Renault Twingo Mk 1

[nigel bickle]

There are plenty here who will know the engine, and can guide you where needed.

 

It's what makes this forum great!

[OwdChina]

Throw an R1 engine in the back...

Agreed..............maximum giggles.

[Bear]

Is it really £200 for those parts? For an old Clio engine?

 

And if you changed the engine, surely the alt belt too, and a new clutch make make sense? Maybe engine mount rubbers, rad looking a little sad?....

 

It's a cheap car. Keep the costs down. Take the head off, get it checked/ sorted then get a mobile mechanic to refit. It'll cost you less than a new engine and its his risk if he fouls up. A sorted runner, for a lot less moolah.

 

Unless you want that lowball offer now?

 

HBOL Acquired.

 

Headset £35-68 - I'm unsure about quality differences on cost. Belt and tensioner kit (can't remember if it included a waterpump, but let's assume it did) £100. New studs and bolts for the manifolds as they're manky, probably £20 plus the hassle of dealing with the Renault dealer. Getting head checked - £30 + time and hassle finding a place to do it, plus my inherent distrust of anyone taking money off me to do a thing on a car that I/they think I don't understand.

 

I've already stripped it so far, so I will press on when time allows (battling with a bit of a broken brain for the past couple of years doesn't help, but the victories are worth it - I just cannot focus on anything lately). New engine came with new plugs and gaskets, new belt, plus had the benefit of unworn bores, unworn shells and bearings, etc. I did plan on fitting a new clutch at the same time and since I have an engine crane and so forth that shouldn't be too hard - TBH, the rest of the car is so nice I don't really want to just do the minimum to make it run again, I'm this far along and was going to haul the engine out so I may as well haul the engine out anyway, put the new clutch on, clean the block up and make it pretty, and (and this is where it's tricky for me) put new rings and other wear components in the engine.

 

Expertise much appreciated in this regard, but sadly that expertise has to put up with the fact that I am an epic flake at the moment. If you catch me when I'm not in headless chicken mode I'm great but as FPB7 has seen I'm sort of mental-firefighting and getting me into the garage to commit to twirling a spanner is very difficult indeed.

 

Part of it is just getting too many "oh FFS" moments on my cars, like the Sera's head gasket blowing right after I bought it, the RX8 being rather rustier underneath than any 2006 car has a right to be and thus, discouraging me from wanting to spend on the brake calipers. Taking on too much at once!

 

I do really, really want the Twingo to work though. I think once fixed it'll be the sweetest, happiest little thing I've driven in years, and I'm budgeting in the long run to have some topcoat damage on the door repaired and a new windscreen fitted to get rid of a chip and the road rash. Finding an RHD headlight to deal with a small crack may be tricky, though :/

[nigel bickle]

Mate, I understand your desire to make it immaculate, but really?

 

A dead car is a useless lump of iron oxide that just saps will, & cash.

 

Do the minimum, get it running, make it lovely later. Use a mobile mechanic so you've got it on the road for summer. Save the cash to sort the others.

 

Or get on Leboncoin, have a weekend away and start over, selling this one on. You've plenty queueing ( although most will evaporate)

 

I'm not a nag. I've been very ill for many years, and it's likely to continue that way. But I do run a small fleet of chod, and understand ' the rules'. Make it easier on yourself, & get the car usable.

[The Moog]

Where are you Mr K? Can we help with working party??

[spartacus]

I can't imagine it will need new rings. Unless I'm missing something. Ditto the clutch.

As above, don't worry about making it mint at the moment, get it together and drive it, within the first few miles you'll wonder why you didn't do it sooner.

The working party is a great idea, +1 on the where are you.

[Bear]

Christ, I think I did a search on all of Leboncoin and found two Twingos. Both well over €2000.

Toute la France is all of France, right?

I'm near Leicester - as it says, a field near Lutterworth. Shitefest people might have spotted I'm not awesome in social situations, but I suspect, like an oil-drenched penguin, I'd actually be massively grateful of the intervention even if I did seem a tad bitey at times.

(I'm not that bad, really, but "I help, I don't accept help" is a personality flaw I apparently have).

[Bear]

I can't imagine it will need new rings. Unless I'm missing something. Ditto the clutch.

 

It's been swapped to miles properly according to the history, and at a young age, so it's closer to 127,000 miles than km I suspect. Just frustrating to pull things apart, get one thing sorted only to find something else has gone splat, so attack what can be attacked in one go seems rational to me.

[John F]

I think you're viewing the situation excessively negatively, Richard.

 

The ex miss_F's Twingo had about 160,000 miles on the clock and still ran beautifully when ownership passed on to Mr Bickle. I suspect it was on its original clutch, and that was showing no signs of packing in. They're quite tough engines, as has been said often enough.

 

I'd concentrate on building up your existing engine, especially if the bottom end is still in situ. It really isn't rocket science, especially on a simple engine like this. And especially x 2 if you have the offer of help from other forum members...

[Bear]

Possibly - I am used to pre-emptively tackling issues that would write off big Mercedes and the like, or PSA-shite that falls apart when you look at it funny.

[nigel bickle]

Leboncoin. Nord Pas de Calais. Twingo. Voitures. . > 1997. >750. 41 cars today. Many of those close to Calais.

 

Take the offers of help, get it drive able, enjoy the summer. Make it lovely later.

 

Or go get another. Plenty to choose from.

[Bear]

Okay, it's on. Back to plan A - replace the head gasket that cause the misfire, and the radiator that is just buggered.

[chaseracer]

Cool.

 

When shall we pop over?

 

[Bear]

I'll get the manual, then work out which bits I need - radiator is already on my Amazon list (bought the wrong one - NB, would you want a spare for the earlier engine with fan sensor in the radiator? I have a new fan for it too - think I paid about £30 for both items) - gasket set, timing belt/tensioner, studs and nuts for manifolds I think?

I am SO sure the front end unbolts on this to make the access piss easy, I'd just like a manual that confirms it which the Clio one doesn't.

[nigel bickle]

Good man. Cheap is best/quickest. Luvverly

[John F]

Also, if folks are near enough / prepared to help, get a second opinion from them before ordering things if you're unsure what you'll need.

 

Better still, ask them to come over & inspect the job with you before ordering. Then you'll have half a chance of being able to complete the job in one go when the bits arrive.

[Bear]

Oh, these are all bits I know I'll need I just want to make sure I'm ordering the right ones this time, as the super-cheap Amazon deals got me so excited I ordered the wrong radiator and fan, and then went on to buy an A/C condenser for it thinking I'd selected the SLK and found a cheap SLK one (plausible, I have a new SLK radiator on the shelf that cost £17).

[John F]

Yes, but what about the bits you don't necessarily know you'll need? Exhaust manifold gaskets, fluids, filters, fasteners, aux belt, etc.

[nigel bickle]

Johns right - but he's a good spanner monkey. He did a splendid job on the blue one that got me Twinging- till it got torched by a lowlife.

 

I've two now, a green one in England and a yellow with a full length canvas roof in Belgium. Love 'em!

 

I'd be surprised if you will actually need more than half your reduced list. Things like manifold studs? Really?

If, and only if the Engineering shop says you need new ones, buy them there. It creates goodwill, you'll get a better quality option at a lower price.if they can't, a good nut/ bolt supplier will see you right for a fractional %.

Do NOT use Renault for anything- mk1 Twingo. they have no clue.

 

Get some help, either here or a local mechanic who knows Clios. Get the head off, evaluate and sort repairs/ parts, then spend your waiting time cleaning up the ancillary stuff in the engine bay.

When it's all back around 10 days later, get those back that can help to refit. It really can't be difficult, more fear of the Unknown. We've all been there, many times.

 

As to spare parts you don't need? Sure, I'll bite. No immediate need but they can go on a shelf for the future. PM me.

[Bear]

The studs are probably okay, the nuts had to be split off.

[Bear]

Right, after two months of just... I can't even.

 

Let's try again.

 

Current Twingo status: Intake manifold removed, rocker cover almost off but reluctant so figuring out why, starter removed, alternator removed, radiator removed and FUBAR, expansion bottle and pipes removed.

 

Engine is turning over so hasn't seized while sitting.

 

Lost a lot of freelance work, nearly ran entirely out of money, spiralled into horrible debt stress, nearly moved house, got a lot of options dangled at me then whipped away after investing time, thought on relocation/entirely changing life. Upshot of all this distraction...

 

I'm not moving yet, I've got rid of two depressing and ill-advised projects, have reorganised finances, leased a new car, have some opportunities on the horizon but without them I can cope with how things are, just very very economically. Projects can die without leaving me stranded etc.

 

I also just put the magazine to bed so have a few days clear, have tidied the garage, and am going to order:

 

Cylinder head gasket kit with bolts. These seem to be about £30-50, which is ridiculously cheap. Can these be any good? Without bolts they're under £20 on eBay for Payen and so forth...

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Head-Gasket-Set-Head-Bolts-Renault-Clio-Kangoo-Twingo-1-2-8V-Ohc-D7F/120841208739?_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIM.MBE%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D20140122125356%26meid%3Db9f46e11a07d4779ab42f24c9b94a158%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D4%26rkt%3D6%26sd%3D140713520149&_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851

 

A new radiator of the correct type. £35 seems fair and it says DEFINITELY for 1997-onwards. NRF isn't a brand I've heard of but it's going to hold water better than the thing that came off the car...

 

Timing belt kit and water pump...

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BOSCH-TIMING-CAM-BELT-KIT-WATER-PUMP-RENAULT-KANGOO-1-2-97-07-/371973604180?epid=1962367724&hash=item569b5ac354:g:neQAAOSw9OFZNjeQ

 

(Genuine? How would I know? Surely it's all the same junk from the same places anyway).

 

Oil and filters, coolant, all a given. Likewise aux belt. I've yet to suss out the exhaust pipe end of getting the head off!

[Dave_Q]

£50 for a headset with bolts seems about right, head bolts aren't made of anything magic, they're certainly <£1 each to an OEM.

 

Belt kit seems fine, Bosch/Gates/Conti all much of a muchness.

[Bear]

Headset bought, timing belt kit bought, radiator backtracked since shipping from Germany - bloody Amazon.

 

I should join a UK Twingo club, I bet I'd find people wanting the AC rad, pre '96 fan and radiator parts I bought. And a million people all fighting for the same RHD headlights - I'm converting back to LHD ultimately.

 

Rocker cover removed - I'd missed a recessed bolt - and now soaking in the parts washer. Soaking exhaust manifold studs in WD40. Looks less daunting when that lump of plastic is removed.

[Bear]

Feels like I'm getting somewhere now.

 

[Bear]

More tiny steps. That mount bolt was a bastard and needed FPB7's massive breaker bar.

 

 

Now the mount /has/ to come off to get the cambelt upper cover off. No clearance.

 

How many of these running around Europe are still on the original belt because of that wonderfully daft access.

 

[Bear]

Next: exhaust downpipe or studs off, set timing right, then... off with the head!

[Bear]

So, I got bored of trying to watch League of Gentlemen (okay, some catchphrases make more sense now but sheesh, I thought going back to The Mary Whitehouse Experience was painful).

 

Went to have a quiet word with the Twingo's exhaust studs, and this happened.

 

 

When I got it two years ago I diagnosed the misfire as "a break in the headgasket between 2/3" using a camera-on-a-stick.

 

 

 

Literally undid the head bolts and lifted it off like this. I was ready for a fight.

 

 

So... now what? How do I clean it? Shall I change the valve stem seals?

 

 

Also I still need to remove the bottom pulley, I got impatient and slid the belt off rather than taking it off properly. But LOOK. Progress!

[Bear]

(Also yes, I didn't need to take half the crap off the engine that I did, but I thought I was stripping it for a replacement engine. Now I want to wire-brush it and paint the block a bit).

 

I know a lot of the mechanical savvy people are shaking their collective heads at this, but seriously - life fell apart in March, then another whammy in April, then eye operations, then more issues, then a whole lot of "pack up everything and move" plans, then a whole load of other things. I reckon what I've done on the car - which includes removing parts not needed to be removed and cleaning up bits and stuff - is probably about four hours of actual work towards replacing the head gasket. If that. Finding the motivation has been a bigger issue than finding the time.

 

I'll be my own biggest critic over this to spare you the hassle, but helpful works/pointer still needed, as I'm now at the stage where I don't know what I do - do I just chuck the head in the parts washer given that the failure is exactly what I thought it was and the metal above the break - on the head - feels smooth? Do I use wire wool/wire brush in a drill/something more gentle to clean things up? This could actually be FIXED this month!

[Rusty_Rocket]

Nice one!  Quick check the head is straight/ not ridged where the gasket has breached, then clean both surfaces perfectly, whack it back together and get the darned thing out there earning its keep.

[The Moog]

Don't beat yourself up so much. Most people don't get this far!

 

I am no help as to next steps. But would have thought it needs to be clean as you can get it and change anything you can whilst it is off.