A bit of a strange working day! (Moderns)

[Barry Cade]

My daily is a 1.4 punto,its quickish and the tax isn't too bad,only managed an average of 37 mpg on a recent trip to the nurburgring and back though, 102 octane ftw.

 

Ouch,

I got home yesterday from my yearly road trip to Germany (and Amsterdam in the 145qv 2 litre, and got just over 38 mpg out of 1 tank. even ragging it on the autobahn and touching 140 on the speedo more than a few times, I never got less than 35. 98 octane at 1 Euro 71 smarted a bit though.

[fiatdaft]

I know the price of fuel in holland was more expensive than germany,that 102 octane was 160.9 .That 37 mpg did include the ring itself though !

[Mr_Bo11ox]

The chap who did the first high pressure common rail diseasel injection engines for FIAT said about 10 years ago that the diesel engine would fade away rapidly once manufacturers start to put decent common rail systems on turbo petrol engines as a turbo petrol lump is just as capable of big torque and economy figures as a modern turbo diseasel. The petrol is also cleaner, quieter, smoother, easier to get through ever-tightening emissions, doesn't need a DMF, doesn't sound like a bag of shite and is capable of operating over a much wider rev range. They're also capable of big power if that's what you want (provided you don't expect 500 bhp and 50 mpg...)

 

I'm amazed more manufacturers aren't making common rail turbo petrol engines with LPG systems as standard. That way you can forget diesel, have a nicer car and run it on the cheap. As far as I know only Volvo and Subaru currently offer turbo LPG cars from the factory.

 

Surely any EFi petrol motor of the last 20 years or so is esentially a common rail petrol.

 

The problem with petrol is you can only squash it so much before it detonates itself, which you dont want. Hence petrol engines have been running similar compression ratios for about 40 years, as the nature of petrol stops you going any higher than that. If you design the engine to accomodate that self-detonation its then a diesel engine innit. With a diesel you can squash the charge as much as you like, cos its only air. You're only limited by how well (how 'homogeneous') you can mix up the diesel/air mixture, which at the moment is limited by how high a pressure you can generate as you're injecting it. And the more you can squash it, the more you can get out of it, cos its the difference in work between you squashing it, and it unsquashing itself, that drives you down the road!

[ashmicro]

City Dwellers: Nissan Leaf and a large motorbike. Or a gas tubine ZEV Jaguar XJ when it comes out. There is also talk of a ZEV XJ and XF with a three cylinder Louts turbodiesel purely for geberating electricity.

[Barry Cade]

My daily is a 1.4 punto,its quickish and the tax isn't too bad,only managed an average of 37 mpg on a recent trip to the nurburgring and back though, 102 octane ftw.

 

I had a few days at relatives in Northern Germany, and was told one morning- GO AND FILL YOUR TANK NOW. Fuel is more expensive at weekends, and sometimes the price just drops for a day or two. It was 1.68, and dropped to 1.54, for just a day. Crazy....

[CIH]

The chap who did the first high pressure common rail diseasel injection engines for FIAT said about 10 years ago that the diesel engine would fade away rapidly once manufacturers start to put decent common rail systems on turbo petrol engines as a turbo petrol lump is just as capable of big torque and economy figures as a modern turbo diseasel. The petrol is also cleaner, quieter, smoother, easier to get through ever-tightening emissions, doesn't need a DMF, doesn't sound like a bag of shite and is capable of operating over a much wider rev range. They're also capable of big power if that's what you want (provided you don't expect 500 bhp and 50 mpg...)

 

I'm amazed more manufacturers aren't making common rail turbo petrol engines with LPG systems as standard. That way you can forget diesel, have a nicer car and run it on the cheap. As far as I know only Volvo and Subaru currently offer turbo LPG cars from the factory.

 

Surely any EFi petrol motor of the last 20 years or so is esentially a common rail petrol.

 

The problem with petrol is you can only squash it so much before it detonates itself, which you dont want. Hence petrol engines have been running similar compression ratios for about 40 years, as the nature of petrol stops you going any higher than that. If you design the engine to accomodate that self-detonation its then a diesel engine innit. With a diesel you can squash the charge as much as you like, cos its only air. You're only limited by how well (how 'homogeneous') you can mix up the diesel/air mixture, which at the moment is limited by how high a pressure you can generate as you're injecting it. And the more you can squash it, the more you can get out of it, cos its the difference in work between you squashing it, and it unsquashing itself, that drives you down the road!

 

Mazdas latest ptrols and diesels run identical compression ratios, the petrol being one of the highest ever and the diesel deffo the lowest ever. It's the high CR that makes diesels naturally lazy to rev.

[AnthonyG]

It used to be that diesel engines lasted longer than petrol ones, now it seems to be the other way round.

 

Renault Dci and Ford TDCi seem to be particularly prone to blowing up, judging by 'spares or repairs' cars on Ebay as new as '56' reg. I guess high pressure turbos are the weakness?

[catsinthewelder]

I think that you can add Vauxhall's to that group too. The bosses 58 plate Vectra CDTi grenade'd recently.

 

Are any of the european diesels a safe bet? My friend is after a Berlingo or similar and has asked me to keep an eye out for something, I don't want to recommend him something that will cause him grief. An LDV Pilot with seats in the back?

[Luxobarges_Are_Us]

The Ford diesels are actually rebranded PSA HDIs.

[fiatdaft]

And fiat in the diesel ka.

[Albert Ross]

And fiat in the diesel ka.

 

Which is shared with the Corsa, Astra, Meriva, Punto, Doblo etc.

 

Also, the 1.9 Vauxhall is a Fiat....

The 1.9 Vivaro is a Renault, and the 2.0 is Nissan, 2.5 is Renault..... The last diesel Vauxhall made was the 2.0 and 2.2 seen in the Astra/Zafira/Vectra/Frontera/Omega/Sintra etc. Even the current 1.7 is the Isuzu lump. The Vauxhall "J" diesel wasn't a lot of cop once a Turbo was slapped on the side. The 3.0V6 Diesel (Vectra/Signum) is Isuzu, The 2.0 found in the NEW Astra and Insignia is also found in the Chevrolet Captiva and the other Koren thing that's based on the running gear. Forget which one it is..

 

Indenors in Fords.... that's a diesel!

[gtd2000]

costs 33k. batteries are guaranteed 8 years.......new batteries 7k

 

That 'lifetime warranty' of theirs only lasted for a year, then!

 

8 years is the "lifetime" of the batteries.

 

It's common terminology to use "lifetime" with warranties to make people think it means forever.

 

Perhaps somewhere in the small print it actually states that "lifetime" relates to the lifespan of a Mayfly!

[gtd2000]

I know the price of fuel in holland was more expensive than germany,that 102 octane was 160.9 .That 37 mpg did include the ring itself though !

 

When I was living in Holland (2008~2009) I was shocked at the general cost of pretty much everything!

 

From what I remember the price of a packet of ground coffee was very reasonable - but you can't live on ground coffee beans to my knowledge!

 

Figure in the hellishly high taxation/social conntribution rates and it makes you wonder why you would choose to live in the NL?

 

I'm pretty sure (from memory) that the road tax for a diesel or LPG car was approaching £2000 per year. Petrols were similar to the UK.

 

Thankfully I got a reduced wage deduction rate of 38% overall but the going rate would have been 51%.......