Taxi - powered by coal, nuclear and gas

[dollywobbler]

I will say this. Because of the short range, I do find myself driving a lot more economically. Mashing the throttle pedal down is just bad, bad news as the range plummets. Whereas in the XM, I keep my foot down just to listen to the turbo whistle...

 

I'm not exactly hanging about, driving like grandad, but I'd say I'm tending to do 50mph a lot more than 60mph. Worryingly, I could seriously get used to this. The lack of gears is just marvellous. I fear I have become old.

[cros]

Just having a look to see if there is a more expensive way of doing 3 short journeys a week than a Twizy, the closest I can get is a knackered Shadow with a dozen anvils in the boot.

[dollywobbler]

I did a 300-mile round trip to Anglesey today to see if I could. Did I make it?! http://wp.me/p1jtbd-zM

(well, obviously I did or I wouldn't be here now).

[Tayne]

You didn't actually go anywhere though, you just drove between chargers.

 

It's hardly making up for your Wales to Cornwall Nissan Nightmare.

[forddeliveryboy]

Were these battery recharges for free? If so, since we're all paying for you swanning pointlessly about, so let us know how long you had to wait and for how much of a charge. And how long were you gone, covering the 300 miles? I read your linked post and couldn't find any of this info.

 

1 gallon of petrol contains about 44kWh of energy, so this suggests OMGIIZSOGREEN 229mpg. Except of course, the electricity maker has paid for the massive losses in making and delivering the stuff, perhaps 50% efficiency at the power station (on a good day) with 92% grid efficiency (on a good day) which makes 0.5*0.92*229 which is just over 100mpg.

 

Then factor in the charging losses, about 25% all up including both the charger and the heat losses as the cells gather volts, which makes for about 75mpg equivalent if you're considering the energy used, starting at the point things are set fire to, to make power. And ignoring the almost 20% renewable grid input, which on a sunny or windy day does help things marginally, EV-wise. Except of course the solar/wind power which would have gone to brew tea or power offices is used for your EV, so coal/nuke/gas/biomass to make up the difference unless it's so sunny and windy the grid's dumping power.

 

Which sounds about right, given regen braking, a warmish summer day and your great-grandad speeds. Add in the fact that your journey was totally unnecessary (from what we can gather), it was a newish car and a greenie would say the cost to the planet just goes up and up. Good job the sun heats your bathwater.

[dollywobbler]

The Nissan range was too woeful. Having a genuine 90 mile range is far more useful than 60, and makes getting to a rapid charger much less stressful. I really need to give the e-Golf a winter test, but it is summer.

[NorfolkNWeigh]

I'm using a Toyota Sienna 3.5 V6 on holiday in Florida at the moment. Yesterday we went to Miami for the day the stupid thing only has a range of 250 miles. This annoys me so much ,I can't imagine how much it would piss me off with the 60/90 mile bollocks. ( plus of course the extra time on every journey messing around recharging)

Interestingly the 500 mile round trip cruising at 85/90 cost about the same as my 5 Series ( range 6/650 miles)would have done at home,the lower fuel costs being almost precisely cancelled out by using twice as much fuel.

No doubt spunking £30k on a little hatchback then breaking down the costs over a couple of years would work out the same per journey too. Although I'd have given up in frustration within a couple of weeks, I'll make allowances for old cars but new tools need to be fit for purpose or they can FRO.

[dollywobbler]

Were these battery recharges for free? If so, since we're all paying for you swanning pointlessly about, so let us know how long you had to wait and for how much of a charge. And how long were you gone, covering the 300 miles? I read your linked post and couldn't find any of this info.

 

1 gallon of petrol contains about 44kWh of energy, so this suggests OMGIIZSOGREEN 229mpg. Except of course, the electricity maker has paid for the massive losses in making and delivering the stuff, perhaps 50% efficiency at the power station (on a good day) with 92% grid efficiency (on a good day) which makes 0.5*0.92*229 which is just over 100mpg.

 

Then factor in the charging losses, about 25% all up including both the charger and the heat losses as the cells gather volts, which makes for about 75mpg equivalent if you're considering the energy used, starting at the point things are set fire to, to make power. And ignoring the almost 20% renewable grid input, which on a sunny or windy day does help things marginally, EV-wise. Except of course the solar/wind power which would have gone to brew tea or power offices is used for your EV, so coal/nuke/gas/biomass to make up the difference unless it's so sunny and windy the grid's dumping power.

 

Which sounds about right, given regen braking, a warmish summer day and your great-grandad speeds. Add in the fact that your journey was totally unnecessary (from what we can gather), it was a newish car and a greenie would say the cost to the planet just goes up and up. Good job the sun heats your bathwater.

 

Well, it wouldn't be much of a car review if I just kept the sodding thing on my driveway would it? I'm harking back to the good old days, when a road test was a proper test. The Telegraph Cars website recently posted a review of this exact Golf in which the writer drove all the way from London to Brighton! And said almost nothing constructive about the car at all.

 

Apologies for not including full timing info for my stops, however I did point out that taking the battery from 48% to 85% took just 15 minutes at my first stop. And yes, it was free, so thanks everyone for paying for my fuel. Oh, and if you think my average speed is in the great-grandad class, you're welcome to try averaging more than that on Welsh roads. Not saying it isn't possible, but I would say I doubt I average all that much quicker in the XM. 

[beko1987]

From driving home from SF, welsh roads can carry speed, which you then have to properly scrub off when you reach a corner! I ended up cruising at 45/50 which I could carry around the corners without much hassle

[dollywobbler]

From driving home from SF, welsh roads can carry speed, which you then have to properly scrub off when you reach a corner! I ended up cruising at 45/50 which I could carry around the corners without much hassle

 

I think this is the most depressing thing. It's a lot more efficient to drive a little more slowly and a fair bit more smoothly. I was taking racing lines to try and keep as much speed up as possible through corners. I'm depressed because I ENJOYED driving efficiently. What have I become?

[320touring]

I think this is the most depressing thing. It's a lot more efficient to drive a little more slowly and a fair bit more smoothly. I was taking racing lines to try and keep as much speed up as possible through corners. I'm depressed because I ENJOYED driving efficiently. What have I become?

the enjoyment comes from the most efficient use of the tool to hand in doing the job required..

 

335 on a long schlep?24.99mpg on lpg ftw (go brutha_touring!)

 

335 up a hill?Fu'Gutty and 30 miles for 30 quid.

 

 

Octavia on the motoway?65mph, 75mpg

 

Octavia on a backroad for a hoon?let the turbo whistle:)

[Tayne]

Well, it wouldn't be much of a car review if I just kept the sodding thing on my driveway would it? I'm harking back to the good old days, when a road test was a proper test.

 

Yes, I remember the days when Autocar would drive a Daimler Double Six from one petrol station to the next and praise it's fuel economy.

[beko1987]

I always try to hypermile to work and back as I dont like paying more money than I need to be stuck in the office every day... Come the weekend, I'll blat about as it's because I want to.

 

I like the idea of EV cars, it's new technology, and new tech is always great! Wouldnt own one because I couldnt afford to buy one, so no point in persuing it.

 

Your blog is a great read DW!

[dollywobbler]

I always try to hypermile to work and back as I dont like paying more money than I need to be stuck in the office every day... Come the weekend, I'll blat about as it's because I want to.

 

I like the idea of EV cars, it's new technology, and new tech is always great! Wouldnt own one because I couldnt afford to buy one, so no point in persuing it.

 

Your blog is a great read DW!

 

Thanks. And I agree. The technology I find fascinating, especially as it seems to work so well.

[forddeliveryboy]

Oh dear, did I get the wrong impression about your driving? ("Oh, and if you think my average speed is in the great-grandad class, you're welcome to try averaging more than that on Welsh roads. Not saying it isn't possible, but I would say I doubt I average all that much quicker in the XM"). I remember you mentioned carrying your speed through corners, but tbf, you did also say, "Normally, travelling this slowly would pain me – even going uphill in the 2CV – but actually, it was really relaxing."

 

I'm still interested in finding out how long the whole trip took and perhaps how long adding a few score miles to the range added - i wasn't asking for stopwatch timings, just a fair idea. If more people found out, perhaps they'd be more interested in considering an EV?

 

i agree with 320touring -

 

the enjoyment comes from the most efficient use of the tool to hand in doing the job required..
 

[dollywobbler]

Perhaps I didn't convey my many thoughts well. The one hillclimb was much slower than I'd normally drive - 45mph on a clear, straight NSL road is usually 60mph power permitting. But overall, I managed to travel fairly swiftly without the adrenaline-pumping reality of a constant overtaking mission. That certainly was a lot more relaxing, and frustratingly enjoyable.

 

The car appears to have the vital stats on the total trip.

 

That's the total driving time, not total elapsed time from leaving the house. Add three vaguely half-hour charging slots on top of that. I thought I'd taken enough pics of chargers and the dashboard to record all of the vital stats (ie total stopping time) but it appears I failed in that mission. Must have been the frustration of UHT milk with my cups of tea.

[320touring]

someone agreed with me?

 

*changes opinions forthwith*

 

Ian, 39mph average is pretty good- think my octy has averaged 35mph over last 500- and that is with plenty of motorway action:)

[forddeliveryboy]

Half-hour charges to refill the battery aren't bad at all - i wonder what the tipping point for EVs will be, charge time wise - 25 mins for 150 miles? As it is, anyone who's not venturing more than 90 miles at a go hasn't much to worry about. Seven and a half hours for 300 miles on winding hilly roads is a repectable time even without the stops, I'd say.

 

Thanks for that extra info, DW. You is now betta than da Telligaff.

[cort16]

I recon the really successfull elecy cars will be the ground up built ones like the i3, leaf and tesla. Ones that have been modified from existing cars are surely always going to be compromised in some way? For a start they're designed to have a massive engine up front. A ground up design doesn't have that limitation.

[dollywobbler]

Half-hour charges to refill the battery aren't bad at all - i wonder what the tipping point for EVs will be, charge time wise - 25 mins for 150 miles? As it is, anyone who's not venturing more than 90 miles at a go hasn't much to worry about. Seven and a half hours for 300 miles on winding hilly roads is a repectable time even without the stops, I'd say.

 

Thanks for that extra info, DW. You is now betta than da Telligaff.

 

Don't get me started on the Telegraph! That piece about driving an e-Golf from London to Brighton was absolute guff. 

 

Cort - you make a very fair observation. I'd love to try an i3. It's a good 300kg lighter than the e-Golf, because it's not compromised by being just an electric version of a normal car. Similarly, the LEAF feels much, much better than the e-NV200 - another conversion.

[cort16]

I'd like a shot in an i3. I think they got the futuristic styling and interior just right too. Pity they're 25 grand.

[dollywobbler]

I'd like a shot in an i3. I think they got the futuristic styling and interior just right too. Pity they're 25 grand.

 

That's two grand cheaper than the Golf. It's the first time I've been interested in a modern BMW since the E38.

[forddeliveryboy]

The i3 is superb, the interior is lovely and the whole package feels very special. But the moped engine on the range-extender models is noisy and spoils everything, including weight. Wheels and tyres skinnier than a 2cv's, relative to the 19" rim size, which says a lot about the car's design purity and the product confidence of the manufacturer.

 

To be fair to the Golf, the structure was engineered from the outset with a place for the batteries, but of course it's still more of a compromise than the BMW. But the Golf has a very user-involved adjustable regen system, which should appeal to the masses who need something to fiddle with and adjust to their liking.

[dollywobbler]

Jumping back into the XM today, I was seriously missing the regen. You don't get much engine braking in fifth gear.

[forddeliveryboy]

^^ It takes some adjusting to, but it's easy to take your foot off the loud pedal a bit sooner. I wonder, given the massive inefficiencies of regen braking on battery cars whether it wouldn't be better to switch it off/as low as possible and take your foot off sooner, instead?

 

I'm amazed by how many times the brake lights come on with many cars, they really don't need to be used so much in general driving. t seems that with shed-loads of torque from modern turbo-diesels, the art of maintaining momentum, 2cv style, has been completely forgotten.

 

The vast amounts of energy used to accelerate such a massive load of steel and glass can be well ameliorated on a modern car, which cuts fuel supply to the engine when the accelerator pedal's released. The freewheeling hubs of the past must have been great for hypermiling. especially on streamlined cars like the old Saabs.

 

Interesting stuff here about long range battery cars - http://cleantechnica.com/2015/06/27/long-range-nissan-electric-car-gets-pumped-at-annual-shareholders-meeting/

[dollywobbler]

Did have a regen discussion on Speak EV. I think a lot of the time, it's probably true that less regen is more efficient. However, I liked it on maximum regen, but using my throttle pedal control to moderate it. It's remarkably easy to control a car's acceleration and braking with just one pedal! On the hills of Wales, you really do need that strong regen. I found in D, it just wouldn't slow down at all unless you hit the brake pedal.

 

Has to be said though. Yesterday was my first drive in a week where I had no concerns at all about range. The XM had about 450 miles in it when I left home.

[cort16]

Have you seem this motor trend hellcat v tesla film on YouTube ? The tesla really looks like an awesome bit of kit. It also looks fun which a lot manufactures seem to totally forget about. How many cars have an insane mode?

 

[NorfolkNWeigh]

Thanks for putting that video up Cort. I was getting convinced by the Tesla with its instant powere and insane mode..... Right up till when he started driving the Charger, I could live with 3.7 seconds to 60 instead of 3.2 in eerie silence.

The price of the 204 mph Charger,when converted to proper money, is less than the cheapest ActiveHybrid 5 Series here.

Goes to look up 300C Hemis on eBay (and superchargers)

[forddeliveryboy]

Did have a regen discussion on Speak EV. I think a lot of the time, it's probably true that less regen is more efficient. However, I liked it on maximum regen, but using my throttle pedal control to moderate it. It's remarkably easy to control a car's acceleration and braking with just one pedal! On the hills of Wales, you really do need that strong regen. I found in D, it just wouldn't slow down at all unless you hit the brake pedal.

 

Has to be said though. Yesterday was my first drive in a week where I had no concerns at all about range. The XM had about 450 miles in it when I left home.

 

A veg-munching machine has infinite range at almost zero cost, providing there is human habitation somewhere. When the fuel gauge stuck on a Merc I was stranded in a remote valley, miles from phone signal and even further from a fuel station. So I walked half a mile to the nearest house and asked for a couple of litres of cooking oil. The nice lady was so intrigued by the request, she refused to take any money.

[cort16]

I think those hellcats are extremely good value for the punch they pack. 68,000 dollars is £42,000 so about the price of a mid spec 5 series.

 

None the less the tesla is impressive