Advice on how to remove belligerent spark plugs

[TRW]

Now you have it running, could you please remove the plugs.

 

Then copper slip X4 and refit.

[theorganist]

Now you have it running, could you please remove the plugs.

 

Then copper slip X4 and refit.

I am certainly going to have a go! 

[DSdriver]

I was going to mention that it might be a duff distributor cap but you got it sorted before I reached the end of the replies. I had one fail on a 123 electronic dizzy that was only about a year old. Of course we tried replacing everything else first.

[Bren]

A lot of "new" dizzy caps are shit.Not just old ones.

 

Now, warm engine and remove plugs.

 

Job done.

[jonny69]

Yes, get those plugs out as a matter of urgency. Don't eff about with a plug remover, stick a socket on it with a decent length bar. For the record, I found that 3/8" fittings shear off at about 140-150 ft/lbs so use a 1/2" drive if you have one.

[nigel bickle]

I think you probably disturbed some corrosion on the graphite tip & rotor arm.

 

Aside from sorting the plugs, I'd clean up the rotor arm too. Rub the end of the brass strip against your sidewall- it will polish it nicely without taking any metal away. if you can, do the same to the centre electrode- get it nice n shiny/conductive.

 

It will get easier to start as it gets used to running. 

 

Throttle, or lack of it should be simple to trace -being a pedal, a cable a carb connection. One will be seized/rusted/ broken (delete as approp)

 

Well done -it'll get easier as you become more familiar..

[tooSavvy]

^^^^^ &equally with Girlfriends.

 

TS

[theorganist]

Yes, get those plugs out as a matter of urgency. Don't eff about with a plug remover, stick a socket on it with a decent length bar. For the record, I found that 3/8" fittings shear off at about 140-150 ft/lbs so use a 1/2" drive if you have one.

Thanks, I will make it a priority, I do have one (1/2") driver somewhere as I have the sockets for it. I think it is in the shed somewhere as everything seems to get chucked in there, it's not with the sockets thats for sure!

[theorganist]

I think you probably disturbed some corrosion on the graphite tip & rotor arm.

 

Aside from sorting the plugs, I'd clean up the rotor arm too. Rub the end of the brass strip against your sidewall- it will polish it nicely without taking any metal away. if you can, do the same to the centre electrode- get it nice n shiny/conductive.

 

It will get easier to start as it gets used to running. 

 

Throttle, or lack of it should be simple to trace -being a pedal, a cable a carb connection. One will be seized/rusted/ broken (delete as approp)

 

Well done -it'll get easier as you become more familiar..

Thanks Nigel.

 

I will investigate the throttle tonight before I go out and maybe try and get the plugs out if I can find the bar for it!

 

I want to do as much as possible, it's quite hard doing many jobs as I only have the road and a rather steep driveway!

[PhilA]

I always use a long T handle on an extension bar for stuff like this.  I try to have the T in the middle and twist both sides of the bar.  My theory is that this puts the most pure twisting force on things without any sideways forces and so is less likely to snap something.  I have no idea whether it really helps.  The other trick is to do the same thing but also get an assistant to smack the top of the T bar with a big hammer whilst I am twisting at the same time. It might just shock the threads past the stuck bit.

 

^ This, because this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Couple_%28mechanics%29

 

Basically, your wanting to impart a pure torque on the threads without applying a sidewards force, which adds extra friction to the threads is correct. It does help, significantly.

 

This is also why a wheel spider is a Good Idea for wheel nuts and those fully not-quite-a-right-angle L bars are not.

 

--Phil

[RichardMoss]

Re:  throttle.  Check the earth lead between the engine and chassis - if it is missing or corroded then it may no longer be functioning and the engine earths through the throttle cable.  This is all well and good until you crank the starter and the huge current spotwelds the inner and outer cables together.

[theorganist]

Earth lead seems fine doesn't look corroded. I think the problem with the cable is at the pedal end.

 

When you press the accelerator pedal there is a small amount of movement in the cable at the carb end but not enough to operate the mechanism. I have had a feel around the pedal area and found where the cable meets the pedal things seem a bit slack/lose around there. Not the pedal but the cable. Hopefully the Haynes book of understatements will arrive tomorrow and may be of some help. Its hard to get down there!

 

I don't have time for any more tonight so will try and have another look over the coming evenings.

[twosmoke300]

Melted throttle cable . Missing earth lead . Hmm sounds like a mini to me.

[mouseflakes]

The engine sounds ... not nearly as noisy as I expected!

 

Surely that's something of a disappointment on a Talbot?

[theorganist]

Surely that's something of a disappointment on a Talbot?

Haha yes it was slightly disappointing. Then again it isn't running at idling speed at the moment so it may have that authentic Talbot clatter!

[Richard]

I think they cured the authentic Talbot clatter in the last year of production.

[Inspector Morose]

I remember that the last Horizons, the Pullmans, didn't rattle at all. To me, they just didn't sound right at all. I have no idea how they did it or why they didn't do it earlier. Every Talbot or Chrysler I have known or owned with that engine made that fucked tappets sound, it was a part of growing up.

[DSdriver]

^ This, because this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Couple_%28mechanics%29

 

 

 

--Phil

Removing seized screws I've been hitting the screwdriver whilst trying to turn it for years with about 90 per cent success rate but I never realised how much science I was using. The article doesn't go on to say that the next step is to drill the bugger out though. Wikifail.

[jonny69]

Thanks, I will make it a priority, I do have one (1/2") driver somewhere as I have the sockets for it. I think it is in the shed somewhere as everything seems to get chucked in there, it's not with the sockets thats for sure!

 

Was only joking about utter urgency - they will probably decide to not be as tight once you've run it a couple of times. But it's good advice to use a T bar because of the leverage on both sides. If you just use a long bar then there's a good chance you'll snap the tops off the plugs if you don't support the middle, but the flipside of this is it's quite easy when you're using a long bar because you're not forcing all your strength into it like you are with a short bar

[theorganist]

Was only joking about utter urgency - they will probably decide to not be as tight once you've run it a couple of times. But it's good advice to use a T bar because of the leverage on both sides. If you just use a long bar then there's a good chance you'll snap the tops off the plugs if you don't support the middle, but the flipside of this is it's quite easy when you're using a long bar because you're not forcing all your strength into it like you are with a short bar

Thanks, I do appreciate the advice you have given me. I will try and remove them over the weekend when I have bought some copper slip or similar. I must try and fix the throttle cable first. The Haynes has arrived this morning apparently so hopefully it can assist me in this matter........then again!

[lovejoy]

Well done the Organister ! 

you will find that the Haynes Book Of Lies will free up the plugs instantly, if used as a hammer !

good luck with the project  -  these Manuels DO have their uses 

[RichardMoss]

Melted throttle cable . Missing earth lead . Hmm sounds like a mini to me.

It actually happened on my brother's Midget 1500

[Craig the Princess]

It actually happened on my brother's Midget 1500

 

My green Allegro did it too. As did the brown one.

[talbot928]

I think they cured the authentic Talbot clatter in the last year of production.

IIRC all it took was a tightening up of the manufacturing tolerances, plus since the timing chain has no tensioner they altered the sprockets and fitted a 'viton ring' (think rubber band). Apparently the majority of the Talbot clatter was caused by the timing chain and not the tappets!

[forddeliveryboy]

Removing seized screws I've been hitting the screwdriver whilst trying to turn it for years with about 90 per cent success rate but I never realised how much science I was using. The article doesn't go on to say that the next step is to drill the bugger out though. Wikifail.

 

Few with higher level practical skills realise just how clever they are - they have learned these skills through watching others, trial and error as well as good judgement, without having to read learned journals and other academia which explains and describes some of the principles behind the skills practice. One of the massive failings of the UK is to under-estimate and put down those who can link their brain to their hands and back again.

[PhilA]

IIRC all it took was a tightening up of the manufacturing tolerances, plus since the timing chain has no tensioner they altered the sprockets and fitted a 'viton ring' (think rubber band). Apparently the majority of the Talbot clatter was caused by the timing chain and not the tappets!

 

Just ziptie a length of metal so it fouls the radiator fan blades.  TAKTAKTAKTAKTAKTAKTAK

 

 

That should restore the balance of the Talbot cosmos.

 

--Phil

[tooSavvy]

.... ahh, to be young & SO stupid again 

 

RE: 'viton ring'..??

 

I removed the camshaft sprocket from my Morris 1000 van motor with a big screwwie, to lever with.

 

KRAKK....

 

The sprocket had two grooves in (with a rubber ring) to keep it quiet/tensioned. Voila, Cast sprocket with two big chunks missing  .

 

Scrappie for a replacement... removed with Extreme Caution... and in one piece.

 

 

Never took one off again.... but my tears are here to advise the young.....

 

 

TS

[Craig the Princess]

You need the spudgun jacket for that 90s Talbot owner look

[forddeliveryboy]

.... ahh, to be young & SO stupid again 

 

RE: 'viton ring'..??

 

I removed the camshaft sprocket from my Morris 1000 van motor with a big screwwie, to lever with.

 

KRAKK....

 

The sprocket had two grooves in (with a rubber ring) to keep it quiet/tensioned. Voila, Cast sprocket with two big chunks missing  .

 

Scrappie for a replacement... removed with Extreme Caution... and in one piece.

 

 

Never took one off again.... but my tears are here to advise the young.....

 

 

TS

 

Aye but if you learn everything from the book/advice, you never really learn about things in the same, complete, way. Breaking stuff and making mistakes is what youth is all about - it's when you've the energy to spend half the night fixing things (and so learning far more than you otherwise would have).

 

The self-taught person is the one who has the most rapid learning curve, which rarely stops rising even when his knowledge matches that of the conventionally-taught chap - and why he is often the most interesting and learned of fellows. Einstein dropped out of uni for good reason - he was bored shitless. I think "never stop playing" is a phrase attributed to him. It's the only way you maintain that spark of life and enthusiasm for discovering new things as well as enjoying the old.