Escort running problems - hopefully now cured.

[retrogeezer]

Well, just had an eventful trip back from Capesthorne House in my Escort (1.6 CVH - VV carb)I've done 6-700 miles with no problems in this car but on the way back home (after about 10 miles) it started to miss and then died completely.It didn't even seem to want to turn over at all so I rang the AA and waited.After about 10 minutes I tried it again and it fired up although with a noisy tappet which is quite common on these starting from cold but hasn't been noticeable on this car. It did however quiten down after a couple of minutes so I'm putting this down to the oil being very hot and thin.I cancelled the AA call out and continued on the rest of the 7 mile journey home, getting to within a couple of miles and it died again. This time, it did fire up again straight away but then died twice more with similar results before getting home.What could it be? I was thinking it may possibly be fuel evaporation from the heat (I've never used it when it's been this hot) or maybe the fuel pump failing? If it was dirt in the fuel I would have thought I'd have had problems before now. Any ideas? If it is fuel evaporation, how do I solve it?Cheers.

[Des]

Very likely to be the ignition module, that's exactly how they always used to behave when they pooped.

[Albert Ross]

I had this happen on an early MK1 Sierra 1.6. The green slide in the carb had stuck due to a piece of grit in the slide area. Unscrew the air filter and try to move the slide sideways in the carb. It works the on the same principle as an SU or Stromberg. It's worth it before you get the parts book out. What year is it? Some of the early escorts had points. Is it a black, blue, or red cap distributor? (Lucas, Motorcraft or Bosch)

[retrogeezer]

It's a blue cap distributor with the ignition module inside I think. I'm sure the C plate one I used to have had the module on top of the dizzy.

[Guest]

Very likely to be the ignition module, that's exactly how they always used to behave when they pooped.

Seconded. Mine died during a period when I was very seldom using it. Boshed on a distributor from a late model XR2 - problem solved.Oddly enough I never had a problem with the VV or auto choke, despite the common knowledge that says you should convert to Weber and manual choke ASAP though my car only had 45k on the clock when I got rid.

[Station]

Ignition module, or ignition coil amp, fails in the heat when they are faulty. Having the car cool down points to that. It should be located on or around the coil.

[Guest Tony Hayers]

Very likely to be the ignition module, that's exactly how they always used to behave when they pooped.

Seconded. Mine died during a period when I was very seldom using it. Boshed on a distributor from a late model XR2 - problem solved.Oddly enough I never had a problem with the VV or auto choke, despite the common knowledge that says you should convert to Weber and manual choke ASAP though my car only had 45k on the clock when I got rid.

+3 - Happend on my dads early 84 Orion 1.6i years ago. His went completely as when it was stone cold you could run it for a few moments and then it all went to cock with jerky revs for a moment or two before it would die withouth starting again until it cooled down to cold. You could try replacing the silicone grease between the module and dizzy before comitting yourself to a new module

[vicsmith]

Bit late to the party with this one, but I had a CVH Orion injection on my lot a couple of years ago, it had a problem like yours but a fair bit worse, and as far as I remember a replacement ignition module was the cure.

[retrogeezer]

Ignition module seems to be the 1st thing to look at then....there is a 1.4 CVH engine in a Fiesta at the breakers near me. I'll go and see if it still has the dizzy on it on Tuesday.Cheers all.

[Mr_Bo11ox]

What breakers is that RG?

[retrogeezer]

That one that had the Rover in I told you about B - Barlows up near the Premier Inn.

[pompei]

[retrogeezer]

You could try replacing the silicone grease between the module and dizzy before comitting yourself to a new module

Is that the same stuff used on computer processors when fitting to the motherboard?Where would I buy it? Got some for the pc from staples but it was very expensive.

[retrogeezer]

Quick update...I've just taken off the diizzy cap (unusually for me I had not looked at this since buying the car as it was running so well) and the contacts are really badly corroded...I'm actually surprised it was running to be honest. I'm a bit embarrased as it's one of the 1st things I usually check when I've bought a car but as I said, it was running so sweetly.So, given that these contacts are so bad, could that have been part of the problem in the heat? If something else was even slightly affected by the heat I would guess it would have made the spark too weak to get through the corrosion.I have a spare cap so thats going straight on but just wondered if anyone had thoughts on this before spending any cash on uneccessary bits.Thanks

[retrogeezer]

Any thoughts chaps???

[Des]

If you mean the contacts inside the cap, they do get a fair claggy crusty build up on them, while you clean up the cap, you can just scrape each of them with a screwdriver and as long as they're not eroded hugely all should be ok, the ht current jumps across a little gap from the tip of the rotor, so the clag makes little difference.It's possibly as useful to have a spare module, as it is to have a spare wheel, and if you had injection you'd want to carry a fuel pump relay as well.

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

Never clean the crap off distributor cap contacts - it just means the coil has to work harder. Replace the cap if it bothers you that much.CVH Scrotes had two distributors; blue cap were Motorcraft, brown was Bosch and some were Ducellier with (I think) black caps, but these are rare.Yes, the module fails. They are held onto the underside of the distributor with 2 crosshead screws. It's worth replacing it....BUT....both distributors (mainly Motorcraft ones) were known for the internal windings going open circuit when warm. It's worth just getting a used Bosch distributor and putting that on - they're a straight swap.The Ford VV carburettor worked fine. All that used to happen was the original black diaphragms used to perforate. Ford issued a replacement blue one which cured this along with a new diaphragm for the accelerator pump. I did countless diaphragm swaps in the eighties and never had a problem once this was done and the automatic choke adjusted. The fabled Weber conversion was a crock of shit, a badly made piece of shite moulded from die cast monkey metal.

[retrogeezer]

Thats useful info Reverend...hopefully the fezza at the breakers still has a Bosch dizzy on it.

both distributors (mainly Motorcraft ones) were known for the internal windings going open circuit when warm.

Sounds like this could be what is happening.No probs so far with the VV carb on it - started 1st time yesterday after 2 weeks sitting on the drive.

[Guest]

Retro, probably best to make sure you get the coil as well as the distributor as they can differ.You may find that the electrical connection is different, your car probably has a two-cable plug, the later ones have a three cable plug, chop off a bit of the wiring as well (the third wire is a brown cable that needs to be attached to a chassis earth point).This was what I had to do on mine - though the coil turned out to be no different if I remember correctly. I didnt chuck out the original distributor and its still sitting around somewhere with a brand new blue cap on it...

[retrogeezer]

Well, didn't bother with the breakers dizzy, he wanted £15 for the dizzy & £5 for the coil and they looked a right state. Admittedly that doesn't mean they won't work, but they aren't that much dearer new and I'm sure a better one will turn up.I have a spare blue cap one off an 82 escort but again, it's a different distributor. I think I'll just carry this around in the car in case it happens again. Looking at it, it would appear to have had a new module so I could just swap that over for mine anyway. The breakers yard guy also said that it is common for them to play up when it's really hot and Sunday was probably the hottest day of the year. Thanks for all the advice.

[Guest Tony Hayers]

Any half decent motor factors should have it. I did hear off an AA/RAC fitter that vaseline* can be used as a tempoary sub, although I dont know how true or well it works. Sorry dont have a clue about teh PC related stuff.* Thats two uses for it

[retrogeezer]

I just bought this on ebay - I'm sure it's the same stuff - just a thermal silicone grease.

 

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ... 0178487436

[retrogeezer]

Right, spent a few hours on this today and got absolutely nowhere.First off, changed the ignition module, then changed the distributor, then the coil. Still getting the same problem.It runs like a dream around the streets but as soon as I put my foot down on a duel carriageway it starts to misfire. Sometimes it dies completely and won't go for a few minutes, other times it fires up again straight away and runs o.k for a little bit. I don't know if it's just the weather but everything seems very hot under the bonnet....even the slam panel was too hot to touch. Temp guage all seems fine though and fan coming on as it should.Help.

[Albert Ross]

Please read my first reply!!!!!!!!!!!Did you play with the carb yet?

[retrogeezer]

Yep, sorry - I checked that a few days ago as it was only a 5 minute job.I've not noticed an in-line filter so may fit one but seems strange to have done 6-700 miles with no issues whatsoever.

[retrogeezer]

Right guys, I think I may have got to the bottom of this but not sure how to cure it.I've been changing things today and I noticed that it seems to conk out when it gets up to temperature. It is as if the thermostat is acting as a cut off switch.I also noticed that the water in the expansion tank is not very hot and not under any real pressure.So, I am now thinking this is a blockage or something in the cooling system? How do I solve this? I did the usual thing of running it up until the fan cut in but that hasn't made any difference and the water in the expansion tank is still only warm.Do I need to remove a few pipes and blast water through with a hose or something?

[retrogeezer]

No thoughts anyone? I'm thinking now that the thermostat may be stuck shut so will get a new one and keep my fingers crossed.

[Guest]

Are you thinking that it's overheating, or does it have the watercooled automatic choke that could be doing funny things?

[retrogeezer]

It doesn't overheat as the fan still comes on but water in the expansion tank is only warm and there is no pressure when you take off the cap.I think these do have water cooled auto choke mechanisms so thats another possibilty I guess.

[Pillock]

I had a carb'ed Golf 2 that had issues with the waxstat, which is I'm lead to believe some form of auto choke that runs on water temperature.Basically ran fine when cold, would only run with wide open throttle or idle when warm so I had to drive it like a knob.Didn't think Fords had the same setup though...?