EGR bollocks

[Bren]

For the second time in a few months my vectra CDTI has failed to proceed ( no doubt if I spoke to vauxhall's technical department I would be told " they all do that sir").

 

Last time AA man came out and cleaned the EGR valve - I had to repeat the exercise yesterday. No EML Light illuminated, but lots of smoke and engine does'nt want to rev beyond 2000 rpm.

 

Valve was stuck just like last time, some carb cleaner saw the plunger freed off, cleaned the pipe work and the gallery that the elbow attaches to ( chock full of soot), car is now behaving itself. But for how long I wonder?

 

I cannot see how a diesel car can be fitted with one of these as it is obvious that it will get bunged up - I could blank it off but EML Light would come on, it would then need looking at to have the thing deleted from the engine management.

 

Don't fancy having to do this every few months, maybe another motor is the answer.

[trigger]

I was chatting to my mate today who looks after the local taxi companies cars. They run Skoda Octavia 1.6 TDi's and he was showing me a EGR unit they had just replaced, apparently they only last 60000 miles before the carbon from cheap fuel clogs up this arm up from springing back which then puts the car in limp mode. The trouble is you can't just by the arm part, you have to buy the whole unit which costs £400+vat then it's a 3 hour job removing it from the back of the engine!.

 

This one Octavia was a 62 plate and was on it's second unit already, at 120000 miles.

[bub2006]

Blank it off. I did it on scenic DCI but left the solenoid attached to the wiring so it didn't upset the car

[forddeliveryboy]

Make your own blank or http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_trksid=p2050601.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.H0.Xvectra+cdti+egr+blank&_nkw=vectra+cdti+egr+blank&_sacat=0&_from=R40

 

Might be worth cleaning out your inlet fannymold when you've chance - it's going to be a bit gummed up too

[gordonbennet]

GRENADE!!!    Millers Diesel Power Sport 4 or whatever they call it this week.

 

See. i've said it, you can arrange a fat wah on me or whatever yer like but its now been said so nurrh!

 

Thing is, when i ran Diesels, for years i swore by and used a healthy usually double dose of Millers Diesel fuel additive known currently as the above, never once did i get a bloody problem.

I started using the stuff when sulphur content of fuel was reduced, and shortly after lots of injection pumps started to disintegrate, my mate who worked at Cummins put the bale for this squarely on suplhur reduction (sulphur being a good lube) and suggested i use Millers as a substitute, i never looked back.

 

I have seen posts from people who despise such stuff, call it snake oil etc, and i've seen other usually not quite so hysterical posts from satisfied users, and some of them have mentioned that over time regular use of Millers has helped keep their EGR's clean too.

 

Yet again following another PC failure i have lost the link i had, the original came from a Seat forum i believe, so more intrepid PC whizzers here might well be able to find it, me i'm a useless twat with a PC...hmmph not much fuckin use with owt else if truth be told.

 

Anyway one of the Universities did a test of Millers with before and after pictures of the injector nozzles, and power graphs IIRC, even after a couple of tanks of the mixture going through the injectors were cleaning up nicely from their cruddy sooty previous condition.

 

Others swear by a dose of two stroke oil in the fuel, either in addition to the Millers or as their personal thing, again many reports of gains especially smooth running, and many posts slating such action.

 

If you want to keep the EGR in place it might be interesting to remove it and fully clean it, then to refit and use Millers for the normal time it takes to crud up, then remove and examine, it might cost twenty quid for the experiment but if it cures the problem...

 

Thats it, i'll shut me hole again....hang on there are some beardy blokes on camels coming down the path, they've got the hump...aarrrgh

[twosmoke300]

If the car has a mass air flow meter then blanking the egr will bring the mil light on at some point . It knows the air flow should decrease when the egr is open so if it doesn't see the drop it brings the light on.

Fucking egr is a terrible idea , like making someone eat their own Shit.

 

Lots of grief with cars in Cornwall cos it's all short journeys.

[dave21478]

I use 2 stroke oil in the diesel and it genuinely makes a positive difference. My daily is a Freelander td4 - yeah, I must have been a complete bastard in a previous life - and 60ml of 2-stroke oil to a full tank makes it run noticeably smoother. My vehicle use is too inconsistent to get a comparison of MPG, but it has certainly not done it any harm.

Dont use synthetic oil, get the cheapest basic mineral oil, preferably with a low ash content.

 

I also cleaned the EGR and unplugged it - it was actuated by vacuum pressure, just just pulling off the hose and plugging the end with a bolt disabled it and made no difference to the running of the engine.

[Bren]

Quite a few vec owners swear by putting a bit of two stroke in.

 

However I am of the opinion that although it may make the car smoother, it will be burnt oil nonetheless, so will only add to the sooting up problems.

[I_am_Diesel]

I had an Astra with the 1.3CDTi engine and the EGR valve was a constant pain in the arse. It always gave symptoms associated with other sensors, like lacking power as if the MAF sensor was on the blink or dodgy starting like there was a MAP sensor problem. I cleaned the EGR valve, got it running something like and got rid. Pity really because the rest of the car wasn't too bad.

 

Dear Vauxhall

 

Why did you choose to put dodgy Fiat engines in your cars? Did you let Jimmy Saville babysit for you as well?

[Bren]

I must admit during times like this if there was a petrol v diesel debate it would be 1-0 to the petrol.

 

I do about 13 k a year, which in know is'nt a lot, however my car can do 50+ mpg on a run - the petrol equivalent will not get near that. Lots of people will claim that they do, if this was the case none of us would have diesel cars.

[red5]

EGR valves do the job that they are intended to no problem - it's the job , or the lack of alternatives to it that cause the problem. And blind adherence to emissions targets set in a borderline tombola fashion. They, and the pain/hassle/failure/cost associated with them are the price for pandering to demand for ridiculous power/'low' emissions/poor fuel quality/wrong fuel that is artificially induced.

[I_am_Diesel]

..........and it's only going to get worse.

[gordonbennet]

Its cos of bollox like EGR, DPF's, DMF's, fuckin incompetent injectors apparently made from 24ct gold, fragile pissin pumps and all the other crap, that i now run auto petrols with LPG conversions.

 

Sold our last Diesel a couple of years ago, and unless we get one so cheap we can weigh the sod in the moment it hiccups we'll never have another bugger.

[I_am_Diesel]

I blame the tree hugging, mealy mouthed liberals in the EU that are constantly directing the lowering of emissions that vehicles are allowed to emit. By the pure nature of the diesel engine, it is the one that needs the most development to reduce harmful gases, but as one system eliminates one harmful substance, another rears it's head so another system has to be added to stifle that particular harmful emission, and so on and so forth.

 

I too have given up on modern diesels, I'd rather lose some MPG and have a car that doesn't spend half it's life connected to an EOBD device.

 

I blame trees and polar bears. Bastards!

[londonm]

I was chatting to my mate today who looks after the local taxi companies cars. They run Skoda Octavia 1.6 TDi's and he was showing me a EGR unit they had just replaced, apparently they only last 60000 miles before the carbon from cheap fuel clogs up this arm up from springing back which then puts the car in limp mode. The trouble is you can't just by the arm part, you have to buy the whole unit which costs £400+vat then it's a 3 hour job removing it from the back of the engine!.

 

This one Octavia was a 62 plate and was on it's second unit already, at 120000 miles.

Mind, 120,000 miles is a lot for a two year old car. Probably already clapped out.

[lisbon_road]

As we are ranting.

 

Rather than my usual shite car, at the moment I have a VW Touran to sell.  A complex diesel beast. 

 

I can't help but think that it could be a whole lot simpler if it didn't go so incredibly quick.  A lot of this complexity is aimed at reducing emissions and making it go like the proverbial off a shovel.  I am sure if it didn't go so fast, they could manage decent emissions (a worthwhile aim after all) without quite so much complexity.

 

That's my thought for the day. 

[forddeliveryboy]

Yep, diesels have steadily got worse over the last 15 years. Wouldn't go near anything post 2000 personally, unless one of the odd VWs which squeezed through with the old TDi system, or a Skoda with the same up to 2005. Whole point of a diesel - they're simpler than clockwork and need no electrics to make them run - has been lost. Besides, modern petrols are DI and very eco-nomcl.

 

406 1.9TD about right - car and engine both simple, rot-free bodies in general. The HDis are good, but there's more to go wrong. Xantias just as tough and long-lasting, so long as they're not sabotaged by mechanics who're frightened of the green stuff.

[twosmoke300]

Was chatting about similar topics to the fil today and agreed that diesel development peaked with the 2.5di transit motor.

Yes it's noisy , it's a diesel ffs. But my God are they reliable

[red5]

As we are ranting.

 

Rather than my usual shite car, at the moment I have a VW Touran to sell.  A complex diesel beast. 

 

I can't help but think that it could be a whole lot simpler if it didn't go so incredibly quick.  A lot of this complexity is aimed at reducing emissions and making it go like the proverbial off a shovel.  I am sure if it didn't go so fast, they could manage decent emissions (a worthwhile aim after all) without quite so much complexity.

 

That's my thought for the day. 

 

Yes. Easily.

[Guest Lord Sward]

You've got to regularly use a good quality fuel additive with good quality diesel to keep these things clean.

[Stroller133]

Not sure about Vectra's but a blanking plate with a small hole drilled can prevent fouling but give give enough airflow to prevent MIL coming on.

[TimothyClaypole]

I replaced the one on my Astra with a new one and it made no difference, stupid thing.

 

Went back to my home made blanking plate and it runs ok again, have to put up with the EM light being on all the time.  

[rainagain]

A lot of people on the vegoilforum recommended adding acetone to diesel. Improves mpg and helps keep engine clean. I always meant to try it in the 206 but never got round to it

[forddeliveryboy]

A lot of people on the vegoilforum recommended adding acetone to diesel. Improves mpg and helps keep engine clean. I always meant to try it in the 206 but never got round to it

 

Veg or bio does this anyway - acetone is used to improve engine response (it reduces surface tension, allowing better atomisation) and economy when running on veg. Used at 0.15%.

[forddeliveryboy]

As we are ranting.

 

Rather than my usual shite car, at the moment I have a VW Touran to sell.  A complex diesel beast. 

 

I can't help but think that it could be a whole lot simpler if it didn't go so incredibly quick.  A lot of this complexity is aimed at reducing emissions and making it go like the proverbial off a shovel.  I am sure if it didn't go so fast, they could manage decent emissions (a worthwhile aim after all) without quite so much complexity.

 

That's my thought for the day. 

 

Agree. We should ration things - it pisses me off that the more electricity I use, the cheaper it gets. Same for gas, no doubt. Cars are de-smogged to the point they're unaffordable to repair when older. It's hardly eco-friendly to crush a car which isn't rusty or mechanically worn but has a couple of dash lights showing which will cost over a grand to sort. Cars with less than 60hp could have a simpler system fitted. DPFs are just crazy. Governments only measure what they choose to measure, emissions-wise.

 

Emissions from just one coal fire running for its first hour are probably 5,000 times worse than from one modern diesel running all day up the motorway. Oil boilers shove all sorts of nasties into the air. Commuting is almost as important as a warm house in today's world. There seems to be a discrepancy.

 

Everyone should be allotted an amount of cheaply-priced fuel for their transport, same for domestic energy. Then normal price, then for use well above and beyond, there should be a premium so those who can afford subsidise the cheap fuel - which they themselves will use as well. Tough luck for Yank-lovers, I guess.

[Pillock]

Wasn't it SAAB who once claimed that in certain cities, the air coming out of their cars was cleaner than the air going in?

[gordonbennet]

Wasn't it SAAB who once claimed that in certain cities, the air coming out of their cars was cleaner than the air going in?

 

Don't know if its true but the same is said about the emissions on my MAN lorry, and so it should be seeing as the retail price of a new exhaust, should it fail is £11,000.

 

To be fair, whenever one of our equally new 62 plate Scanias is ticking over i end up nearly choking on the floor from the fumes if i'm anywhere near, but i could stick me nose right by the MAN's arse!? and breath easy.

[forddeliveryboy]

Once had a 2cv as daily transport, took it for a test and the HC was seriously low, like 50ppm HC and 0.3% CO or something. Tester said all the 2cvs he tested were lowish if running right but not as low as that, he put another car on the machine to check its sanity. All was working as it should. tbf, it was a very snug engine which had been serviced well all its life and had done under 100k.

 

Modern car emissions are tons better than they were  - at what cost to the environment? - but everyone knows the manufacturers cook the figures as it were, by making the engine software give artificially low emissions for the EU test regime. Amazing how many vehicles are just under all the thresholds for taxation. Bet it makes them far less driveable and far more polluting in the real world.

[Pillock]

Someone on here was saying that some Ford engines (XR3i?) have a flat spot which is all about passing emissions tests. Turns the fuelling down at the rev range it's tested at. A bit sneaky but easily overcome I suppose, explains how Superchips et al can report such big gains.

[saucedoctor]

My mate has just got a Terraclean EGR machine thingie for his garage. He tells me he's only used it once so far, but it seems to be a good solution/alternative to taking the buggers off and disassembling them.

 

http://www.terraclean.net/product.php?id=57