Bear's bangers: IT'S ALIVE! The RX-7 stops wetting the bed...

[robt100]

Nice progress....

Don't fancy doing the XJR do you? Pedalsounds very similar, it'll stop but you're almost on the bulkhead. System had ran dry when a pipe broke so reckon it needs the ABS pumping, got SDD but can't find the option (and dont fancy trying to get the jag up in the air with all 4 wheels off on gravel!).

At this rate you should have all of yours and everyone else's cars fixed by next week😄

[Bear]

If it's similar (not Wabco ABS is it?) then swapping the master cylinder is not ardous.

Bleeding the brakes might be, the Disco keeps its wheels on!

[Bear]

But if you have a pressure bleeder you should be able to get the pedal firm and functional without running the ABS - it will just end up releasing some air when activated and need another couple of bleeds. Whereas without the pressure bleeder you're just compressing and releasing the air in the unit.

[robt100]

37 minutes ago, Bear said:

But if you have a pressure bleeder you should be able to get the pedal firm and functional without running the ABS - it will just end up releasing some air when activated and need another couple of bleeds. Whereas without the pressure bleeder you're just compressing and releasing the air in the unit.

I have nowt. Was pressure bled by the local mobile mechanic but he spent a good 30mins or more trying to get a decent pedal, this was the best he could get. Not sure what system it has, probably similar. Pedal was fine before the pipe went FUBAR though.

[Bear]

1 hour ago, robt100 said:

I have nowt. Was pressure bled by the local mobile mechanic but he spent a good 30mins or more trying to get a decent pedal, this was the best he could get. Not sure what system it has, probably similar. Pedal was fine before the pipe went FUBAR though.

From the Disco, I'd say the pedal could be fine until you want to bleed the system and then that moment when it goes right to the floorboards, that's a moment when the master cylinder gets stuck.

How's the pedal's return? Clunky and sticks/hesitates?

The crucial bit is that the way the second chamber works (on the Disco - but I expect most dual-circuit hydraulics work in a similar manner) is the valve to let fluid in behind the piston closes under fluid pressure and reopens when the pressure is released - the pressure creates the solid piston. I think if the pedal is pushed too far with an empty, older MC the valve can stick in the closed position, and never draw fluid in or - and this was the clincher - let fluid past even when the pedal is released and you're using a pressure bleeder.

Aside from knowing the majority of dual-circuit brakes use a diagonal split, I knew none of this before working on the Disco btw. My past knowledge has either been servicing or HP Citroens (where bleeding the brakes is hilarious, I think I hit the ceiling with the CX front brakes the first time when cracking the bleed nipples open).

The diagonal failure to bleed/work was the only reason I suspected the cylinder from the start and the ABS module uses that dual circuit behaviour to feed and activate its own pump and solenoids - so it was just as possible that the ABS unit being airlocked would give the same symptoms (but not, I suspect, the vacuuming fluid back up the pipe trick).

[Bear]

Oh, and I cannot stress how much easier this all was because I could connect the one way valve drain tube to the caliper and reach behind the wheel without lifting the car or taking the wheels off - and aside from the quick attachment being wrong, the rubber cone universal bleeder cap was way less leaky (as in, not at all, unlike the matched Mazda one that spits like Pob) than the correct fit one on a car... so it was easy to get 15-20psi and just walk around bleeding brakes and watching bubbles, testing the result/activating ABS, then redoing.

[robt100]

45 minutes ago, Bear said:

From the Disco, I'd say the pedal could be fine until you want to bleed the system and then that moment when it goes right to the floorboards, that's a moment when the master cylinder gets stuck.

How's the pedal's return? Clunky and sticks/hesitates?

The crucial bit is that the way the second chamber works (on the Disco - but I expect most dual-circuit hydraulics work in a similar manner) is the valve to let fluid in behind the piston closes under fluid pressure and reopens when the pressure is released - the pressure creates the solid piston. I think if the pedal is pushed too far with an empty, older MC the valve can stick in the closed position, and never draw fluid in or - and this was the clincher - let fluid past even when the pedal is released and you're using a pressure bleeder.

Aside from knowing the majority of dual-circuit brakes use a diagonal split, I knew none of this before working on the Disco btw. My past knowledge has either been servicing or HP Citroens (where bleeding the brakes is hilarious, I think I hit the ceiling with the CX front brakes the first time when cracking the bleed nipples open).

The diagonal failure to bleed/work was the only reason I suspected the cylinder from the start and the ABS module uses that dual circuit behaviour to feed and activate its own pump and solenoids - so it was just as possible that the ABS unit being airlocked would give the same symptoms (but not, I suspect, the vacuuming fluid back up the pipe trick).

Pedal returns fine. Its almost a similar feeling to having an undersized master cylinder, lots (too much!) of travel but no force needed.

Extra fun part is each caliper has 2 bleed nipples, for extra bubble-chasing fun!

[Bear]

It does sound like the fluid isn't getting into the cylinder to get pushed around!

You could try siphoning the reservoir to the point where the higher outlet (should be easiest to see as well) is only just covered and check if it draws some fluid down when you press the pedal. Not saying that's definitive at all, but it was what convinced me the new MC would make a difference rather than being parts cannon due to "nothing else makes sense" then finding that actually something else made sense and I hadn't thought of it or had enough experience to know it.

When there's space I'm happy to have a look - and can lift it up at least - if it can be driven here safely and you've time. Swapping the MC looks a little trickier than the Disco due to clearance but very similar in theory, so should not take long - all the time is in not covering everything in brake fluid, and bleeding the system (which I am guessing would benefit from a Y-shaped setup or at least two of these cheap one-way valve drain tubes).

[robt100]

16 hours ago, Bear said:

It does sound like the fluid isn't getting into the cylinder to get pushed around!

You could try siphoning the reservoir to the point where the higher outlet (should be easiest to see as well) is only just covered and check if it draws some fluid down when you press the pedal. Not saying that's definitive at all, but it was what convinced me the new MC would make a difference rather than being parts cannon due to "nothing else makes sense" then finding that actually something else made sense and I hadn't thought of it or had enough experience to know it.

When there's space I'm happy to have a look - and can lift it up at least - if it can be driven here safely and you've time. Swapping the MC looks a little trickier than the Disco due to clearance but very similar in theory, so should not take long - all the time is in not covering everything in brake fluid, and bleeding the system (which I am guessing would benefit from a Y-shaped setup or at least two of these cheap one-way valve drain tubes).

I will probably take you up on that offer (Sorry about that). Though I have a feeling all the hard lines need re-doing, so might be better off just sending it to the garage to get it all done, as I think all bar the rear pipes are NLA and need making from scratch 😬 No idea what im doing there and would rather not mess about with brakes!

The car still drives fine, just a long pedal. And you can't pump it up solid either from what I can tell, which may hint more towards your MC idea if one circuit is just doing nothing. The £520 for a new one is not so great though 😭

[Bear]

£520 for a master cylinder?! 😬 Is that with a servo and a mechanic attached?

I can make brake hardlines and aside from the sheer misery of fitting them, it really is not that difficult to do. The flaring tool mentioned earlier wasn't expensive and would bash out a set of pipes in very little time, and using the little hand-held radius for bending pipes in-situ is very satisfying.

Though I'm seeing a lot of braided flexible hardline replacement kits now - and those would be very easy to fit compared to bending metal...

[Bear]

Coolant level sensor was araldited in.

Much swearing, housing off, destroy sensor, find threads obliterated, search for right tool.

Manage to cut 1.5 instead of 1.25 but it's plastic threaded plug and at this stage I don't care.

It seems to be staying in and secure.

I hate, hate, hate the five hoses of doom with spring clips on the airbox. Hate. Who the hell designs things like this?!

[Bear]

*burrrrrp*

There are a lot of bubbles in this as it warms up, but I think it's still clearing blockages and crap. Getting it properly flushed and filled will be good, but I really wish I could just buy a new radiator and all the hoses. It would be wise anyway.

I suspect having two pressure caps doesn't help, it's supposed to have a blank cap at the higher filler point.

[High Jetter]

3 hours ago, Bear said:

I suspect having two pressure caps doesn't help, it's supposed to have a blank cap at the higher filler point.

That's like a Daihatsu Hijet/Piaggio Porter. Advice for them is jack the front up & fill from height. Blank or sprung cap shouldn't make much difference as second cap. Can you get the rad re-cored?

[Bear]

It's not about not being able to get one, it's the money 😕

[High Jetter]

50 minutes ago, Bear said:

It's not about not being able to get one, it's the money 😕

Ah, OK

[Bear]

So many cars demanding attention...

One day I'll fix mine

But first, I need to accept that these wheelbearings are old school and that hub ain't coming apart unless I take the knuckle off.

[Bear]

Admitted defeat...

Removed the other knuckle - also with ABS sensor still attached because every attempt to drill and use an extractor failed. How can the bolt be made of something so resistant to being drilled into, but also clearly rounded off the flats in the hex head at any attempt to undo?!

Dropped them off at the local garage and said "please". I am not buying a hydraulic press just for one press-in bearing change.

I can't believe that with Corsa and Yaris and many other GM-Daihatsu-etc. adjacent models all sharing this same basic knuckle and hub (if not swappable, almost certainly emerging from the same OEM) there aren't readily available fully loaded knuckles.

And as always, Google and "products" is total red-herring central showing what looks like what I want, just  part number, and totally unrelated to the search result.

The battery tray had to come out to get the other ABS sensor connector.

On the upside, it is getting two new control arms and strut top bearings since I've done all the work anyway and the fork for getting the balljoint off damaged a grease boot.

[Bear]

Aaaaargh...

Bloody online parts suppliers! I thought the two bearing setup looked odd.

Single assembly type ordered - don't know how I'll fit it.

These were pretty...

...armless...

...to swap.

Top mounts next. Ugh.

I'd rather be finishing this:

[Bear]

I am confused...

I put new top mounts on because the old ones were squeaking...

This metal cup is the top of spring support, and goes against the bearing in the mount

This is the mount, and the curved "hat" on the metal support rests on the bearing...

This part of the bearing, spins. This makes sense.

This part does not. So far the rubber cup sits in the inner wing, the metal piece turns with the damper shaft, spring and strut, Makes sense.

Here is the nut to hold it together. It cannot go anywhere else. It goes on the shaft of the damper /after/ the non-turning part of the bearing. It clamps the rubber mount to the damper shaft.

The assembly then does not turn. How could it?

But the old parts are GM stamped and configured the same way.

Inner race turns

rubber piece sits on a bit that doesn't turn.

To my mind the bearing should be clamped at the bottom so the bearing and everything below it can turn around the rubber upper mounting, with the rubber & metal disc not shown, that secure the strut in the body, "floating" above the strut to allow that and dropping when the suspension travel is exhausted.

But as designed it just all seems to bind up?

What am I missing? Is there some magic when the weight is on it that makes it all work?

[Bear]

I am going to smash this Spark with a very big hammer, just because buying parts has become such a nightmare and it's fighting any attempt to be clever.

1: wheelbearing goes.

2: order wheelbearing based on age, model etc.

They show up quickly but are Gen 2 for "um... maybe newer ones or maybe a Matiz" so back they go, but after the garage has been given the knuckles to press out the hub.

3: the process of pressing out the hub wrecks the disk backing plates, the screws are basically stubs of rust.

The ABS sensors are also still attached and the socket-headed screws are made of "instant internally rounded but can't be drilled for shit".

4: I order new Gen 1 bearings. Seller says next day. Hah. That's almost a week.

5: and they're two different brands.

6: and I have no way of pressing the bastards in.

7: but first I want to fix the backing plates. Buy a new set of cobalt bits. Drill one. Extract. Textbook.

8: next one breaks the extractor.

9: the ABS lug breaks the end off the drill bit.

10: The extractor bits are now 2x the price.

11: I scream like Franka Potente wanting to win at the roulette table and decide to order new knuckles.

ECP: Nowt.
GSF: Nowt.

eBay: Lithuania or Germany.  And Far, far, far too many results that are not Chevy Spark parts.

Google: shopping results that are not Chevy Spark parts. I really wish they would stop doing this. Sponsored or otherwise, if I want a Chevy Spark steering knuckle, I'm not going to be jonesing for just any steering knuckle.

20 fake Autodoc sites. All of which I want to stab. They do have them but I know it'll be another 10 days with the car off the road.

This seems to be the way for any car parts in the UK now. But what do I do? No backing plates, just shove the bearings in the rusty, partly drilled ABS bolts knuckles and throw it back together? Because removing them to put into new knuckles seems unlikely.

I want to scream and break things because this is just a repeat of the Mazda and the idiotic "buy some UK-made bespoke fuel lines with 4 day stated delivery, end up wasting time for nearly a month". What the actual hell is going on with parts suppliers and businesses now?

The Spark's imminent problems were partly why I wanted the Pluriel, but of course I got beaten to it waiting to be paid :/.

And during all this, I cannot do the maintenance my Mercs need...

(Imagine a lot of smoke here after overtaking a lorry)...

...or get the Audi MOTd.

Or the Mazda.

Which is getting closer to ready.

Someone made an error in the past.

Correct one, degas tank, do not remove.

Filler point?

That ain't right.

Now it should bleed properly rather than airlocking too easily.

Distilled water and running a few times seems to be clearing the mixed-coolant jelly.

A few traces, but it looks clear jelly now rather than orange.

It's just so utterly infuriating being unable to easily fix this crusty mess of a hub.

[Zelandeth]

1 hour ago, Bear said:

I am going to smash this Spark with a very big hammer, just because buying parts has become such a nightmare and it's fighting any attempt to be clever.

1: wheelbearing goes.

2: order wheelbearing based on age, model etc.

They show up quickly but are Gen 2 for "um... maybe newer ones or maybe a Matiz" so back they go, but after the garage has been given the knuckles to press out the hub.

3: the process of pressing out the hub wrecks the disk backing plates, the screws are basically stubs of rust.

The ABS sensors are also still attached and the socket-headed screws are made of "instant internally rounded but can't be drilled for shit".

4: I order new Gen 1 bearings. Seller says next day. Hah. That's almost a week.

5: and they're two different brands.

6: and I have no way of pressing the bastards in.

7: but first I want to fix the backing plates. Buy a new set of cobalt bits. Drill one. Extract. Textbook.

8: next one breaks the extractor.

9: the ABS lug breaks the end off the drill bit.

10: The extractor bits are now 2x the price.

11: I scream like Franka Potente wanting to win at the roulette table and decide to order new knuckles.

ECP: Nowt.
GSF: Nowt.

eBay: Lithuania or Germany.  And Far, far, far too many results that are not Chevy Spark parts.

Google: shopping results that are not Chevy Spark parts. I really wish they would stop doing this. Sponsored or otherwise, if I want a Chevy Spark steering knuckle, I'm not going to be jonesing for just any steering knuckle.

20 fake Autodoc sites. All of which I want to stab. They do have them but I know it'll be another 10 days with the car off the road.

This seems to be the way for any car parts in the UK now. But what do I do? No backing plates, just shove the bearings in the rusty, partly drilled ABS bolts knuckles and throw it back together? Because removing them to put into new knuckles seems unlikely.

I want to scream and break things because this is just a repeat of the Mazda and the idiotic "buy some UK-made bespoke fuel lines with 4 day stated delivery, end up wasting time for nearly a month". What the actual hell is going on with parts suppliers and businesses now?

The Spark's imminent problems were partly why I wanted the Pluriel, but of course I got beaten to it waiting to be paid :/.

And during all this, I cannot do the maintenance my Mercs need...

(Imagine a lot of smoke here after overtaking a lorry)...

...or get the Audi MOTd.

Or the Mazda.

Which is getting closer to ready.

Someone made an error in the past.

Correct one, degas tank, do not remove.

Filler point?

That ain't right.

Now it should bleed properly rather than airlocking too easily.

Distilled water and running a few times seems to be clearing the mixed-coolant jelly.

A few traces, but it looks clear jelly now rather than orange.

It's just so utterly infuriating being unable to easily fix this crusty mess of a hub.

It's a nightmare I know, but I'm glad I'm not the only one who's been finding this with what should be fairly normal parts lately.  I was seriously starting to think it was just me.

The 82528492836 different wrappers of Autodoc is something that absolutely drives me up the bloody wall - especially when I KNOW that their catalogue is wrong and the part they think will fit won't.