Xantia of Desires - Farewell xantia!

[beko1987]

No feeler guages...it did run when it all went wrong...

[Richard]

Are you absolutely sure you have the right hole in the flywheel?

 

Is the camshaft actually in one piece? I've a feeling these snap the cam instead of bending the valves when they clash.

[Eddie Honda]

They do snap like a carrot on collision.

 

Re right hole. 7.5mm drill bit in STRAIGHT. See that link earlier for correct hole in flywheel (not block). There's another hole, but it's not the same depth or feel.

 

Take off belt and from suspected crank hole, turn crank 90 deg. Pistons should be half way down bores. Check that the cam moves cleaning 360.

 

And have a pic of one that untimed itself to cheer yourself up:

 

2012-09-12_19.25.47.jpg by E Honda, on Flickr

[beko1987]

The camshaft doesn't look broken

 

 

But only rotates 180 degrees before stopping. How do I get the flywheel 180 to find another hole? None of the round things under the cams seem to move though, apart from one the other end

 

Sorry for the question, but I'm dumbing myself down a bit now as I'm a bit out of my depth... Gonna pop the cam cover back on before anything drops in

[Eddie Honda]

Take belt off. Move crank until it stops, move it back a bit. Rotate cam a bit. Move crank until it stops, move it back a bit rotate cam a bit more. Rinse, Repeat.

[Eddie Honda]

Or just slacken the 3 cam caps while you have it open and it won't be resting on the buckets.

[beko1987]

Aha! With the belt off, the camshaft rotates properly, and all the bits that move do...

[beko1987]

So it's something else causing the jam. Gonna rotate the cam a bit and see if I can see anything, or is this a bad idea to do that on its own?

[Rusty_Rocket]

In a good engine, you should be able to rotate the cam 360degs with the pistons all halfway down their bores.  However, you won't know where this position is easily, so turn the cam very slowly until you meet resistance, then nudge the crank a few degrees and go again.  When you have the crank in the right place (90degs off TDC?) then you can spin the cam without worry of doing any damage and inspect everything.

[beko1987]

Nope, turning this bit results in a dead stop every 180

 

 

But with the flywheel locked

 

 

I get tdc

 

 

I r confused, I must be missing something

[beko1987]

Sorry rusty, I posted my pics before seeing your post, will have a read and try to understand

[beko1987]

S

In a good engine, you should be able to rotate the cam 360degs with the pistons all halfway down their bores.  However, you won't know where this position is easily, so turn the cam very slowly until you meet resistance, then nudge the crank a few degrees and go again.  When you have the crank in the right place (90degs off TDC?) then you can spin the cam without worry of doing any damage and inspect everything.

I've unlocked the flywheel, and turned the crank to 90 degrees from tdc. The camshaft rotates then. But the crank is then 90 degrees out, which can't be right?

[beko1987]

And back to TDC, I get 180 movement and it locks. There's only 1 timing hole I can find in the flywheel too.

 

Ive fucked it, haven't I. I'll be staying at my mums this week then to get to work...

[Rusty_Rocket]

All I can think is one valve is jamming in it's guide and when you go to TDC on the crank, there's contact.  So with everything timed up, it still goes so far and then locks?  There's definitely nothing jamming the injection pump sprocket/ debris from the aux belt somewhere?

[beko1987]

Nope, the injection sprocket spins fine, got it locked off at the moment. I presume finding a stuck valve is quite tricky?

[Rusty_Rocket]

You 'should' see some evidence of valve problems with the cam cover off.. 

[Eddie Honda]

That hole in the block is the correct one, although to me light/angle the drill bit looks too small and on the piss.

[beko1987]

I did try an 8mm rod and couldn't find any hole. Should I try again?

[beko1987]

No, deffo no 8mm hole near tdc. 6.5mm, no prob. I just don't know what to try now, don't know how to take it apart any more

[Captain Furious]

What he means is that you turn the crank to 90 degrees off tdc so that all the pistons are halfway down the bores and you can turn the cam without any danger of valves hitting pistons. This is obviously just for investigative purposes and not for final timing

 

It does seem that somehow your timing is out, and out by a lot. But providing you haven't forced it over or cranked it on the starter then you shouldn't have fucked it

 

Turn the crank to 90 degrees off again so you can rotate the cam, turn the cam to TDC, then the flywheel, time the pump and put the belt on. Are there any other timing marks you can use to verify both the cam and crank are at TDC? If needs be ignore the locking pins and verify by removing the injector from number 1 cylinder, drop a screwdriver in and turn the crank slowly, you're at TDC when the piston reaches the very top of its travel.

[beko1987]

But I need to get to work tomorrow!

 

But wait... I've lobbed the belt back on, and the fucker turns on the crank! Wtf?

[Rusty_Rocket]

I have the Xantia book of lies here Bek, it says-

 

"With the timing holes aligned, no.4 cylinder is at TDC on its compression stroke".  (so with the fly. pinned, you should have both valves shut on no.4)

"one hole in the camshaft sprocket, two holes in the injection pump sprocket, should align with corresponding holes in the engine front plate".

 

"Insert an 8mm diameter rod or drill through the hole in the lh flange in the cylinder block by the starter motor"

 

Weirdly the French time their engines by using no.4 cylinder as reference, but this won't make any difference to the procedure.

[beko1987]

Number 4, with all everything lined up, 4th from the sprocket?

 

 

 

And wor will's just called me, and talked me through everything, which helped alot, and in my head, I just need to reassemble everything...

 

Having cheese on toast, and we shall see!

[Rusty_Rocket]

I believe the French number their cylinders from the flywheel end of the engine. So no.4 cylinder is actually the two valves closest to the belt!

Both of these should be fully shut when you're timed up- that is, both cam lobes pointing skywards.

[Eddie Honda]

Cross post: No, the French time their engine using no. 1 cylinder as numbered from flywheel innit.

[beko1987]

Right, latest problem, the new aux belt won't go on. It's so damn close, but won't go. Thoughts?

[Dick Cheeseburger]

Sorry I can't help with technical infoz, but I wish you all the best for it working again. Fingers crossed for you.

[beko1987]

Thought: You said you thought it was too small when you picked it up.

I did, but reading all the numbers on both they are identical, just the new one isn't worn!

 

Ive moved the air con pump a bit but it's no use. Dropped my bloody screwdriver convertor socket down the back of the lhm pump too...

[Eddie Honda]

What length is printed on the belt? (not packaging).

 

Beside, make sure the tensioner (s?) are fully off.

[ruffgeezer]

Get it on and around all pulleys and tensioners then hold it against the crankshaft sprocket and wind it on by turning the crank with a spanner.