Big Wolseley find

[dollywobbler]

Leonard Lord was looking for an excuse to get rid of Palmer so that Issigonis could return from Alvis and take his job. Issigonis designed the Mini and the bones of the 1100 but the following cars he was responsible for (1800, Maxi) were so bad that they killed BMC. I reckon the industry would have been a far better place if the brilliant Palmer had kept his job as design head at BMC and Issigonis had disappeared into obscurity. Anyone interested in Palmer should read his autobiography "Auto Architect"

 

In what way was the 1800 'bad'?

 

It was hopeless! It was meant to be an executive car to rival the Rover P6 and Triumph 2000 but ended up being a dumpy looking, austerity-laden oddity. I love them, but not enough people did when they were new. The switchgear couldn't be reached if you were wearing a seatbelt, and nor could the handbrake! It proved that while Issy was pretty good at engineering - it drove and handled well - he was hopeless when it came to a modern 'whole car' ethos. If that wasn't bad enough, he then went a created the Maxi - though cost saving measures such as using the same doors as the Landcrab meant aesthetics were never going to be a strong point.

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

The 1800 was meant to compete in the A60-Oxford market and it ought to have replaced all of them. Unfortunately it was ugly and bland (a fine achievement), too big, too slow and the steering required the strength of Hercules in parking manoevres. It was also bigger inside than it really needed to be. IMO it only really worked as the Wolseley 18/85 with smarter styling and a nice interior.

 

Austin and Morris should never have merged - combine two successful and proud car companies to create one enormous fuck up with a maniac like Lord at the helm and incompetents like George Harriman in the mix. Without the merger, there's a strong chance one of the two would still be around but Nuffield were undoubtedly making the better cars and engines - the twin cam Riley motor as well as the delightful little 900 cc OHC Wolseley unit that so nearly powered the Minor. The A Series that took its place was an unreliable and gutless crock of shit before Morris Engines revamped it into the 948, and the suspension and steering of Nuffield stuff (coil sprung rear axles, torsion bars, rack and pinion) was far better than the lever arm crap Austin made. Compare the lovely Z Magnette with the Farina that replaced it.

A Nuffield company with both Palmer and issigonis would have been world beating. Never mind.

[oman5]

I agree. The reins of BMC's future were pretty much handed to issigonis, and brilliant though he was, his ideas were not always compatible with market forces. Piss-poor management did not help. He was told to design an A60 replacement that on no account should compete directly with the Cortina, so they made the 1800 bigger. alienating the biggest section of the market. His opinion was that "it doesn't matter what it looks like as long as it works" which is clearly Bollocks as Ford Proved time and again, they rarely made anything offensive on the eye.

 

Things would have been very different if they had bothered to listen to Roy Haynes. An ex Ford man, designer of the mk2 cortina, he went on to design the marina (which actually made money for BL).

He advocated the practise of using 2 or 3 common floorpans to base the entire vehicle range on- standard practise now and marvelous for saving money. BL were having none of it, Haynes buggered off and did very nicely with the newly formed Hyundai. (first generation Pony was a marina under the skin)

[trigger]

[406V6]

In what way was the 1800 'bad'?

Much has been said already but for starters:

- ugly outside

- ugly inside and austere, with bad ergonomics

- too big

- too heavy

- too expensive for the target market

- unreliable in its early days

 

For the Maxi

- ugly outside

- austere inside until the dash was facelifted

- diabolical gear change

- unrefined engine

- very slow, although helped by the development of the 1750

 

As the direct result of the above, both sold a fraction of their sales forecast losing BMC a shedload of money. Inadequate profits lead to them being unable to develop suitable replacements in the future and coupled with a bad general economy, introduction of the Allegro to replace the 1100/1300 and a suicidal workforce went titsup in 1975.

 

That Wolseley 6/90 looks lovely and has survived well. I can smell that lovely "old car" smell from here. As a car spotter in the 60s and 70s I can't remember seeing many of these on the road but fortunately there are still more than 50 surviving today - a pretty good rate of survival for a family car.

[dollywobbler]

The Maxi is particularly galling. It could have been brilliant. Only the Renault 16 could match it for practicality and a 5-speed gearbox, and that had a more cramped interior, because the inferior packaging left the engine shoe-horned into the middle of the dashboard. Think how long it took Ford to market a front-wheel drive hatchback. The seats in that didn't even convert into a bed.

[purplebargeken]

That 6/90 is just lovely.