Question for the management and forum

[RoadworkUK]

I was a long time unregistered lurker, and then one day I couldn't stand it any more and had to introduce myself to the regulars. The piano stopped playing, a dart hit the wall and the barman stopped pouring for a moment, but nowadays, as long as I don't get in the way, everyone lets me sit quietly in the corner near the jukebox. Yet still it's the forum I want to be associated with, and needs protecting from shoutier establishments. Rather like my local, by happenstance.

[scaryoldcortina]

I was a long time unregistered lurker, and then one day I couldn't stand it any more and had to introduce myself to the regulars. The piano stopped playing, a dart hit the wall and the barman stopped pouring for a moment, but nowadays, as long as I don't get in the way, everyone lets me sit quietly in the corner near the jukebox. Yet still it's the forum I want to be associated with, and needs protecting from shoutier establishments. Rather like my local, by happenstance.

 

That's nowt compared to what happened when Norm lumbered through the door and asked what the pentacle on the wall was about.....

[freebird]

Freebird. Do you want some ketchup for that chip?

I take it you are the resident smart arse.

Well thats fucking told me!

Many thanks for your warm welcome to a newbie.

 

Doesn't make for endearing yourself to the regulars, who have had 6 months of total strangers swearing/fighting, trying to sell dodgy DVDs, asking where the bog is all the time and then vanishing again having contributed nothing. Ok, someone was a little tetchy with you. Big deal, move on.

 

I'm not against newbies - I've only been here a year myself, but I made some effort to fit in and not annoy the old boys too much (except bollox) I was just observing that the happy accident of it being almost impossible to register unless you were determined to join was what made the old Autoshite what it was. Don't forget we are not dealing with normal people. These folk think a Talbot Solara (Brown, beige trim) is an object of admiration, desire even. Sudden change is hard on them, and it is the regulars who "make" a forum. Newbies have to fit in, not want to change the place to suit themselves.

Ah, and there Sir, is the nub of the problem. I told him politely to fuck off and i moved on. Unfortunately somebody else, as Vic reeves used to say "Wouldnt let it lie" so I found myself standing my ground, hardly a crime is it? Did I join up to endear myself to the "regulars" or just talk about Auto shite?

You, Scary are no newbie, you have been around the forums like a tarts danced around her handbag, you are well known and have interacted with plenty of people here before you joined, you are being a tad disingenous Sir.

I quite agree that regulars maketh the forum and, im sure you will concede, newbies are its life blood. The lack of percieved quality in said newbies has more to do with spammers than anything else, something that not much can be done about without some degree of proactive moderation and, ive got to say, that the forum needs active moderation. Lets not delude ourselves, the average forum is frequented by big kids and, just like being at school, you have to have somebody to keep a degree of discipline. How much will depend on the pupils...

Id like to paste the following to the end of this. I was, unlike some of you, in contact with Scooters trying to persuade him to return. Im fully aware that most of you couldnt be arsed or didnt actually care but i did because he was a good guy and had things to say that were interesting.

Anyway, I wont drag this all out, i respect you Scary for your articulate responses but i dont agree with them, thats what makes the world go round, right?

FB,

I've been reading the forum since but not contributing - interesting to see that LH in particular seems pleased with the result. What these idiots don't understand is writing an amusing and interesting story means infusing that story with some personality. Ergo if you take the personality out of the story all you get is a list of boring facts. You cannot have the one without the other. I went back through my posts for the last 6 months and out of all the threads I posted only 3 were non car related and one of those was a Merry Xmas thread so where they get their gripe from I don't know. I suspect it comes down to resentment and bitterness. Until October last year I was well known for changing cars very frequently, this is because I could fund my shite adventures with mileage money from work..this gave me the material for the stories which I thought would appeal to the site. It did to some but clearly just made others jealous.

 

I will not return to the site mainly because I cannot separate my personality from the content I post, they cannot have the good without the bad, that is how it works. I am happy to receive constructive criticism but not personal abuse from contributors who rarely add anything constructive to the debate and who have the brass neck to accuse others of filling the site with shit when their daily posting rates are 6-7 posts per day and mine was about 1.6. I don't see this as being bullied - I've not let myself be bullied since I was 12 and my withdrawal from the site is an online response to the attempt to do so. LH can call it 'spitting the dummy' if he wants but I really don't care what he thinks. What I don't get is how he feels that the forum exists for him to 'let of steam' that he can't do in the real world and that only his interpretation of why the forum exists is valid.That smacks of arrogance in the ext ream and hypocrisy.

 

I notice that the moderators have deleted the 'cheerio' thread, doesn't surprise me really, after all they don't want the site to completely disintegrate so there seems to have been a great deal of hand wringing and forced humour about it and a willingness to move on and brush the issue under the carpet. However it won't go away and more people will stop reading the site as it becomes more like the PC forum, dominated by one or two egos.

 

This might seem like arrogance and conceit on my part and maybe it is, however, I write them, that's how I work and and such will not be sharing any of these stories online again.

 

increasing numbers of people are getting fed up with the tone of the site and are leaving, it is a sad state of affairs when someone as decent and friendly as Torsten says he is fed up with it...

 

Fred Transit - bullied

SirTainley Barking- bullied

newbes - bullied and abused

 

 

Well, they picked a fight with the wrong one here and Pog/RP's withdrawal from the site (probably to come back as another username) demonstrates that he seriously misjudged 'mood' of the forum and smacks of dummy spitting...my withdrawal was to make a point that there are consequences for this sort of behaviour.

 

Feel free to quote any of this!

 

all the best and keep in touch

 

Richscooters

Rank: Citroen Ami

 

Posts: 1278

Joined: Mon Jul 06, 2009 2:55 pm

Private message

** Amen**

[Mr_Bo11ox]

When was Sir Tainly given an earful then? Has he cleared off as well?

[Albert Ross]

This place is like being at school...

So some kids get "shown the blue Goldfish" in the bogs. Half of them go screaming to Mummy and never get seen again.

Others punch the bullies in the face. And are therefore left alone.

Some never get offered to see the goldfish.

Anyone care to think why not?

 

Strikes me the "bullies" have left the building. Of their own accord. I was accused of being one, months ago, whether rightly or wrongly I don't really know. After that moment, I now pause a moment before hitting the "send" button. It helps to stop me appearing more of a knobhead than I actually am. In real life, I am a contentious bastard, I say what I see. Nothing changes because I am typing, the only difference is that you can't see me smile when I'm talking, not can you hear the tone of my voice. I suggest people learn to read between lines. Human nature is a funny thing. Kids can also be cruel. Is there life on Mars?

 

I have met people from this forum. Would they suggest I am different in real life? Ask them. I'm sure we're all adults here. Aren't we?

[Guest marcellogandini]

What do you all think of these super injunctions?

[Cavcraft]

Freebird: Just because you don't see something posted on here doesn't mean pm's weren't winging their way about you know. I'd also suggest that because a few people were silent doesn't mean they didn't care or were scared to respond on here.

Some people just want it back the way it was pre-fallout and coming on here to face constant bickering or wondering who was going to explode with rage next was probably enough to deter people from posting in the 'great' debate.

 

There's enough shit in real life without having to face it on here too, Autoshite should really be an escape from the rigours of work, life and arguments. yes, the Grumpy thread was heavily subscribed but at least it was contained in one (bloody long) thread and ther was the choice not to read it. The bickering seemed to pop up (almost) everywhere though and it was soul destroying, especially when decent members packed their bags. God alone knows I stuck my oar in enough times with messages like I'm typing now but surely to God this can all just bleeding well go away now? Least said, soonest mended I think the expression is. And no, I'm not trying to have the last word here in case you think so. I'm just pissed off that when you think it's all over it sort of flares up again.

[trigger]

When was Sir Tainly given an earful then? Has he cleared off as well?

 

Seeing that he has posted about 4-5 times today i would have said no.

 

I must be very naive, I've hardly seen any bulling towards other memebers since I've been here, Ok, some people have been a bit blunt and rude but i can often see the humour in the posts, Maybe it's because I've got use to the regulars posting personalities on here to tell when they are joking and not.

 

Yes Albert you used to swear too much, as did Wat, people moaned about it and now both of you seem much better, whether you took notice and think before you press submit or not i don't now but your both still here and better for it i think, Why can't everyone else be the same instead of taking it too personal and start dummy throwing?.

[Alexg]

I look forward to the day when I can log on to Autoshite and not read posts complaining about what member 'bullied' another. Its getting rather tedious. Have a Tagora

 

[Mr_Bo11ox]

I must say, I cant think of a single case of what I would class as 'bullying' on here. I do all my bullying on 'Facebook' as there are more young children on there, much easier.

[scaryoldcortina]

Ah, and there Sir, is the nub of the problem. I told him politely to fuck off and i moved on. Unfortunately somebody else, as Vic reeves used to say "Wouldnt let it lie" so I found myself standing my ground, hardly a crime is it? Did I join up to endear myself to the "regulars" or just talk about Auto shite?

The nub of the problem is that you can't plitely tell someone to fuck off. It's a contradiction. Either you are saying "fuck off" or you are being polite. and for the record, you did use the F-word. You don't have to become bestest buddies with anyone, but try not to piss them off either.

You, Scary are no newbie, you have been around the forums like a tarts danced around her handbag, you are well known and have interacted with plenty of people here before you joined, you are being a tad disingenous Sir.

Why thank you. You have no idea how much I enjoy being compared to a whore. FWIW, i've been around longer than the internet and I get on with pretty much everyone I know. I came here to talk about about old cars that haven't been OMG slammed.

I quite agree that regulars maketh the forum and, I'm sure you will concede, newbies are its life blood. The lack of percieved quality in said newbies has more to do with spammers than anything else, something that not much can be done about without some degree of proactive moderation and, ive got to say, that the forum needs active moderation. Lets not delude ourselves, the average forum is frequented by big kids and, just like being at school, you have to have somebody to keep a degree of discipline. How much will depend on the pupils...

 

No, like I said, this forum just needs the reward separating from the request. Make people wait before they can post. Then the instant gratification cycle ends and most of the dross go back to facebook.

Anyway, I wont drag this all out, i respect you Scary for your articulate responses but i dont agree with them, thats what makes the world go round, right?

Fair enough. I never ask anyone to agree with me, just to listen and argue sensibly.

 

 

I will not return to the site mainly because I cannot separate my personality from the content I post, they cannot have the good without the bad, that is how it works. I am happy to receive constructive criticism but not personal abuse from contributors who rarely add anything constructive to the debate and who have the brass neck to accuse others of filling the site with shit when their daily posting rates are 6-7 posts per day and mine was about 1.6. I don't see this as being bullied - I've not let myself be bullied since I was 12 and my withdrawal from the site is an online response to the attempt to do so. LH can call it 'spitting the dummy' if he wants but I really don't care what he thinks. What I don't get is how he feels that the forum exists for him to 'let of steam' that he can't do in the real world and that only his interpretation of why the forum exists is valid.That smacks of arrogance in the ext ream and hypocrisy.

 

Aaand breathe.... seriously, if it bothers you that much go see your doctor! The internet is not reality, and it's hard enough to judge what someone else may have meant without trying to extrapolate another's motives from his cryptic postings. I doon't know what the hell Len is on about most of the time, so I don't bother trying to figure it out. There is a foe button too, if you really can't filter it out.

 

Still, I guess you must be traveling on now, cause there's too many places you got to see...

[trigger]

Still, I guess you must be traveling on now, cause there's too many places you got to see...

 

Oh can you play that on your mandolin?, If so then I'd LOVE to hear it, That is one of my most favorite guitar songs ever!

[scaryoldcortina]

Just for you, I'll do that tomorrow. I'm far too pissed right now. (hic)

edit-

For some reason, I already uploaded a guitar version for some alternate universe forum discussion last year some time

[trigger]

LEGEND

[KruJoe]

Freebird: Just because you don't see something posted on here doesn't mean pm's weren't winging their way about you know.

Correct.

I'd also suggest that because a few people were silent doesn't mean they didn't care or were scared to respond on here.

Indeed, I had a very similar exchange of personal emails (not pms) with Scooters, but despite his giving permission to re-post his words, I chose not too, because...

I'm just pissed off that when you think it's all over it sort of flares up again.

 

Perhaps now this thread has had its chance, and everyone's had ample time to consider and express (if they wish) their thoughts on the original question; it has peaked.

Many valid points have been made, and it cannot go much further forward. We're now at risk of disproportionate navel-gazing if we start re-covering the same old rough ground.

[dieselnutjob]

I have been a moderator on http://forums.tdiclub.com/ for must be nearly ten years.

 

It can be a right pain in the arse. It's lucky I'm not really interested in TDIs any more.

The amount of moderation that goes into that site is amazing. There must be about ten or a dozen moderators on there.

 

Once you become a moderator you can't enjoy a site as a normal subscriber any more. It totally ruins it. Also you cannot moderate a site unless it has very, very clear rules. I never moderate on tdiclub without explaining what rule was broken. I don't think you guys would like the rules they have on tdiclub

[scaryoldcortina]

Is rule #1 "don't talk about tdiclub"?

[Mr_Bo11ox]

'If someone says stop, goes limp, taps out, the thread is locked.'

[scaryoldcortina]

All right, if the applicant is young, tell him he's too young. Old, too old. Fat, too fat. If the applicant then waits for three days without food, shelter, or encouragement he may then enter and begin his training.

[autofive]

i havent commented on this thread, so far, but i think its time

 

i dont know why people left / deleted their posts, or both, but....thats their choice, and i have no doubt that most of them will be back.

i think this forum needs very very light, but regular, moderation to weed out the spammers and the tossers looking for a fight or just to troll.

i lurked on this forum for about 4 years before regularly posting, and like scary said, came here because i was utterly sick of stretch, stanced, shiny crap on RR, and of course the anal-nature of that forums owner, and arse licking pseudo-moderators. Autoshite offered a platform to post my own motoring exploits, read about other peoples, spotted and ebay threads and the whole ethos of autoshite (it seems to me, please correct me if im wide of the mark) is running a shiteoldmotor because its cheap, reliable and 'fun'. everything else is marginal. Dummy spitting and bullying is not my fave. thing to see, or read about - so i just carry on without reading about it.

AS is a very special forum, i like it just the way it is. Please dont change it just because of a few spammers and pricks.

[AeroNautiCal]

I really don't think that the absence of Revolting & Hatred is a loss to the forum.

 

The opposite, in fact.

[messerschmitt owner]

What we need is to lose 'Bump for a real thread'.

 

People should be able to self moderate - and ignore the tossers.

 

However, we need a mod who can delete spammers as they appear, and everyone else should be left to fend for themselves. Friend or foe works well, not that I use it.

 

If you don't like a thread don't read it - it really is as simple as that.

[254575]

I have a theory. The recent turmoil is more to do with membership criteria than moderation.

 

I know that sounds a bit odd, but bear with me..

Think back to the "old" forum, and how hard it was to get approved for membership - you needed approval from a moderator to join, the mods are largely absent and it could take weeks before you could post, and often you needed another autoshiter to plead on your behalf, or join and post in a special purgatory forum to gain membership. This, obviously, takes some effort on the new member's part and only those truly dedicated to the cause succeeded. Result? Nice, cosy slow forum with good content and (mostly) good atmosphere. Kind of like a village pub in a way.

 

Now, the new forum. Easy, instant access for anyone who stumbles across us with google. Spambots, trolls, delusional teenagers and all manner of rubbish can now me full posting members with only an email address and about a 20 second wait. Instant gratification, and no need to spend 3 weeks "mute" reading the place and wanting to join in, just wade in and annoy the regulars. It's like the village pub got bought by wetherspoons and they are busing in people from slough. Old Ted is really pissed off, he didn't finish his pint and he's taken his dominoes home with him.

 

I'm inclined to agree with this. It felt like an exclusive club! Now it's like pistonheads with "what car" threads

[Guest marcellogandini]

I really don't think that the absence of Revolting & Hatred is a loss to the forum.

 

The opposite, in fact.

 

I'm sure any benefits in losing them will be wiped out by incomprehensible Practical Classics forum rejects like you and freebird posting.

[Spottedlaurel]

Be interesting to see how self-moderation works out on this thread...

[Cavcraft]

I really don't think that the absence of Revolting & Hatred is a loss to the forum.

 

The opposite, in fact.

 

I'm sure any benefits in losing them will be wiped out by incomprehensible Practical Classics forum rejects like you and freebird posting.

 

Except we haven't quite lost one of them have we? Obvious troll is obvious and all that.

[Justin Case]

I really don't think that the absence of Revolting & Hatred is a loss to the forum.

 

The opposite, in fact.

 

I'm sure any benefits in losing them will be wiped out by incomprehensible Practical Classics forum rejects like you and freebird posting.

 

The perfect illustration of why this thread started in the first place

[AeroNautiCal]

I'm sure any benefits in losing them will be wiped out by incomprehensible Practical Classics forum rejects like you and freebird posting.

 

Ah', Hatred returns, following yet another identity crisis...

[Guest]

I'm sure any benefits in losing them will be wiped out by incomprehensible Practical Classics forum rejects like you and freebird posting.

 

Ah', Hatred returns, following yet another identity crisis...

 

And the cycle of unhappiness continues.

 

Please lads, wind your necks in.

[trigger]

I started this thread to get the views and opinions of the forum, I thought twice about pressing submit uncase i inadvertently started another PU51 thread but i thought as its an adult forum you guys would be mature enough to have a friendly, adult debate without name calling.

 

Yet again I've been proved wrong, its a shame you can't lock your own threads.