Peugeot 405/406 predicament

[pogweasel]

Xantia is exactly the sort of car I ought to buy, just can't bring myself to do it.

[Pillock]

Mk3's have the new generation 'TDCI' diesels and are a lot more refined.

Not all; the early ones are TDDI. Think TDCI came in on an 02 plate? Mk3s were Y-reg onwards.On paper the TDDI is a better engine power/torquewise, but it's previous-gen diesel so is more clattery. Cheaper to repair though, watch for split turbo-intercooler hose giving puffs of black smoke when the engine moves (revised part available). TDCI is more complex but a lot more refined.

[pogweasel]

TDDI's are the win. OK, so they only have 89bhp (in the Focus they do anyway), but you can DIY service them, get 60mpg+ on the midnight airport run, and on the inside at least they are quiet enough [outside sounds like a tractor LOL]. TDCI just scares me as there's too much unnecessary gubbins to go wrong. At the 'value' end of the spectrum, it's not worth running the risk that's associated with clever common-rail shit, even if you can go a bit faster.

[Richard]

Is the TDDI the same as the old 1.8 engine that was in the Escorts. That engine is much more of a time bomb than any common rail engine.

[pogweasel]

I don't think it's the sameMy brother-in-law has an Orion Mk5 TD which is comically slow, even compared to the focus. That said, his Orion is well past 200k no hassle, as is the first focus which was put out to grass with the in-laws last year.

[r.welfare]

My colleague runs an ageing Xantia - P-plate 1.8 16v. He's had it since it was 9 months old, and it's coming up to 160k or something now. Just passed the MOT again according to a text message I have just received, too. So they can take the mileage if looked after. He reckons on getting over 40mpg on his long run to/from work (Didcot to Hook), too. I'd reckon you'd see 30-35 from a 2-litre on average.I don't know a huge amount about them, but I would check for rust around the rear door shuts (my mate's has also rusted around the front wheelarch, which is very unusual); cloudy rear lights; front strut tops can break, with pretty catastrophic results (the strut tries to break through the bonnet, in time-honoured 60s Ford style); the usual electrical gremlins including failed heater blowers; dead aircon; and check for damp footwells/smells of curry indicating a failed heater matrix.Make sure the suspension does it's thing - play with the height selector between the seats and watch for it bouncing a lot on a road test. That said, I understand that the system of spheres is inherently longer lasting, and cheaper to replace, than a set of conventional shocks. Lots of ticking/clicking, and any hydro leaks are big concerns. Plus make sure it hasn't been used to tow a 5 ton trailer/caravan or regularly carry it's bodyweight in load, as older ones tend to do thanks to their self-levelling properties.If the car checks out, I'd be tempted to suggest to the guy that you'd buy it subject to it passing an MOT at a station of YOUR choice, to seal the deal.

[The Main]

Cheers Mr Welfare, those words of advice are much appreciated. Been away for a week so no time to pursue the 2-litre Xantia estate any further since viewing it last Sunday.Like I said, it's being sold by the brother of the deceased owner. i drove it last sunday and it seemed very clean and tidy, obviously a car which has been looked after. Unfortunately, the service book is missing and there's nothing to say when it was last serviced (probably not too long ago, the oil wasn't as black as it could have been and it ran very well) or if the cambelt's been done (best to assume it hasn't, I should think). all that's in the history folder is a pile of old MoT's, a few repair bills (such as for some work on the front suspension a couple of years ago) and not much else.MoT runs out on the 23rd October. Apart from a broken/sheared mounting bracket under the driver's seat (the owner was a very big chap apparently), the only thing I noticed was the air con didn't seem very cold, but I may well have been operating it wrongly! I can have it for £925 as is. I'm still tempted, the vendor is happy for me to pay for an MoT and he will pay for any necessary repairs that need doing. So effectively £975 for a 75K-mile V-reg Xantia estate with a 12-month ticket (and tax till January) but no real service history.Not sure what to do - I know a cambelt change and half-decent service will probably eat another £350-400 but it does seem a nice, straight motor. He's asked me to let him know by midday tomorrow cos someone else wants to look at it tomorrow afternoon and he'll need to arrange to be at the address the car is kept at to show it to the bloke (about 40 miles from where he now lives).I suppose the bottom line is - can I live with the lack of service history? Hmmm....

[ashmicro]

Aircon refrigerant is R134a, capacity 135 cubic centimetres. But, being a French car there are variables:Compressor SD 7V 16 with 23mm condenser=975 gramsCompressor SD 7V 16 with 16mm condenser=875 gramsCompressor SD 7H 15=775 gramsCompressor oil:Compressor SD 7V 16=SP10Compressor SD7H 15=SP20Sod that, open a window!

[Cavcraft]

That's bloody big money chief, especially considering it's a petrol one and especially-er considering you are planning on throwing another few hundred quid at it.The bit about 'let him know as soon as because someone else wants to see it' sounds like the classic 'pressure' trick to me if I'm being honest.If you're happy with the car and it's really want then of course it's your call but that's way more than I see the value at for what is I'm afraid a not especially popular car with no history and the wrong engine.

[The Main]

Cheers for your honesty, Cavette! Methinks I've been getting a bit carried away over this Xantia. You're right, I don't really want a petrol one and the lack of service history is very offputting, especially at that price.No - it's overpriced and I'm going to call his bluff now. Not that I really want it anyway. Might offer him £600 in three weeks time if I haven't found anything tidy by then. We'll soon see if the 'other buyer' really exists when he starts phoning me up tomorrow night. I did wonder if that was designed to add a bit of pressure....Bet he's got the service book too - without any stamps in it!

[AXrescuer]

I've been eyeing this one up, Diesel Turbo, 4 months tax, 11 months ticket - £475. Still undecided though:

 

 

Not too far from Pogweasel!

[Milford Cubicle]

8 owners, high mileage... Meh.If it's had some big jobs done recently like the timing belt or clutch, it could be alright.

[AXrescuer]

Cambelt, clutch and radiator done 9k ago apparently.

[Milford Cubicle]

Ah right, it's pretty good value then.I find it hard to read these adverts all in upper case with no paragraphs.

[Cavcraft]

Cheers for your honesty, Cavette! Methinks I've been getting a bit carried away over this Xantia. You're right, I don't really want a petrol one and the lack of service history is very offputting, especially at that price.No - it's overpriced and I'm going to call his bluff now. Not that I really want it anyway. Might offer him £600 in three weeks time if I haven't found anything tidy by then. We'll soon see if the 'other buyer' really exists when he starts phoning me up tomorrow night. I did wonder if that was designed to add a bit of pressure....Bet he's got the service book too - without any stamps in it!

No worries ace, I bet there's hundreds of cars out there well within your budget that would do a good job for you at a decent price.AutoTrader's website might be a good start, I'm pretty sure you can filter the results to get local ones and ones within your budget.There seems to be a few cheap diesel estates about on there by the way, stuff like Xsaras seem cheap (if undesirable!) or...http://search.autotrader.co.uk/es-uk/ww ... egLetter=Sor much cheapness and mileage no bother if looked after...http://search.autotrader.co.uk/es-uk/ww ... egLetter=Ror...http://search.autotrader.co.uk/es-uk/ww ... egLetter=R ?

[Pillock]

Is the TDDI the same as the old 1.8 engine that was in the Escorts. That engine is much more of a time bomb than any common rail engine.

Naaaah.From about a 95 Escort you got the 1.8 TD. It's horrible, it's made from lead and rocks, it develops 12bhp on a good day, and sounds like a very sick tractor. Also found in Mk1 and Mk2 Mondeos.the first Focii shared this engine, then about 1999/2000 when the Mk3 Mondeo appeared they went to TDDI. Variety of power levels a la VAG derv lumps from 90bhp to 130bhp I think, via 105 and 115. Fairly simple, the Mondeo ones split their intercooler hoses regularly but otherwise are reliable. Noisy on the outside, smooth on the inside.2003ish saw TDCI which are quieter, no more powerful or economical but have some emissions benefits I believe. For an autoshiter aiming to do home maintenance, they're overcomplicated.

[dollywobbler]

Ooh, time for me to do my classic "all Ford diesels are complete crap" line!Sorry but while Focus diesels did somehow seem better than Fester/Mundano ones, they're still horrible, horrible engines. All peaky and rubbish. PSA or VAG the diesel engines of choice for me.Take my bargainous BX. Only has a 1.9 non-turdblower in it, but it'll pull 30mph in fifth and has a frankly laughable amount of torque throughout the rev range. According to the book, it'll even drag 1100kg if braked! Can't imagine it'd do that particularly quickly mind...

[Cavcraft]

Was told fairly recently that the Ford 1.8 diesel was loosely based on the PSA engine.

[Milford Cubicle]

Must have been very loosely, because they're shit.

[r.welfare]

My understanding is the 1.8 Endura-D grew out of the 1.6 atmo diesel that went into the Mk2 Fiesta, Mk3 Escort and Orion. Designed with help from Steyr-Puch IIRC.