MoT - Fact and fiction

[oldford]

Cheers for the advice dudes. Seems my 'small hole' is bigger than I thought. Just got back from the garage with

 

(centre) Exhaust has a major leak of exhaust gases [7.1.2a]

 

Exhaust emissions Lambda reading after2nd fast idle outside specified limits [7.3.D.2b]

 

Ho hum.

 

A hole in the exhaust will affect the Lambda reading, so if you sort the exhaust, the Lambda should be back within limits.

 

The MOT is subtle in the wording on the failures. A light can be failed for a number of reasons, one of these is for it being inoperative. There is no fail for it having a blown bulb as it is the testers job to check and report on the car, not to diagnose the cause of the failure.

 

With odometers reading in Km it would be good to let the tester know as the odometer units are shown on the certificate.

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

"beam converters" are acceptable for MoT. So is a KPH speedo (because it isn't checked) but when you go to register it the DVLA will want both RHD headlights and a MPH speedometer.

 

Really? I had a rhd Japanese import thing in 2009 with the KPH speedo still. As for the headlights, just pull the beam benders off for the inspection and stick the buggers back on round the corner. I doubt a pair of RHD Avantime headlights are going to be cheap.

[dollywobbler]

I've owned two LHD vehicles, both with KMH speedos - though the last one did at least have a few stickers to show some MPH speeds. Are they just not actually that fussed or does it depend when it was imported?

[scaryoldcortina]

TBA, I don't know! The question has passed out of MoT knowledge and into DVLA/SVA/Registering an import stuff, of which I know little. Other than MoT testing fesh imports for the local jap 4x4 place my only experience of this is I once brought a moto guzzi in from Italy, and the doovla made me change the headlight and stick "mph" decals on the speedo before they would register it.

[warren t claim]

Bump for a real question!!!

 

Do VOSA ever investigate as to why almost every car submitted for an MOT at Kwik Fit seems to only fail on products they sell?

 

They must see a pattern where 3 year old cars seem to need new shocks and brake discs?

[scaryoldcortina]

That is a bloody good question!

 

What I can tell you is this - each tester's perfomance is monitored against national averages for each failure catagory, if you get far enough out it will flag an anomoly and a possible visit from vosa BUT most MoT fails are for Brakes, Tyres and Bulbs.....

 

What I want to know is why kwik-fit monkeys see fit to tell people that "this car shouldn't have passed a MoT" and send them back to us moaning. Every time, a print of the advisory sheet that they mysteriously didnt get when they bought the car sends them away again.

[warren t claim]

That is a bloody good question

 

What I want to know is why kwik-fit monkeys see fit to tell people that "this car shouldn't have passed a MoT" and send them back to us moaning. Every time, a print of the advisory sheet that they mysteriously didnt get when they bought the car sends them away again.

 

Have you ever given a car a clean bill of health only to have the owner come back to you a week later complaining after they were told by Kwik Fit that it needed £600 worth of work because the car is in a dangerous condition? (5 mins after they went in for a puncture repair).

[scaryoldcortina]

Yes.

[CIH]

I'm not about to defend tyre monkeys but it's important to be clear how a garage can advise on parts after a car has passed a test. Tyres on 2mm of tread will pass the test but imagine there's 4ft of snow outside and the punter has a trip to germany planned at the end of the week......

[warren t claim]

As a tester isn't there anything you can do to report these crooks or is it not considered cricket to "grass on your own?"

 

The Office of Fair Trading should grow a pair and do some proper investigating.

[scaryoldcortina]

Problem is, what we get is a customer who has been told to come and complain. As far as a presecution for anything goes that is automatically hearsay, all the kwikfit has to do is say they know nothing.

 

Maybe trading standads should buy a car or two, get it checked themselves (maybe by VOSA) and then take it to kwikfit.

[Guest]

I'm surprised that given all the Internet complaints about Kwik-Fit that it never seems to have transpired into a slot on Watchdog. They're still considered really reputable by the public-at-large, which is a bit unfair.

[scaryoldcortina]

This would be the same public-at-large that puts Calgon in every wash (in a soft water area) and buys a new PC because the man at PC world said their old one (which needed a software reinstall) was too old then?

[warren t claim]

Isn't Kwik Fit now owned by Ford?

[scaryoldcortina]

I dunno.. I do know that halfords just bought out National Autocentres though.

[Guest]

This would be the same public-at-large that puts Calgon in every wash (in a soft water area) and buys a new PC because the man at PC world said their old one (which needed a software reinstall) was too old then?

I'm not really bothered about the benefits to the general public (who can all go and drown themselves), I just don't like the idea of some "proper" garage not getting the work.

[scaryoldcortina]

and there's the rub... "proper" garages are invariably small, family run back-street affairs, and are portrayed by TV and advertizing as dodgy geezers who want to rip you off.

[Albert Ross]

Whereas I work at a main dealer! We charge over £70 an hour.... PLUS VAT! Then again, most of the monkeys in the workshop know their onions, with a couple of exceptions, and they get to look at used and new cars, not customer vehicles. I am in a separate workshop, where the testing ramp is. I am on-site QC over 5 other testers. I am there to make certain testing STANDARDS are upheld. I only look at the way they test the vehicle, not at the decisions they make, but I am often asked to stick my nose in and help them make the right decision. After all, it's their name on the line if the wrong decision is made.

Onlt today I was asked to lok at a couple of leaks on brake calipers. One was an obvious loose hose joint, the other was all over damp with brake fluid, with no visible leak. One failed, the other passed with advice. Tough call for a newer tester. We don't have score sheets or sales bonusses, we work on a time-saved system, where (for instance) if we finish a 6 hour job in 5 hours, we get paid the 6 hours, but then have an extra hour to earn another hour's pay! (But it rarely happens)

 

Today I carried out the first test, it was also due it's 3rd sevice, and was almost up on warranty. It failed on 1 tyre, and advised another, with low front pads. Tracking was well out, 15 degrees or so, scrubbing both front tyres. Seems the owner has had it tracked locally, so she's off back there. She took it back, and they said it was right.... We got the sale on the tyres and pads, and I identified a couple of minor warranty issues, both sorted FOC for her. She's happy, she'll be back.

[oldford]

I have foud that people hold the opinions/diagnoses of the major companies such as Kwik Fit or the AA as gospel. We had a new car towed into us by the AA, it was a few days old and the customer was furious as the AA had told him that the back axle was about to fall off. A five minute inspection revealed that the back axle was still attached but the offside rear tyre was flat.

 

The tyre had a 10mm diameter, 30cm long steel rod through the tread, every time the wheel went round it made a horrible noise against the wheel. Then we had to explain to the customer why it wasn't covered under warranty.

 

I find it amazing that everyone who works at Kwik Fit is able to judge what's a MOT failure and what isn't.

[chaseracer]

and there's the rub... "proper" garages are invariably small, family run back-street affairs, and are portrayed by TV and advertizing as dodgy geezers who want to rip you off.

The Blingo's in for some work tomorrow, and it's definitely going to a "proper" garage - a one-man outfit in a small industrial unit that I've been using since 1992

[Mike D]

The thing is, it shouldn't fall on the tester to tell you your tyres are bald and your lights dont work! People just seem invariably incompetent and plain fucking stupid

[messerschmitt owner]

how do I tell the Euro compliance of my 2004 Sprinter? Is it a Euro III or Euro IV engine?

[pogweasel]

Is the euro III / IV class not written or printed on the tax disc?

[CreepingJesus]

The thing is, it shouldn't fall on the tester to tell you your tyres are bald and your lights dont work! People just seem invariably incompetent and plain fucking stupid

+1...that's how it happens. Most people 'trust the expert'. And not just with cars etc., most of life works that way too.

On the upside, I've two KwackFits near me - one used to be a Budget, at which I'd a horrendous experience - and both of them take no for answer from me. So it suits me fine to get tyres (and exhausts when the weather's too dire) done there. No hassle.

The small independant near me, who've got a bob or two from me over the years, blotted their reputation recently. I was told when the driveshaft on the Meg was replaced, and she was MOT'd, that the front pads and discs were nearly done. 8 months, and 8k later, I whip the wheels off, to check for bent suspension to find...lots of meat left on the discs and pads. Sadly, it evidently works both ways.

Anyhoo...on topic. How crusty do the arches have to be before it becomes an MOT issue? Meg hasn't coped too well with the winter, and now there's some fairly big flakes coming off the underside of the rear arch edges. Nothing structural, as far as I can see; I'm just worried about the definition of 'protruding', I spose.

[scooters]

Kwikfit.....never touch em....

 

12 months ago my XM developed a brake issue after a high speed emergency stop. I took it into Kwikfit as i needed the work done urgently - they charged me 300 quid for new discs and pads and fitting.....

 

and then....

 

the wee laddie who I speak to when I collect the car says to me:

 

"I think your shock absorbers might be on the way out"....I replied:

 

"really, that is worrying, please can you show me on the car"

 

the numpty takes me to the car which is on a ramp in the air and starts vaguely pointing at the suspension components

 

I say:

 

"Can you get your manager?"

 

Chap comes over

 

me: "can YOU show me where the shock absorbers are on this car as your colleague seems to think I need new ones....."

 

"Manager: "err...."

 

me:

 

"the reason why your boss can't answer the question laddie is that the XM DOESNT HAVE SHOCK ABSORBERS"

 

"interestingly enough" I go on " Kwik Fit in Edinburgh recently got their wrists slapped for advising customers that they needed components replaced that were perfectly sound...."you wouldn't be trying that on with me would you?"

 

"oh no sir....innocent mistake"

 

AYE RIGHT!

[scooters]

My Volvo has a small hole in the exhaust. It's been like that for a while now and isn't getting bigger; it doesn't sound loud even when you rev it. Will it fail?

 

 

best way to sort this:

 

you need:

 

1 tin of beans

2 large jubilee clips (stainless steel)

1 tube gun gum

 

Step 1

Eat the beans

 

step 2

cut the bottom off the can, cleanse it then mae a vertical slit down one side so you now have a curled up rectangle of tin

 

step 2

cover the area around the hole in gun gum

 

step 3 apply the bean can as a cuff over the section with the hole in it

 

step 4

secure tightly with jubilee clips

 

step 5

seal ends with gun gum

 

IF the hole is upstream of the cat (if your car has one) don't use the gun gum - just cuff the hole with the can and the clips

 

this repair will usually be good for the life of the exhaust

[dollywobbler]

Warning though, eating the beans may cause a problem with emissions...

[scaryoldcortina]

How crusty do the arches have to be before it becomes an MOT issue? Meg hasn't coped too well with the winter, and now there's some fairly big flakes coming off the underside of the rear arch edges. Nothing structural, as far as I can see; I'm just worried about the definition of 'protruding', I spose

 

The question to ask yourself when judging sharp/protruding is this.. Could someone walking past this car injure themselves on the damage?

 

If I was presented with a car where the rear arch lip was starting to degrade but the outside wasn't sharp, I would most likely advise on the corrosion rather than fail it. This is assuming that the inner arch isn't holed and doesn't fall into a prescribed area (like within 30cm of a top shock mount, for example)...

 

Thing is though, it's down to the tester doing the test to decide.

[messerschmitt owner]

Is the euro III / IV class not written or printed on the tax disc?

private HGV, so no

[messerschmitt owner]

nah Blitzie boy!

 

the problem is protruding sharp edges - ie rusty metal that may cut or tear - all that you describe are OK - but perhaps not on a Ford Mondeo!