Man too stupid to even drive a car gets Darwin Award

[Junkman]

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2016/jun/30/tesla-autopilot-death-self-driving-car-elon-musk

 

I hope this has thrown a spanner the size of Canada into the gearbox of this self driving bollocks.

And yes, contrary to a fucking computer, I do feel sorry for the family of this man.

[STUNO]

I don't think it will cause Tesla big problems, it does seem that the driver was not paying attention to the road conditions as he did not take any action, he had assumed that the car would do all the work itself. Think of it as glorified cruise control.

[cort16]

As said I think it was driver error. Tesla put a lot of warnings and fail safes in place the driver must have been doing something stupid to bypass them all.

[gnorwebthgimi]

From what I have read the car didn't slow down, didn't brake. How is that not the car's fault? As far driver error, it's a self driving car and the car is at fault or it's not a self driving car and they need to drop all this b*****ks as it's just dangerous. Thank f*** they don't allow driverless HGVs on our roads, oh wait.

[gnorwebthgimi]

Well then they are not self driving cars, and the claim that driver-less cars have covered 130 million miles accident free is BS.

[Heidel_Kakao]

Are the family likely to sue Tesla for mega coin now? Could be quite the set back for this dream of self driving cars.

[For Fiats Sake]

If driving is such a chore for the people who buy these type of vehicles, why don't they take another form of transport so they don't have to pay attention to the road at all? Like a bus, a train, taxi?

 

So this time the car went into the side of a trailer unit and tesla are brushing it off as a one in many million error, what if it had been a vehicle full of people?

 

Human nature means phones, tv's books etc will be used despite the myriad of warnings.  The technology may well be perfected but the idiot behind the wheel never will be.

 

Whilst it is sad for the family, I hope this brings into sharp focus the issues of these now lethal vehicles.

 

A quick bit of googling shows a tesla s @$120,000 a bmw m5 @$90,000.  wouldn't $30,000 have paid for a part time chauffeur?

[Tamworthbay]

I wonder how many people died in non self driving cars on the same day?

[purplebargeken]

I see plenty of driverless cars on the M25 and around Edmonton. Well maybe not entirely driverless but they may as well be.

[captain_70s]

I think it was James May who said something along the lines of "if the concept for the car had been drawn up today it'd never allowed. It'd be considered far too dangerous". I'm inclined to agree.

 

 

I'm sure when the spear was invented Barry Cavemanface accidentally put one though some other people but we didn't turn around and say "right chaps, the whole spear thing is actually a bit risky so we're going to continue slapping the mammoths to death, I'm sure it'll work out in the long run".

[Skizzer]

So this time the car went into the side of a trailer unit and tesla are brushing it off as a one in many million error, what if it had been a vehicle full of people?

 

Human nature means phones, tv's books etc will be used despite the myriad of warnings.  The technology may well be perfected but the idiot behind the wheel never will be.

 

Whilst it is sad for the family, I hope this brings into sharp focus the issues of these now lethal vehicles.

 

All vehicles are potentially lethal, though.  

 

After reading their statement, I think it's pretty unfair to accuse Tesla of 'brushing this off', especially as I gather from elsewhere that the driver was personally known to Elon Musk.  

 

What Tesla are doing, in a reasonable manner, is pointing out that their cars driven with their 'assistance' system are less likely to be involved in a fatal collision than other cars driven by humans alone.  This is not a surprise to anyone who drives regularly on the M4 westbound between London and Bristol and been passed on the hard shoulder by someone doing 90 in an Audi Q5 while texting.

 

 

Edit: God help us when Microsoft get in on the act though, given the appalling state of the software they put out into the market.

[purplebargeken]

Hehe, imagine MS wanting to update software whilst driving along the 'fast lane' of that there M25 in rush hour. 

[cort16]

I can't wait for driverless cars, most of my driving is a boring slog I could be doing something interesting like being on autoshite or buying broken non driverless cars off eBay for the times I actually want to drive somewhere .

[cort16]

I think teslas big problem is they make most brand new cars look like a horsey horseless therefore the big manufacturers are desperate to try to put them out of business .

 

Remember tucker?

[Pillock]

They're not self driving, so if the guy let his car drive into a truck then it's his fault - exactly the same as if he put cruise control on and then didn't brake for a bend. Tesla have never said it will drive itself, it will make certain adjustments to the controls based on data from sensors but the driver needs to be alert.

 

I wouldnt' say he's "too stupid" to drive a car, plenty of things are automated which could be done by hand. Am I too stupid to wash my clothes in the bath if I use a washing machine instead?

 

It's America, so they probably will sue. It'll be interesting to see which way it goes.

[cort16]

Hehe, imagine MS wanting to update software whilst driving along the 'fast lane' of that there M25 in rush hour.

It would bring a new meaning to blue screen of death

[gnorwebthgimi]

Are the family likely to sue Tesla for mega coin now? Could be quite the set back for this dream of self driving cars.

no because the cars are not self driving, you drive them it's your fault when you nod off out of boredom and it kills someone.

[Dick Cheeseburger]

Turns out the cops are now saying there was a portable DVD player found at the crash site.

Hope the driver wasn't watching Final Destination.

 

I 'get' cruise control and loved to use it on my old car, whenever on a long run. I still kept my eyes and ears open though. The concept of a Tesla driver assist system sounds plain bloody dangerous. The plod go mental if you so much as look at your mobile when driving; a car which is doing the hard work for you surely promotes less concentration. I prefer FFS' suggestion further up the thread about buying a 90k M5 + chauffeur.

[gnorwebthgimi]

I can't wait for driverless cars, most of my driving is a boring slog I could be doing something interesting like being on autoshite or buying broken non driverless cars off eBay for the times I actually want to drive somewhere .

have you ever considered enduring public transport instead of driving to work? Wouldn't your drive be more boring if you have to sit poised to take over control in case the computer doesn't spot something?

[gnorwebthgimi]

I don't think it's a good idea for driving to be automated, I don't think electric cars make sense. If you like those things for obviously beneficial reasons the logical conclusion would be a tram system which would be far more energy efficient and far more autonomous. Why did they disappear so many decades ago?

[Laseraligningfoofooflanges]

If he wanted to toss it off for the duration why didnt he just get the bus...

 

Reminds a little of the out of control toyota escapade in a few ways tbf..You can make the most elobarate autopilot system in the world, Probably no good if it isnt idiotproof.

[cort16]

have you ever considered enduring public transport instead of driving to work? Wouldn't your drive be more boring if you have to sit poised to take over control in case the computer doesn't spot something?

 

 

You're joking right? It takes nearly 2 hrs to get there on public transport, I can drive there in 45 minutes.

I'm talking about in 10 years time when I can sit in the back and take a nap. They recon the real issue once they  the suss out the technology is stopping the humans fucking it up.

There have been cases where pilots have caused crashes that wouldn't have happened if they'd left  the auto pilot engage. Save the boring driving for the robots and save driving for when you want to have fun.

 

 

Just remember to switch it on

 

[gnorwebthgimi]

You're joking right? It takes nearly 2 hrs to get there on public transport, I can drive there in 45 minutes.

I'm talking about in 10 years time when I can sit in the back and take a nap. They recon the real issue once they the suss out the technology is stopping the humans fucking it up.

There have been cases where pilots have caused crashes that wouldn't have happened if they'd left the auto pilot engage. Save the boring driving for the robots and save driving for when you want to have fun.

 

 

Just remember to switch it on

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=drgNmZ74eEc

y

 

Yes I am joking, public transport is nothing but a joke, I wouldn't wish it on anyone in its current form. Yet it totally works in developed nations. My point is that it should be easier and better for the environment to fix public transport than reinvent driving so that it's automated and electric (both of which are definitely happening) so why aren't we doing that?

[For Fiats Sake]

I'd imagine for this technology to be safe as much monitoring of the "driver" is required as of the outside environment.

I watched/read an interview with a journalist who had used the tesla s in "cruise control" on b roads despite the system not being designed for this!

Until the automotive equivalent of a "dead man's handle" is incorporated into the technology I am not sure this is a safe technology, people will ignore warnings and abuse it - human nature.  

[garethj]

Until the automotive equivalent of a "dead man's handle" is incorporated into the technology I am not sure this is a safe technology, people will ignore warnings and abuse it - human nature.  

 

I thought there were pressure sensors in the steering wheel and you had to be holding it for the car to work.  I don't think they're used in the US but are on the UK versions.

 

I don't think it's a good idea for driving to be automated, I don't think electric cars make sense. If you like those things for obviously beneficial reasons the logical conclusion would be a tram system which would be far more energy efficient and far more autonomous. Why did they disappear so many decades ago?

Because taking things to their extreme conclusion is rarely the best answer.  "I don't like modern smartphones with everyone updating their facebook status as they walk down the street and taking photos of their lunch".  "Why don't you go back to living in cave with no smartphones or electricity?"  Thanks, but there is often a happy medium between freezing cold and being on fire.

 

As to why trams died out, I've no idea.  Perhaps they lack the flexibility of buses - if a tram breaks down the other ones can't steer around it?  Maybe setting out the infrastructure was a bit of a faff compared to filling up with diesel once a day?  This was back when nobody cared about emissions being pumped out in overcrowded city centres of course, everyone smoked 40 Woodbines a day and people used to eat lard for its life giving qualities.  A different set of requirements means an answer that didn't work before might work now.

[Timewaster]

I could hop to work quicker than I could get there on public transport. And it's 11 miles.

 

Also every car maker desperately wants Tesla to fail. Who knows what skulduggery they would get up to?

 

This whole story makes me think of the guy who's RV crashed on cruise control while the "driver" was in the back getting a drink.

 

Darwin indeed.

[gnorwebthgimi]

Because taking things to their extreme conclusion is rarely the best answer. "I don't like modern smartphones with everyone updating their facebook status as they walk down the street and taking photos of their lunch". "Why don't you go back to living in cave with no smartphones or electricity?" Thanks, but there is often a happy medium between freezing cold and being on fire.

 

Perhaps I am be being extreme with mad concepts like working public transport. But I am not a Luddite, well at least not a hardcore one. I can foresee self-driving cars being a major inconvenience for manual drivers. Perhaps due to insurance or road regulations. Electric cars are fine, but if you really want to save the planet then public transport should be able to deliver much greener solutions than electric cars.

[gnorwebthgimi]

25 minute drive to work for me 1 hour and a quarter to an hour and a half via public transport. To highlight how bad trains are I travelled through three major cities across most of the length of the Netherlands in comfort in a little over an hour and a half. when we got back it took over three hours to get about 30 miles. The service ran to time on the usual schedule but we had to go the wrong direction twice including passed our destination and come back, as well as wait nearly an hour for a connecting train.

[garethj]

but if you really want to save the planet then public transport should be able to deliver much greener solutions than electric cars.

 

Why?  Do we even know what public want or will accept from transport these days?  Even if we all walked to work, would emissions still be tiny compared to all the planes flying about?

 

Back at the thread, I wonder where this will go given America's legal system.  I mean compared to people being staggered by McDonalds coffee being hot, this looks like a doodle in terms of legal payout.

 

Council for the prosecution: "It was clear neglect on the part Tesla, why everybody knows that cars drive themselves"

 

[cort16]

It was likely tesla have considered this might happen and are already prepared on how they would defend it in court .

 

Self Drive is being developed by massive companies some of which aren't automotive so I suspect there'll be a lot of support for tesla from that side of the fence.