Motorcycling - Current Chinese Shite v. Older Japanese Shite

[Jerzy Woking]

Foale designed the chassis, cant think who designed the bodywork, but think that wasupdayed a few times.

Nothing ever looked as good as Suzukis Katana though. Really wish I bought one when I had the money, but i also had a bike hating wife!

[strangeangel]

26 minutes ago, Jerzy Woking said:

I wonder how much these are worth now (and the Quasars)? I cant recall how much it was up for sale for at the shop my brother worked at, but it was for a lot more than I could afford, so it was academic at the time. 

Also I would like to know how many of either still remain. Probably all in museums now.

 

 

There's a really good website for the Quasar, apparently some have escaped museum life and are still in use. Here's a shot of some on a run in 2010:

 

 

The webmaster reckons should one come up for sale it'd make about £15000, but I imagine it's hard to put a price on them - granted they're rare, but hardly everyone's cup of tea.

 

Happily, most seem to still be around, this page tells you what they know about the whereabouts of the survivors.

 

[wuvvum]

Are the bars on that Quantum supposed to be like that or do they fold out? 

[Jerzy Woking]

No Wuvvum, they didn't fold out-thats how they were. You pushed/pulled on them, so it was simply counter steering around bends. For the life of me I cannot recall the throttle setup. I presume I twisted it like a candle stick. I honestly don't know.

Always wondered what a Quasar would be like with a different (better?) than the Reliant engine in the one I rode.  As I said, many maxims scooters have a very similar riding position, so think anyone that rides one will gel with a Quasar quite quickly.

[MarvinsMom]

i've been looking at cheap-ish bikes

thing been that i don't want some chinese thing, preferring instead something maybe more left field. japanese and old-ish.

i have seen this listed, and it kinda tickles my fancy.

failling that, i'd love one of these.

YES! a ~Harley Davidson monkey bike, i want one so, so bad!

technically its an Aermacchi built in italy, but Harley Davidson owned them between i think 1961 and 1978. and these were made between 1972 and 75, i think.

and Harley themselves were owned by the american machine & foundry company (hence AMF Harley Davidson on the tank) at the time, who make bowling balls....

for the most part the AMF Harley Davidson period seems to be something many fans of Milwaukee's finest don't like to talk about. 

 

 

[Cavcraft]

Big huge massive YES to the KH, looks like the B1 model. My first proper bike, absolutely loved it.

Where did you spot it for sale, please?

[Jerzy Woking]

Having ridden a two stroke AMF Harley Davidson 250cc when it was new, I can say I preferred my mates CZ 250 twin. It was horrible, and I really cannot understand why people restore these. Much less those that buy the restored ones. Utter, utter garbage.

[MarvinsMom]

2 minutes ago, Jerzy Woking said:

Having ridden a two stroke AMF Harley Davidson 250cc when it was new, I can say I preferred my mates CZ 250 twin. It was horrible, and I really cannot understand why people restore these. Much less those that buy the restored ones. Utter, utter garbage.

well its the name isn't it? Harley Davidson...... this kinda matches what people said at the time, why buy a Harley X90 when you could go and get a Honda monkeybike, which was a better bike!

[MarvinsMom]

5 minutes ago, Cavcraft said:

Big huge massive YES to the KH, looks like the B1 model. My first proper bike, absolutely loved it.

Where did you spot it for sale, please?

https://www.gumtree.com/p/kawasaki-motorbikes/kawasaki-kh-125/1356149081

scumtree - link added above.

i've sent the seller a text with a view to going and having a look tomorrow, but not heard anything back yet. 

it is afterall a Saturday, so may well be out on the town, or what ever the youth do nowadays....

[Jerzy Woking]

Looks really nice, and much as I view old Japanese bikes as overpriced, that looks to be a reasonable sum in these days of five grand Fizzies.

GIB.

[MarvinsMom]

if the kwak is too green for you, then maybe a suzi in red is better bet.....

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Suzuki-B120-Excellent-Condition-Fully-Restored-MOT-and-Tax-Exempt/283676717870?hash=item420c73332e:g:sB4AAOSwhBNdzsAq

[Cavcraft]

The Kawasaki is exactly 3,000,000,052 times the better bike.   

[Jerzy Woking]

That Suzuki is barely worth half of that. I doubt many 17 year olds aspired to getting one of those, whereas the Kawasaki is, and was, to some, desirable then and no doubt now.

[wuvvum]

I've always half fancied a crack at a B120, purely because they're a bit of an oddity, but I wouldn't want to pay too much over 500 quid for the privilege.

[Cavcraft]

Nostalgia is a funny old thing.  Back in the day, stuff like the B120 along with things like a CJ360, CB250G,  KC100, YB100, A100 and many more were mostly avoided and/or derided. Now they're (fairly) 'big ticket' things, presumably because old=valuable, instead of old=crap like they were in 1982.

[warch]

I love how any Kawasaki, regardless of cubic capacity becomes automatically badass when painted the proprietary 'mean green'. 

The little wascal has thpiwit!

[strangeangel]

6 hours ago, Cavcraft said:

Nostalgia is a funny old thing.  Back in the day, stuff like the B120 along with things like a CJ360, CB250G,  KC100, YB100, A100 and many more were mostly avoided and/or derided. Now they're (fairly) 'big ticket' things, presumably because old=valuable, instead of old=crap like they were in 1982.

 

My first bike was an A100, and it was pretty dismal if I'm honest. I had two of them in fact, and neither cost more than £100 which seems about right. The B120 was around too, and that was a bit better of a commuter plodder than mine, but I can't say I harbour any nostalgic desire to own another one, certainly not at today's prices!

 

As you say, nowadays pretty much any bike that lives to get old these days immediately assumes classic status! Although values of different 'classics' seem to vary over time, e.g. old British rubbish seemed to reach a peak in the 90s and now it's small Japanese bikes that are achieving ludicrous (IMO) prices.

 

[wuvvum]

I'm waiting with bated breath for the day when a scruffy Honda Spacy is worth £10K...

[UltraWomble]

Tomos mopeds are a case in point. 

Could be bought new for £299 (or £1.33\week from the Littlewoods catalogue) and now go for silly money. 

I mean they were the Chinese cheesium moped of their day except made in Yugo land. 

Mental. 

Anyway if I can sort out shiply I shall be taking delivery of a KYMCO

[Jerzy Woking]

3 hours ago, wuvvum said:

I'm waiting with bated breath for the day when a scruffy Honda Spacy is worth £10K...

I'm sure there is a trade seller on ebay that will be able to tell you when it's going to be worth that, even in a "Condition: 4 out of 10" state.

They do amuse me though with their descriptions and valuations "in 10 years time" bollocks, so I shouldn't knock them

[xtriple]

Back in the days of the 'Rider policy' a mate and I shared a B120P as our joint winter beater/go to work on bike. It cost a solid £100. Marco worked nights and I worked days so we effectively 'hot bedded' the B120P (Bloop) as he got home from work on it and I then rode to work on it, helped that we lived next door to each other.

It was a cheap bike and not a Kawasali Z1R (mine) or a Z650 (Marco's) both of which were wintering in my fron room wrapped up warm, and so a tad unloved but it was a decent enough bike. I seem to remember it had neutral at the top of the 'box like a Fizzy and drum brakes. It was even quite nippy and reliable. It was certainly adaquate transport and even fun, just lacking in street cred.

[Jerzy Woking]

That reminded me that there were a number of 100cc bikes back then in the 70's/80's. Bikes like the Yamaha YB100 and DT100, Suzuki did the GP100 and TS100, Honda had the H100 and CB100, and Kawasaki the KE100 and KH100. There were many more models I'm sure.

Don't know why 100cc was so popular.

[strangeangel]

5 hours ago, wuvvum said:

I'm waiting with bated breath for the day when a scruffy Honda Spacy is worth £10K...

 

I don't think any plastic scooters will reach those dizzy heights, even the 125 Spacy which is undeniably the coolest, but those (and the Helix) are steadily creeping up in price as they become ever more scarce, They will have their day.

 

I didn't realise you still had the Spacy. I ended up having four and sold them all. Great fun.

 

[strangeangel]

41 minutes ago, Jerzy Woking said:

That reminded me that there were a number of 100cc bikes back then in the 70's/80's. Bikes like the Yamaha YB100 and DT100, Suzuki did the GP100 and TS100, Honda had the H100 and CB100, and Kawasaki the KE100 and KH100. There were many more models I'm sure.

Don't know why 100cc was so popular.

 

Good question, I don't know either. Was the insurance cheaper sub-100cc?

 

[strangeangel]

1 hour ago, xtriple said:

Back in the days of the 'Rider policy' a mate and I shared a B120P as our joint winter beater/go to work on bike. It cost a solid £100. Marco worked nights and I worked days so we effectively 'hot bedded' the B120P (Bloop) as he got home from work on it and I then rode to work on it, helped that we lived next door to each other.

It was a cheap bike and not a Kawasali Z1R (mine) or a Z650 (Marco's) both of which were wintering in my fron room wrapped up warm, and so a tad unloved but it was a decent enough bike. I seem to remember it had neutral at the top of the 'box like a Fizzy and drum brakes. It was even quite nippy and reliable. It was certainly adaquate transport and even fun, just lacking in street cred.

 

Sounds about right, this is what the UMG said about them:

Quote

SUZUKI A100/B120
A100: 1968-80, 99cc t/s single,
9hp, 60mph, 90mpg, 190lb
B120 1971-77, 118cc t/s single,
10hp, 65mph, 100mpg, 210lb
Useful, reliable commuters, loose handling, drum brakes fade. Engines run to 30-40k when small-end and bore become troublesome, but with a rebuilt top end can break through 50k mark. A dead condensor can make starting difficult. Also check for chassis rot at this age. B120 had easier life as commuter, many A100's ruined by learners.

 

[Cavcraft]

4 hours ago, strangeangel said:

 

Good question, I don't know either. Was the insurance cheaper sub-100cc?

 

Not sure, as seem to recall it went 49cc to 75cc, then 80cc to 150cc, or something like that. The GT380 was a bit of a pain as it was (obvs) out of the -350cc bracket, so took a twatting in the insurance stakes, for no real gain. Someone somewhere will have a list of the old 'groups' hopefully.

 

As David mentions, the rider policies were great, it was basically trade insurance and a licence to ride pretty  much anything iirc. You could swap bikes with mates to ride on for a while, or borrow someone's to go to town on or whatever.

[garellikatia]

I think the thing to bear in mind sometimes is that many of these bikes/mopeds as someone alluded to before are just assumed to be so called 'classics' just for their age. When really they hit their ceiling price around £500-£1000 because comparitivley they were never that sought after anyway. I recently realised this when I sold a Garelli Katia I part restored. I ended up spending a fair bit more on it than I ended up getting back. It simply wasn't worth it. I've learn my lesson this time around and bought a Honda Camino for £100. I've bodged and fixed it up with stiff lying around the garage and clone Chinese knock of parts. Unless your in it for the fun of owning and riding mopeds and bikes I don't think there's a rea lot of money to be made. Unless it's something of a cult following or rare. Must admit the Honda being 'japanese' probably made in Europe, seems a bit more thought out! With reeds valves etc.. for efficiency. Can't really comment on Chinese bikes but the Chinese made clone parts seem well manufactured it's hard to believe they can sell things so cheap and make a profit!!!  I will throw up some motorcycle shiting pictures

[UltraWomble]

RXS100's seem to be getting serious money now.

I mean, mine was fun, but not that brilliant.

[Cavcraft]

24 minutes ago, UltraWomble said:

RXS100's seem to be getting serious money now.

I mean, mine was fun, but not that brilliant.

Sure a mate of a mate had an RS100 with the 'energy induction' from the RSX bolted on to it. Supposed to make a big difference, can't say it was that noticeable, iirc. In that era I don't think there wasn't really much at all between the KH/GP/RS/H100, probably ended up being whatever was cheaper second hand, or brand loyalty. Wasn't impressed with the H100, a bit dull really, the RSX wasn't too bad, the KH a little dull and the GP probs the best of the bunch, but it's all subjective.

 

To be honest, I think every second hand Yamaha I had around that time (1980-1990-ish) was fucking rubbish, unreliable and very over-rated and Hondas were pretty boring.

[wuvvum]

An RS100 was the first >50cc bike I ever bought.  It was reasonably nippy, but I found the gearing frustrating - massive gap between 1st to 3rd and then 3-4-5 very close together.  Also it had the usual early '80s Yamaha build quality issues.  I traded it in for a CB125T after about 3 months.