project SiC's consolidated moderns - 2004 BMW Z4 2.2, 2005 BMW 330i and (borrowed) 2007 Porsche Cayman

[JakeT]

On mine if you snap the throttle open it will stumble, and then rev cleanly. If moving and in gear it will sometimes struggle and require a change down if you ask for a lot at low revs (below 1,500). As said, I tend to drive around it and go months without noticing an issue. Some say it’s coil packs tired, some plugs, some VANOS solenoids. Who knows. I need to do plugs in mine at the next service and I’ll see if it changes anything.

 

I also have no codes, so nothing to help narrow it down. Mines on 216k now.

[SiC]

3 minutes ago, JakeT said:

On mine if you snap the throttle open it will stumble, and then rev cleanly. If moving and in gear it will sometimes struggle and require a change down if you ask for a lot at low revs (below 1,500). As said, I tend to drive around it and go months without noticing an issue. Some say it’s coil packs tired, some plugs, some VANOS solenoids. Who knows. I need to do plugs in mine at the next service and I’ll see if it changes anything.

 

I also have no codes, so nothing to help narrow it down. Mines on 216k now.

Does yours have a lumpy idle on start? Especially if been sat for a day or so.

Mine is pretty lumpy for about 5 to 10 seconds and then clears itself out. Googling suggests TADIS as they get older. 

Perhaps mine would be stumbling on a snap open throttle if it was attached to a manual gearbox. But the extra load of a auto torque converter is too much and causes the stall?

[cort16]

It's probably a co-incidence but have you checked your auto gearbox oil lately? When I had my 7 series when it was cold it would stall when I put into gear until it had warmed up slightly.

Turns out my gearbox had a hole  in the pan and the oil was slowlyu all leaking out. When I got it fixed and filled back to a normal level it didn't do it anymore (it drove fine otherwise).

[SiC]

I believe it was changed recently. But I don't know exactly what has been done nor what was used as I haven't been given any of the service history yet. 🫤

[cort16]

21 minutes ago, SiC said:

I believe it was changed recently. But I don't know exactly what has been done nor what was used as I haven't been given any of the service history yet. 🫤

No dipstick either I guess?

[JakeT]

2 hours ago, SiC said:

Does yours have a lumpy idle on start? Especially if been sat for a day or so.

Mine is pretty lumpy for about 5 to 10 seconds and then clears itself out. Googling suggests TADIS as they get older. 

Perhaps mine would be stumbling on a snap open throttle if it was attached to a manual gearbox. But the extra load of an auto torque converter is too much and causes the stall?

Occasionally, it does yeah. A bit like a vac leak with the revs hunting a little for maybe 2-3 seconds. It happens 1 in 20 starts I’d say, and only when cold.

 

Try and stab the throttle with it in park and see what it does. If I go WOT it will struggle and hunt, then rev cleanly. Only on a fast press and hold of the pedal. You’re right though, with an auto it could stall the engine. I suppose you can’t try and load it up at very low revs as the converter will unlock or the gearbox will change down.

[SiC]

Hooked up my smoke machine yesterday.

Smoke comes out quick enough. This is within a few seconds of turn on. Once it gets going, a healthy amount of smoke comes out.

It quickly found a leak at the back of the engine. A mess of pipes meant I had to pull more hoses off and bung up some of the orifices to seal the system.

The leak was coming from this split bung on the back of the intake manifold.

I didn't have a replacement bung, so I made up my own with a bit of fuel hose, clevis pin and a clamp.

Which worked surprisingly well!

Ran up the smoke machine for a bit and everything seemed sealed.

Also tested this dooflapper. It's what pipes the intake noise from the intake manifold into the cabin. Makes it sound sportier and while a bit fake, at least not completely.

Anyway, despite my fears, this seemed to be sealed. The diaphragm inside looks perfectly fine too.

 

Top end seemed leak free too. Removing the oil cap had plenty of smoke flow. But it kept that smoke inside the engine with it on.

Running up the engine didn't really show much difference in the trims. Albeit this was not a drive, just having it idle on the drive.

I think the CCV system on this is shot. Putting a glove over the oil cap sucks it in pretty good. Apparently it should only be a light vacuum.

Internet wisdom says it's a crap design and normal to replace it after 80k to 100k. I have no record of it being done and the odometer is currently on 178k...

Looked on Amazon to find a Febi cold weather kit at £75 delivered for today. I was going to wait for prime day, but that was the last one and I suspected prime day might have made it go up in price.

So that's arriving later. Not sure when I'll do it but the plan is to put the Spitfire back into storage and it'll allow me to work on the Z4 in the garage without getting wet for a change. My plan is to do it with the manifold on. More fiddly but that manifold isn't leaking and I don't want to disturb 20yr old plastic that likely hasn't been moved since it was put on in the factory.

I also think the Vanos probably needs a rebuild. Certainly sounds a bit rattly.

Should I be putting this much effort into a tatty, 20yr old base spec 178k mile Z4? 

Probably not. 🙃

 

 

I'm looking forward to seeing any performance differences and seeing if the 2.2 is too limp to be justified in a roadster, once it's working as it should be.

(It'll probably shit it's clutch next - I think it might be original to the car from no history of it being changed)

[Split_Pin]

Really interesting to see the work on the 2.2. I'd be keen to know the differences between the Z4 installation and the 5er. It certainly won't have that noise pipe thing 😂

[SiC]

14 minutes ago, Split_Pin said:

Really interesting to see the work on the 2.2. I'd be keen to know the differences between the Z4 installation and the 5er. It certainly won't have that noise pipe thing 😂

Tbh I reckon it's pretty similar. Two of the things I've learnt is that, BMW tend not to change things between models and engines unless really necessary, and secondly that some bits are well engineered (engine and suspension for one) but the rest is all a bit thrown together with a nice veneer to make it look like a completely polished product. Probably controversial to say, but it feels like what a lot of British car manufacturers do/did. 

[JakeT]

You’re both right. It’s going to be  the same engine in every way bar exhaust in inlet before the throttle body.

 

Only Z4 and 3 series compact got the sound box, 5 and 7 series usually got a different inlet duct to cut noise. But it is quite BL in that the same engines went in all cars with minor tweaks. My Mrs had a 2.2 Z3 and the engine would be the same as E60 and Z4. Makes it easy to find bits, mind.

 

Also the CCV probably needs changing. They’re very prone to causing vac leaks, my dads X5 had two sets in 275,000 miles. I got away with it on my 325ti, but I only took it from 61-105k.

[cort16]

I made my own smoke machine using some smoke matches a jar and  some plastic hose it worked surprisingly well .
I did the pcv on my 2.5 z4 and it wasn’t too bad . TBH unless you’re just enjoying tinkering with with it I’d leave it alone if it’s running okay . I felt I needed to intervene with the pcv on when  mine was burning more oil than petrol.

[cort16]

Have you considered this paint scheme it’s got to add at least 50bhp?

[SiC]

CCV kit arrived yesterday 

This is the cold weather kit. Made for colder climates where it's more likely to freeze the parts up. Cold as in northern Canada cold according to the BMW service bulletin...

I only got this version as it happed to be £40 cheaper on Amazon than the standard version. Basically everything comes insulated - the CCV is wearing a cute little jacket.

I evicted the Spitfire 

Its a pretty little car. However I paid nearly 3 times for it than the Z4. That was cheap (at the time at least) too. Classic cars really aren't worth what they go for.

While the Z4 fitted in the garage, there wasn't a whole lot of room to work. I did actually move it over further but I decided that the weather was finally decent and it made more sense to work outside anyway. So I put them all back in  😅

While I had the bonnet up, I had a quick check of the coolant. It took a good 300ml to fill back up again. Hmm. Just put water in for now.

Stripped off the intake.

Then the throttle body, DISA valve and associated wiring. Handily I took a photo of it with my torch right in the middle of the shot. Go me.

Here is the prize.

Which I extracted after a bit of wrangling.

Date coded 2004, so original to the car.

 

Fitted the new hoses - god they're a bastard to get in. The CCV with it's jacket on just wouldn't fit. Possibly do-able with the manifold off but far too tight with it on. Hence gave up on that idea and removed it's jacket. After all, the original has been in there for 20yrs and hasn't frozen up or anything in the UK climate.

Then finished buttoning it all up. This is where I was at last night when I called it quits.

The new bottom hose I'm not entirely happy with. It's gone in and clicked, but it's at quite a tight position with enough side force to pull it out slightly at an angle. Hard to photo but it's not seated completely flat.

Will this be a problem? I don't know and I hope not.

Before I wrestle on the intake hoses, I'm going to smoke test it again to check this and the other bits I've disturbed don't leak. Bloody hope not as I don't really want to do it again. The old pipe I think is reusable if this new one is a problem. I think its just a couple of millimetres to short to properly mate fully in. 

[Split_Pin]

I think a few heat cycles and that pipe will settle in 🙂 

I agree about classic cars not being worth it. The Cavaliers were old enough for my wife and son not to want to be seen dead in, and old enough for me to not want to use over the winter. Family is my priority so I don't really want to be going to car shows on my own and sitting around in the stench of vapes/hash and people talking bollocks. As I work from home, they therefore just sat in the garage most of the time and only really went out to the one car show I do love up at Glenisla or the monthly Retroshite meets.

I did fancy a Minor but when I saw that £10k bought a 'good' example, in light of the above, it's absolutely out of the question. 

My requirements are under £2.5k, 4 seats, reasonably interesting and usable. Maybe if something retro came up for around that figure I could afford to have it as a trinket for a while.

[cort16]

I like looking at the old stuff but have gone off owning it. I had that lovely v6 mk3 Granada manual that was pretty easy to live with but I always found myself having to make the effort to take it out. 

 

[Split_Pin]

That was a bargain for what you had it up for and I was very tempted but for the exact reason you said, I passed 😞

[SiC]

I was tempted to give the Spitfire a run last night when I had it out. Weather was a rare sunny warm evening which hasn't been the case for most of this year.

I still get crippling anxiety that it'll breakdown and let me down. Despite it never really doing that to me (unlike the BGT).

Definitely I have to be in the right mood for it.

I'm on the look out for something else that I can potter around in. Ideally Austin 1100 shaped or something else pre-1975 porridge British like an A35 or bigger like an Oxford/Cambridge. Will be cheap and probably a little tatty, as I like the lack of stress that it gives. Ideally it can live outside as barrier to using is reduced further if its on the drive - so I don't need to move cars off the drive and something out of the garage if I'm only running down to the shops / gym.

 

Booked the 330i in for it's MOT earlier. Earliest I can get it in is the 13th August. I think it's about this time of year when all the COVID MOT extensions came to an end.

Also 2 months of ownership. Feels longer! My apathy for cars has come from it. Literally does everything I need to in a car and makes driving easy. So much so, I tend to jump in the 330i over even the Z4. Major reason why I'm trying to restore lost power in the Z4 as it irritates me that I know it's unnecessarily slower than it should be. Overtakes are possible but need to be much more planned. I haven't done a 0-60 but I suspect it's nearer 10s right now in the Z4.

[Split_Pin]

9 minutes ago, SiC said:

power

The 5er feels quite brisk, in a progressive way so your Z4 should definitely be able to handle overtakes.

[SiC]

2 hours ago, Split_Pin said:

The 5er feels quite brisk, in a progressive way so your Z4 should definitely be able to handle overtakes.

This is fairly flat until 5k where it suddenly picks up. Smooth but not progressive torque as I'd expect. Disconnecting the MAF increases performance a bit. Likewise the fuel trims are high. Which both points to an intake vacuum leaks. 

I imagine once I get this CCV replaced, it should be a fair bit quicker.

However I think it'll be faster from 4k or so as I believe that's a symptom of Vanos seal failure. They can go anywhere north of 30k miles according to internet wisdom. This is nearly 150k miles more than that, so very probably knackered and leaking. 

On a 520i or even a 320i with the M52B22, I'd probably not bother changing them. But this Z4 is a car that you're supposed to rag the shit out of. 

I haven't thought about it till now, but I should have done a proper 0-60 measurement before and after. 

[cort16]

My experience with them is vanos kicks in yo at 4k as you say. If it's not doing until 5 there's something funny going on. Have you tried cleaning the vanos solenoids?

They where easy to get out on the 320si but it had 33% less engine. 

[SiC]

12 minutes ago, cort16 said:

My experience with them is vanos kicks in yo at 4k as you say. If it's not doing until 5 there's something funny going on. Have you tried cleaning the vanos solenoids?

They where easy to get out on the 320si but it had 33% less engine. 

I keep staring at the engine bay and thinking some bits are easy to get to but other things are an arse. Everything on the intake side has masses of room - helped by being RHD. Left side is tight. Not a lot of room at the front either.

The 320i E46 it's based off is tight on the back because of the extra stuff there but the Z4 doesn't have that. However the front of the engine bay on the Z4 is very tight. So much that I think a thermostat would be a PIA. Both the E9x 320si and E6x m54 have the advantage of engine bays designed to take bigger engines - up to V8 in some cases.

The intake solenoid is okay to get to. Exhaust on the left looks to be a bugger unless the Vanos is removed.

I wonder if the M54 goes open loop around 5k and why the performance comes alive again after that for me?

[SiC]

I remember a previous owner (iirc @95 quid Peugeot ) saying that he thought it hadn't had regular oil changes for a bit and they did two oil changes to try flushing it. So I can't discount that it might be a bit sludgy or dirty in the Vanos solenoids and mechanism.

Vanos repair kits seem to vary from Chinese generic brands for £20 to X8R at £100+. Given it's only a bunch of teflon seals, I'm tempted to chuck a cheap kit at it. Providing it's not an absolute nightmare to pull the Vanos forward on the Z4, it doesn't look a bad job. 

[95 quid Peugeot]

In the short time I had it, it had an oil change, and then a oil and filter change  and then oil change in quick sucession 

[cort16]

I gave up on mine in the end I could never get it to run right despite smoke testing it, checking the pcv (which is very simple on the 320si) and changing the 02 sensors.

It always ran incredibly rich to the point it was popping on over run.  I've no idea why, I have a tool for BMW diagnostics and it only ever showed o2 sensor faults.  Thats when I decided me and BMWs needed some time apart.

[SiC]

This smoke machine is pretty decent. Ended up paying £46 after a eBay discount code. This is the cheapest so it needs an external air compressor - I just use my cheapy Lidl job as it doesn't need much flow. The unit has an internal regulator to bring it down to 0.5psi from the compressor. I've put 20ml of baby oil (what they recommend) and it hasn't even used it all yet, despite using it a fair bit. 

Finished this tonight and vacuum tested it both with the intake boot off and on with everything bolted on.

Apart from a glove leaking that I was using to bung up the throttle body, everything else seemed to be smoke tight.

Even after the oil cap off to make sure the rocker cover was full of smoke.

I ran it up. Trims were pretty high when cold.

Long term trims didn't change so I reset all the adaptations with BMW INPA. This brings it all back to zero.

Went for a spirited drive. Plenty of 1k to 6.5k rev limit action. Hard to know if there is any difference but I need to try back to back with the MAF disconnected.

I do notice that it picks up more after 4k. I have doubted myself whether before it really was 5k. Was it that when I noticed the rev change and looked down at the rev counter, it increased acceleration enough that the revs had got to 5k by the time I looked down? Dunno.

Fuel trims are all over the place though. Long term trims still not near zero which is a disappointment. Currently lower than before but not long enough of a drive to really know for sure.

Spark advance seems a little retarded if it's supposed to be at zero and this is a correction figure? Rather than just what it's doing and after calculation on what it should be based on the engine map.

One thing to note is that coolant temperature (ETC) hasn't really got above 93c.

Going on @Split_Pin experience on his same M54B22 engine as this, the thermostat should be opening nearer 97c - not 90c like this is. I don't know for sure but perhaps the engine ECU chucks more fuel in with the short term trims if it's not up to temperature? So perhaps it's the thermostat that really is at fault?

Also I'm still getting the P3240 code which is the thermostat heater open circuit fault code. Only intermittent though. 

Despite the CCV being 2004 and almost certainly original, I'm not entirely convinced it was actually broken?

Either that or this new Febi CCV is broken out of the factory. There is still quite a vacuum being generated on the oil filter cap. Problem is that I don't know what is normal on these in that regard. So quite possibly a waste of time replacing it...

While these parts are common M54 issues, this is a late build one and so the possibility they have sorted reliability issues at this age. For example the DISA Valve is a known weak point on these. Mine is date coded 2004 and likely original. It has no air leaks and the flap + vacuum system in it is in full working order, despite the engines high mileage.

Will find out in time if those trims stay lower. Which also still could be lower just from replacing that rear manifold bung...

What next? I am tempted to do a timed 0-60 run to gauge what and if there are any performance losses. Given I've been driving the more powerful 330i back-to-back, my judgement on what is slow could be overly clouded. 

Thermostat is definitely faulty. However not terribly so - i.e. like split_pins thermostat at 77c when fully up to temperature. So I'm a bit loathed to change it just yet. 

Vanos is likely faulty given the age. But I don't really want to rebuild it just because. Otherwise it could be money spent that doesn't really fix anything. Removing the Vanos should make the thermostat replacement easier though. If I do the Vanos, I'll probably put only do the cheapest kit and not bother with the more expensive anti-rattle. I don't think mine is rattling that bad and could just be normal engine rattling.

Also that coolant had dropped. No idea how long it took but possibly a leak - most probably one out of that thermostat given the crud on top. 

 

 

[Split_Pin]

I'd definitely change the thermostat. Why not try the hidden menu and see what temp that it says the car is running at? The only thing is that thermostats are quite pricey. Mine was about £80 for a mid range 'Apec' brand. It's the first type I've seen with an integrated sensor and if other cars with faulty CTS are anything to go by, it sends the fuelling all to pot.

[SiC]

21 minutes ago, Split_Pin said:

I'd definitely change the thermostat. Why not try the hidden menu and see what temp that it says the car is running at? The only thing is that thermostats are quite pricey. Mine was about £80 for a mid range 'Apec' brand. It's the first type I've seen with an integrated sensor and if other cars with faulty CTS are anything to go by, it sends the fuelling all to pot.

The ten pound scantool in the pics above is giving the engine coolant temperature. There is a hidden menu in the Z4 but it's a bit different to get to than the E6x/E9x as a previous, older generation of BMW electronics.

As a side note, I read a document earlier that said the temp gauge on the dash reads middle and normal between 75c and 135c (!).

Apec was the first thermostat brand that I changed on the E320. It only lasted about 500 miles before it failed 😐 Ended up changing it for genuine.

Noticed in your pictures that the original one off yours was branded Behr. I'll have a look around and see how much a Behr/Mahle (same company) is.  

[Split_Pin]

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/266878879154?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=SSts2y35Tm-&sssrc=4429486&ssuid=ZRO7rX7WRjq&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

Not that bad actually.

Easy job to change so if I get a year out of mine I'll be happy!

[SiC]

3 minutes ago, Split_Pin said:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/266878879154?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=SSts2y35Tm-&sssrc=4429486&ssuid=ZRO7rX7WRjq&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

Not that bad actually.

Easy job to change so if I get a year out of mine I'll be happy!

That looks to be the right code:

https://web.tecalliance.net/mahle-catalog/en/parts/cars/part/287/TM%2013%2097/detail?targetId=17830&typeNumber=17830&groups=316#@brc/brands:Car;targetType:cars/assem:BMW%20Z4%20Roadster%20(E85)%202.2%20i;targetType:cars;targetId:17830;typeNumber:17830/lnkparts:Thermostat%2FSeal;targetType:cars;assemblyGroupId:100094;targetId:17830;typeNumber:17830;brands:287;groups:316/assignedPartDetail:TM%2013%2097;targetType:cars;brandId:287;articleNo:TM%252013%252097;targetId:17830;typeNumber:17830;groups:316

Catalogue says 97c like yours, so definitely mine is a bit weak and started to fail. Just hope that increasing it to boiling point and putting the system under higher pressure won't create more leaks. 🫣

£40 off good ol' Amazon. Even if it is going to take a week to arrive as it's from the EU. Reviews are a bit mixed as some say a fake, but given it's Amazon, I'll give it a go and send it back if obviously fake.

https://amzn.eu/d/0fUjOnEP

 

[Split_Pin]

Think Ill stick with my genuine Apec* one !

Make sure your radiator cap is in good order so it holds pressure too.