grease. I managed to drop it several times, which is good fun.

Then I swapped over the cold start idle wax stat from the spare engine. No idea if it works, but the cable is in better condition and so I’ll actually be able to thread it into the holder on the pump.

I’m not 100% convinced that the o ring I put on that is right, but it’s easy enough to swap later if needed.

So far we are going in the right direction, so let’s fuck that off quick smart.

The ABS on this car briefly worked for the MOT. It then completely shit the bed, behaving as though it’s not receiving power. The MOT is due in two months, so this needs sorting. There’s power at the ECU where it should be, so next point of call is the solenoid block.

The solenoid block is entombed under pretty much everything, so whilst I had the car apart it made sense to take it apart a little more in order to have space to work…

Could you see it? How about now?

Taking the rads out seemed like the best bet. For some reason known only to the great minds at Citroen, that requires removing the sidelights, the nose cone, some fan shrouding, and loosening off the slam panel.

The radiator is pretty shagged. I’ve a spare in the shed which I think is a bit healthier, so that will go back on instead.

Better*:

Obviously all but one of the fasteners broke when removing the black plastic part.

It’s not designed to be opened, so that was fun.

Even more fun was finding that it works perfectly and has no dry joints.

No expense wasn’t spared on the test rig.

I’ve done some prodding and poking at the fuse box.

Results unclear.

I think I need to pull the ignition switch, as that’s in circuit and I know it isn’t quite right at present. I may start blowing things up with my power probe too.

I really thought I’d be further than this by now.

I didn’t want this to take so long, but project creep means it’s probably going to take a few weeks to sort now. I’m pretty frustrated, and I can’t make my mind up if I should spend some time on another car and try to get that working instead. I just really want a working bastard car that doesn’t give me grief, but I can’t see the way to get there currently… I’ve even considered just stripping this XM down for parts to get it out the way and some money back in my pocket, but who would want a load of bits off a 260k mile car?! Everything is tired on it.

[Sigmund Fraud]

Liked for skills and perseverance, not for the constant stream of héritage Citroën problems...

[Rust Collector]

10 minutes ago, Sigmund Fraud said:

Liked for skills and perseverance, not for the constant stream of héritage Citroën problems...

Thanks mate - one thing I am glad for is that it presented its issues early enough that I didn’t pass the burden onto yourself!

In an ideal world I’d like to sort it and keep it, but it’s at the point where I really need something to daily whilst I do the ever increasing amount of work it requires. I find it a bit galling that it takes my time away from other cars too, like the proton and Lada.

[Rust Collector]

More work done, some questions answered and even more questions asked.

Last night was spent pouring over wiring diagrams whilst drinking thought juice and comfort eating.

Today I remembered that I own a power probe, so that came out:

After performing my obligatory ritual of blowing up the contacts inside of it, then repairing them, I put it to work with the voltmeter to work through the diagrams.

And rather disappointingly, there was no real ‘smoking gun’.

All I can see is that the ABS ECU doesn’t send 12v to the relay on the hydraulic solenoid block.

So I set about opening the ECU, which they attempted to keep me out of by using oval screws:

A 6mm 6 point socket worked though.

And again, there’s no real ‘smoking gun’ in here either. It looks wet, but that’s just some sort of conformal coating. I half heartedly tested the electrolytic capacitor and it seemed ok.

So I’m a bit stumped from here.

Possibilities that I think warrant further investigation:

• Faulty ECU
• Bad earth elsewhere on the car
• Bad ignition switch

An ECU will set me back about £25 for one that’s used and may or may not be better than what I have.

I guess I’ll set about looking at the other points in the meantime.

In slightly better news I did start the car, and after bleeding the air from the injectors it did run. The starting is still slow though, which I’m now attributing to a bad earth strap between the engine and battery - the terminal is too hot to touch after about 10 seconds of cranking. Sadly the earth cable on these disappears behind the engine to *gestures wildly * fuck knows where - I can’t even make it out on the spare engine, it’s so deeply buried away.

[Zelandeth]

I'd just make a new earthing setup.  It doesn't really matter where it goes so long as you've got a solid connection between the block and the battery.  I usually run a separate one to the body rather than daisy chaining them.  

Don't worry about where the original one goes - just find a convenient thing to bolt it to and go for it.

I know the Xantia suffered from issues with the battery leads going high resistance when they got old.  I've no experience with the XM, but it wouldn't surprise me if they have exactly the same issue.

[Rust Collector]

6 minutes ago, Zelandeth said:

I'd just make a new earthing setup.  It doesn't really matter where it goes so long as you've got a solid connection between the block and the battery.  I usually run a separate one to the body rather than daisy chaining them.  

Don't worry about where the original one goes - just find a convenient thing to bolt it to and go for it.

I know the Xantia suffered from issues with the battery leads going high resistance when they got old.  I've no experience with the XM, but it wouldn't surprise me if they have exactly the same issue.

Yeah, I was thinking to run one to the front of the block near the starter, I just wanted to take the old one off completely rather than tape it up and leave it there.

It measures negligible resistance without a load, but the fans run when cranking the starter and I’m pretty sure that’s the starter circuit finding a path to earth through the fans somehow.

If not that then it’s possibly a problem with the switch - I need to sort out a relay for the starting circuit as I’m pretty sure my one hasn’t had that improvement done yet.

I still feel like these things are red herrings, but the problem is until I get rid of these known issues I can’t conclusively say it’s not them.

[Zelandeth]

It's worth doing.  Anything PSA made from this side of the 80s seems to be really finicky about voltage issues.  I've had two Xantias which both did some spectacularly strange things when the battery started getting weak.  The battery just getting to end of life in my Partner for some reason made the multifunction display on the dash just randomly go bananas...not the foggiest idea WHY, but it just seems to be A Thing with them.

Just sticking the battery on a charger overnight and seeing if things play better isn't the most stupid idea honestly!

[Rust Collector]

It’s had a new battery recently, and I charged it fully before refitting it yesterday - I’ll go grab some new battery cable tomorrow though as I don’t have anything of a decent size here, and another relay for the starter. I will also try and pull the switch out later in the week when I have some more time, as it’s definitely not right - I think the contacts are worn.