invacar LightBulbFun's Invacar & general ramble thread, index on page 1, survivors lists on Pages 24/134 & AdgeCutler's Invacar Mk12 Restoration from Page 186 onwards, still harping on...

[egg]

I wonder if it's even the same vehicle, I've not been able to track that reg on the DVLA. LBF might know!

[barrett]

Blimey! I wonder if those are 'show plates' in tribute to the flamin' car? That photo is pretty well known so could have inspired the owner of the surviving car, which had no ID? Anyway, well done for remembering the reg and putting two and two together

[Zelandeth]

Not surprising carb issues are common.

 

There is no meaningful fuel filter fitted as standard (just a mesh screen in the pump), the jets in the carb are pretty small and they're cars which tend to be left with old stale fuel left sitting in them for years - the results of this combination is predictable really.

[LightBulbFun]

I almost want to say that fire started from something else, because fuel related stuff in a mk12 is all at the back AFAIK (engine and gravity feed tank) but the fire there looks to have started in the cabin or so

 

my best guess would be some dodgy wiring....

 

(but who knows maybe the fire did start in the engine and just traveled forward before going to the back )

 

as for the regenerating Mk12, I did post about that many posts ago in this thread 

 

I like to think the Scarf on the modern picture is a Dr who reference or something

 

(but yeah AFAIK, they are 2 separate cars, just wearing the same plates, but ill check with stuart, for one, the modern photo Mk12 has larger head lamps which makes it a Mk12D or Mk12E, where as if it was on a C suffix plate it would be something earlier)

 

 

Blimey! I wonder if those are 'show plates' in tribute to the flamin' car? That photo is pretty well known so could have inspired the owner of the surviving car, which had no ID? Anyway, well done for remembering the reg and putting two and two together

 

thats what im thinking yeah

 

 

 

This is good to know, I was hoping this was the case - I hope it was the same for MK12s. I'm wondering how many they registered at any one time? And whether they 'registered on demand' (i.e. as offices around the country said we need 'x' number) or whether they were registered as built regardless of need.

 

 

another thing ill have to double check with stuart there, but I think they where registered in batches so to speak

 

if you notice the VIN plates, say "Contract number had" so im guessing the DHSS would go "heres a contract to build 500 Invacars"

 

(you see that contract number had stuff on a lot of military stuff too IIRC)

 

[quicksilver]

Interesting research on the chassis numbers and it ties in with my own thoughts. It does seem that the DHSS would give the manufacturers a contract to build a certain number of vehicles, all of which would have consecutive chassis numbers and registrations (presumably as they weren't building for any other customers at the same time, apart from a handful of private buyers whose carriages were probably tacked on the end of a DHSS order). I concluded that there was a batch of 100 with TWC-K registrations (perhaps the first contract given to Invacar for Model 70s?) and I would put money on them all having consecutive chassis numbers. The 1NV thing is possibly because the letter I is not allowed in modern VINs so what was INV on the chassis plate was transcribed as 1NV. INV for Invacar makes more sense as a chassis number prefix.

 

EDIT: that raises an interesting question. How did the customisation for individual users fit with the building of large batches? Were they maybe all built without any controls and then fitted with the appropriate ones as and when they were issued to a recipient?

[egg]

One other fact we know - there are several photos 'in period' showing significant numbers of Invacars in storage - so clearly demand varied and there times when there appeared to be a 'surplus' - unless the ones in storage were in for re-commissioning or inevitable repair!

[LightBulbFun]

interesting stuff yeah (its hard to say if TWC would of been part of the first batch, TWC is roughly the 800th Invacar Model 70 built, I guess it depends how large a batch would of been thats out of over 9000 LOL the lowest known Invacar chassis number is 1NV/INV89, but sadly its thought the car is long gone

 

the next oldest Invacar Model 70 in my list is from November 1972, and is about 560 cars newer then TWC (TWC being from June 1972)

 

(apparently the DVLA checker used to spit out chassis numbers so stuart was able to get a lot of info that way, he was checking up to 200 a night at one point )

 

im not sure how the controls where done exactly, its an interesting question...

 

(from what I can tell for private users, at least going by the Mk12 brochure there would of been a dealer like tick box sheet with the options etc you want)

[LightBulbFun]

 

at 3 mins theres a Tippen Delta

[barrett]

Oh yeah, Duncan has a couple of invacars - I expressed some interest in one and our friend Stefan did this sketch of it for me

 

(http://stefanmarjoram.com/store - he's very good)

[LightBulbFun]

Oh very cool

 

are there any more pictures? interesting to see a yellow plate in the drawing, would indicate its a pretty late tippen delta

 

(the tippen deltas where an interesting 3rd horse in a 2 horse race to speak, by 1970 you pretty much just had AC and Invacar, but Tippen delta was there on the side, there where a few tippen deltas with HP and BHP plates which lead to some hilarious plates like 2000HP  )

[LightBulbFun]

found this neat little clip from the Beeb

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-england-tees-33456215/teesside-collector-aims-to-show-off-invacars

 

same Simon that currently owns?/runs the ICR I think

[Sir Snipes]

One other fact we know - there are several photos 'in period' showing significant numbers of Invacars in storage - so clearly demand varied and there times when there appeared to be a 'surplus' - unless the ones in storage were in for re-commissioning or inevitable repair!

They may have been waiting on PDI or simply put there specifically for the photo. No way of knowing without any kind of context.

[LightBulbFun]

im not 100% sure how it all worked

 

but i know there was a main invacar centre so to speak, at Heywood, and according to stuart, some cars hung around on the racks for up to 20 years!, but from what I can tell this was a sort of reserve, rather then a surplus of invacars per say

 

I imagine if a local service centre had an incident say where all the OAPs decided to play invacar banger racing in the bingo hall, that the service centre would call heywood and get a few Model 70s shipped over from the stores (but this is just speculation on my part)

 

(Q231PVL, may have been one of those cars, because its MPH736P which has been untaxed since 83, but it was only Q plated in 1997, so what did it do in the in between years?)

[cms206]

How many are on your list Dez? I assume you've gone through the usual online sources?

 

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

[LightBulbFun]

are you asking how many Model 70s are on my Survivors list?

 

I currently have 35 known surviving Model 70s documented stuart says there are 79 known surviving Model 70s so im almost half way there  (Sadly the current exact whereabouts or owners of a lot of Model 70s are unknown to me, hence why a lot have current status unknown, because all I know about them is that they do survive SOMEWHERE)

 

(im aware of a few that i dont have documented, the problem is I dont know those ones UK reg plates etc, so its hard for me to integrate them into my list properly, ie most of the Model 70s in the USA)

 

http://autoshite.com/topic/32723-wanted-an-invacar-ac-model-70-and-general-ramble-thread-with-survivors-list-on-page-26-and-vin-plate-tidbits-on-page-38/?p=1753903

 

 

(top tip for those who dont know, if you click on "page x of x" it will drop down a menu you can type a page number into and it will take you to that page )

[cms206]

I was asking as nosying on Instagram earlier reckoned at least two survive in Sweden, plus photos of others in service - JPF 413N was one of the in service pics.

 

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

[LightBulbFun]

Aye iv scoped out instagram a few times

 

im aware of the 2 in sweden (one was even advertised for sale so I sent an email to the guy, never got anything back sadly, but I did realise that he wanted €11K! for it, I thought I had read €1.1K LOL)

 

sadly I dont know the original registrations, so iv not yet been able to document them properly

 

JPF413N is a fun one, I dont know if it survives sadly, but it was papped twice in service in roughly the same location by 2 completely different people, what are the chances of that 

 

 

 

wonder if this is an actual 1980s photo or if theres is a yard full of invacars somewhere still... https://www.instagram.com/p/BRK193AlF7u/

 

[egg]

Do you fancy giving Elmsleigh Invacar a ring LBF, or I'm happy to do it if you're short on credit or whateverz - will ring on premise of 1 million to one chance they have some new old stock MK12 bits, oh and do you happen to have any other Invacars around?

[LightBulbFun]

haha

 

Yeah I do plan on giving them a poke at some point, but since I dont think its any immediate danger/for sale somewhere where someone could beat me to it so to speak

 

im going to take this one at a bit more of a leisurely pace, 

 

(especially with all the ESA government crap thats been going on recently)

 

but your welcome to poke them on my behalf if you wish/if the urge becomes too much   

 

 

 

 

 

on that note, rather conveniently my dentist called today, to say my appointment on the 20th would have to be rescheduled as my dentist would not be able to make it in, this gave me the opportunity to discuss/ask if it would still be free or not due to ESA being pulled between appointments, and they where not sure, so they just postponed it indefinitely, and I can call back when stuff is sorted on my end, which is nice, solves that issue for now.

[egg]

No, I'll leave them alone then!

 

And ok, dentist off the worry list for now then. Was it just a check up? Assume you are with an NHS dentist. Mine is private, but I've had the same one since before you were born (1990 - Gazza etc) so I'm not keen to change...

[LightBulbFun]

well the check up was done while i was on ESA, so it was free, (I think this is a NHS dentist, but im not sure, all i know* is normally dentists cost money, but if your on a benefit or your a minor its free)

 

and while we where there, they made an appointment for some work to be done on my teeth, but between that appointment being made and when it was due my ESA was axed so I dont know (and seemingly they dont know) how it would stand in terms of who the hell is paying LOL (they mentioned that the ESA people might fine me £100 if they dont like things)

 

so yeah make of that what what you will LOL

[mk2_craig]

That JPF413N. Wondering whether it's the same car in both pics? I have this idea that they worked on a similar basis to the old London Bus Overhaul Works where they swapped ID, so bring in vehicle ABC123 on the morning and a freshly rebuilt one leaves with the same ABC123 registration in the afternoon. Saved on tax disc costs apparently.

 

Maybe there was somewhere that took in a damaged Invacar and issued a replacement with the number plates etc swapped onto it? I'm only suggesting that because the second pic (presumably newer than the first) shows the car with more modern type of plate and also the badge in a different place.

 

Alternatively it just had a front end repair and the above is bollocks.

[Crispian_J_Hotson]

Aye iv scoped out instagram a few times

 

im aware of the 2 in sweden (one was even advertised for sale so I sent an email to the guy, never got anything back sadly, but I did realise that he wanted €11K! for it, I thought I had read €1.1K LOL)

 

sadly I dont know the original registrations, so iv not yet been able to document them properly

 

JPF413N is a fun one, I dont know if it survives sadly, but it was papped twice in service in roughly the same location by 2 completely different people, what are the chances of that 

 

 

 

 

 

wonder if this is an actual 1980s photo or if theres is a yard full of invacars somewhere still... https://www.instagram.com/p/BRK193AlF7u/

 

21227623_202724063598966_5912075053343703040_n.jpg

 

I found the black and white location of Clifton avenue.

 

Clifton Ave

https://goo.gl/maps/s7nmyNNW57R2

 

9 course block walls, copings, kerb, house with strange arch detail, national grid in the background. Theres another picture with that yard to the right looking down Clifton, a VW breakers was next door. Funnily enough, the unit that is now built in that yard has a strange shaped vehicle covered in a tarp against the wall. It's hashtagged meadow Lane but it's just off it.

[Zelandeth]

Dez, if there's dental work needed don't hold off getting it done. It's one of those things which the longer you wait the worse it will get - and the more expensive getting it sorted will be. There are few things worse than serious toothache either - especially given you've already indicated that most painkillers don't seem to help you. Picture if you will, a white hot poker being drilled into your jaw, which you cannot escape or help no matter what you do. It is the most unpleasant sensation I have ever encountered in my life and isn't something I would wish on my worst enemy.

 

If you're registered with an NHS dentist checkups should be free, but any work done will likely require payment to some degree.

 

If they've told you there is work needed, get it sorted.

[LightBulbFun]

That JPF413N. Wondering whether it's the same car in both pics? I have this idea that they worked on a similar basis to the old London Bus Overhaul Works where they swapped ID, so bring in vehicle ABC123 on the morning and a freshly rebuilt one leaves with the same ABC123 registration in the afternoon. Saved on tax disc costs apparently.

 

Maybe there was somewhere that took in a damaged Invacar and issued a replacement with the number plates etc swapped onto it? I'm only suggesting that because the second pic (presumably newer than the first) shows the car with more modern type of plate and also the badge in a different place.

 

Alternatively it just had a front end repair and the above is bollocks.

 

 

funny you should mentioned that, because stuart said some service centres worked like that, although apparently the AC badges did have a bad habit of falling off

 

 

 

Dez, if there's dental work needed don't hold off getting it done. It's one of those things which the longer you wait the worse it will get - and the more expensive getting it sorted will be. There are few things worse than serious toothache either - especially given you've already indicated that most painkillers don't seem to help you. Picture if you will, a white hot poker being drilled into your jaw, which you cannot escape or help no matter what you do. It is the most unpleasant sensation I have ever encountered in my life and isn't something I would wish on my worst enemy.

 

If you're registered with an NHS dentist checkups should be free, but any work done will likely require payment to some degree.

 

If they've told you there is work needed, get it sorted.

 

luckily nothings in pain, they "just" want to do some filling/crown work IIRC?

 

they prescribed some special extra fluoride tooth paste, and I got a funky sonic tooth brush thats been much easier on my back to use

 

(up until recently, iv been quite bad, when it came to brushing my teeth because of the literal Pain in the back that it was with a normal tooth brush, so some of my teeth, especially a molar or 2 are sort of half not there anymore, oops...)

[mk2_craig]

That might be one reason why Q plated examples have turned up.

[LightBulbFun]

That might be one reason why Q plated examples have turned up.

 

 

i dont think so, the Q plate examples have been done up clearly after DHSS Service, and both examples I know of use clearly not Model 70 Chassis numbers, so some deliberate ringing had been done

[LightBulbFun]

 

I found the black and white location of Clifton avenue.

 

Clifton Ave

https://goo.gl/maps/s7nmyNNW57R2

 

9 course block walls, copings, kerb, house with strange arch detail, national grid in the background. Theres another picture with that yard to the right looking down Clifton, a VW breakers was next door. Funnily enough, the unit that is now built in that yard has a strange shaped vehicle covered in a tarp against the wall. It's hashtagged meadow Lane but it's just off it.

 

Oooh nice work

 

ill stick on the list of things to dig into some more later on

[Crispian_J_Hotson]

Well, in a closed yard opposite that site is 3 massive shipping containers... Wouldn't it be good if....

[Zelandeth]

 

funny you should mentioned that, because stuart said some service centres worked like that, although apparently the AC badges did have a bad habit of falling off

 

Screenshot 2019-03-14 at 21.42.02.png

 

 

 

luckily nothings in pain, they "just" want to do some filling/crown work IIRC?

 

they prescribed some special extra fluoride tooth paste, and I got a funky sonic tooth brush thats been much easier on my back to use

 

(up until recently, iv been quite bad, when it came to brushing my teeth because of the literal Pain in the back that it was with a normal tooth brush, so some of my teeth, especially a molar or 2 are sort of half not there anymore, oops...)

Yeah...that doesn't sound good. You'll be wanting to get that sorted out sooner than later. Getting fillings or crowns done is a hell of a lot better than the alternatives if things degrade further and you wind up needing root canal work done.

 

If you're able to discuss things with the dentist directly it's worth seeing what their long term thoughts on your wisdom teeth are. Many dentists will just remove them rather than work on them because it's often really awkward. If your teeth are generally in poor condition they may just want to remove them - while it sounds extreme, I've had one tooth out and while it wasn't *pleasant* and I did look like I'd headbutted a bus for a few days afterwards, it wasn't actually painful. Certainly less painful than most fillings I've had. If you're on a budget and don't know if you're going to have regular access to a dentist, it may well be worth seeing if they want to do that work preventatively. Certainly a heck of a lot better option than dealing with an abscess.

 

Don't mean to sound alarming - but I have terrible teeth (thanks Mum...) so have spent far more time in that seat than I'd like!