X1/9 no go.

[richardmorris]

Ok, old battery on the fiat seemed dead, very slow to turn over. New battery bought today by my dad and now he says there's nothing from turning the ignition switch at all. ( door lights etc work). Complete inactivity. Is there an ignition or a starter motor fuse?

Any ideas?

 

Thanks.

[nigel bickle]

Bet the battery lead to the solenoid is getting hot. Dismantle, clean, lightly grease and refit.

 

Then take the new battery back

[richardmorris]

Thanks. He's going to look tomorrow when it's light. Could it be the starter or solenoid have jammed?

[nigel bickle]

Unlikely, you'd smell burning. Bad connections would be my bet.

 

It's possible, but unlikely to be starter problems from sitting.

[PiperCub]

Bad earth connection - engine to chassis? Is power getting to the solenoid?

 

Try again with the headlamps full on, if they dim massively (as opposed to a smallish amount) then the s/motor is pulling too much current so look at the wiring and the s/motor itself. 

[richardmorris]

Thanks everyone. I'll pass the messages along.

[Barry Cade]

It's not be the first time I've seen someone fitting an X1/9 battery back to front....... some things will still work. You want a Xantia diesel battery- fits in the box, much more capacity and the terminals are the correct way round.

[richardmorris]

I think it is a xantia spec one. I must presume it's the right way round, or I'll be calling the old people's home in th morning to ask about vacancies

[Barry Cade]

Not being cheeky or making assumptions, but I have seen it happen before, more than once! If not, check where the battery cable goes through the bulkhead into the fusebox, the infamous brown wire- if it's disconnected or burnt, it can cause FTP.

[richardmorris]

Not beeing cheeky or making assumptions, but I have seen it happen before, more than once!

I agree it is best to start with the basics.

 

That the parent's own c3 is going into the garage tomorrow for glow plugs does not help calm things.

 

Assuming (yes) that the battery is the right way round ( I have just asked too, which hasn't helped them thinking that i am concerned that they're not capable on their own!) the car has started perfectly fine - went for petrol last Wednesday, then up to Chester on Sunday for a meeting and back again. It was on trying to restart in the drive to park in the garage that it seemed reluctant.

 

It's not a huge issue. I will have a look when I'm back there at Easter if it doesn't get going in the meantime.

 

I did have a row with a guy in the club once when we were talking to another person about batteries. I said ( like you) to get a large xantia battery. And this guy ( in an adenoidal voice - all clubs seem to have one) said that battery size doesn't matter. I said I was talking about a large capacity but he wouldn't have it.

This is also the same guy who was muttering under his breath about something wrong with my car - he shut up after I told him that's how it drove out of the showroom though.

[Barry Cade]

I am not in the X1/9 club anymore for similar reasons. I was a tech advisor for many years.

 

The little spade connector on the starter can break, the wire is pretty flimsy, and starters do go bad on them. Another thing to watch is the carb fan running constantly- kills the battery after sitting.

[richardmorris]

Apparently connections to starter look ok and clean but still no luck. Carb fan does run for a while but clicks off like it should.

He's not looked at the wires from the battery through to the fuse box yet. He has been up to the local Italian car specialists who've been looking after it recently. They have offered to come and look, but are jammed solid this week and next so will be after Easter. I am going up at Easter so will try and work out what it is then.

 

Do ignition switches fail? Apparently the dash warning lights come on and don't dim much when the key is turned but there's no sound at all from the starter / solenoid. If it is the starter that's totally dead, is it a DIY prospect to change? Or does it need to go up in the air for access?

As to above. Is there a recommended upgrade / modern alternative to the starter?

 

Most annoying, as this is the first electrical mishap since I've had it -which is ten years ago!

[Barry Cade]

Ignition switches can and do fail, but usually give plenty warning. Starters also fail, but usually a tap with a jack handle or something will get them working again for a bit. Easy enough to change and possible from the top, but easier with the rear jacked up - 3 13mm headed bolts and a couple of wires. No starter upgrades I'm aware of, but always cheap new ones on Ebay- they fitted the same starter to most OHC 1100-1600 engines.

[richardmorris]

Ok. Just spent several hours scraping the skin off my hands to no effect.

 

Dad had been sold the wrong battery from Ecp so took it back.

 

All battery connections seem nice and clean and tight. Brown wire to fuse box showing no voltage drop from battery, ditto no voltage drop from battery positive to any earth, took wires off starter ( with much swearing and loss of blood). Big wire connections seemed a bit green and washers a bit rusty, all cleaned up ok. Small wire seemed loose- came off easily. But no so easy to refit the bugger. I had to take a plug lead off to get a spanner to the 13mm nut and when I accidentally dropped the spanner and shorted out the terminal to the spark plug the motor sprang into life!

 

I then disconnected the battery!

 

Cleaned up the terminals and put it all back together expecting it to work. But no. Still nothing at all from the ignition switch. Took the plastic cladding off the steering column and all wiring to switch looks ok, and still no voltage drop to the end of the brown wire into the back of the ignition switch.

 

So, this shouts to me ignition switch? Thoughts please?

[scaryoldcortina]

Certainly sounds like it. What happens when you feed 12v to the starter wire at the back of the ignition switch?

[richardmorris]

Not tried that- it got dark. And I needed a drink- having also spent 5 hours driving 180 miles to north wales from Surrey on a bank holiday Friday!

[billyboy406v6]

Are all earth leads secure and clean, had an Alfa that would only bump start thus causing the earth lead to reconnect with the sudden jolt as the clutch came up ?

[Barry Cade]

Are all earth leads secure and clean, had an Alfa that would only bump start thus causing the earth lead to reconnect with the sudden jolt as the clutch came up ?

There is an earth lead that goes from the gearbox to the chassis, these turn to dust after a few years.

[richardmorris]

Couldn't see that gearbox one- any ideas where to look?

[nigel bickle]

Unless you hear a click/ clunk when you turn the key, the solenoid a not operating.

 

Easily checked, just run a seperate low tension wire from the solenoid direct to the battery. Should kick it straight in when touched against the live terminal.

[richardmorris]

No clunk from the solenoid. Does whir away when shorted.

[Barry Cade]

Couldn't see that gearbox one- any ideas where to look?

Goes from the end of the gearbox under the slave cylinder over to the passengers side chassis rail, look up in front of the exhaust tailpipe.

[richardmorris]

Thanks. I'll check the gearbox earth tomorrow. After that, if it doesn't work, I think it's a garage job as I can't see how to get the ignition barrel off at all.

[Barry Cade]

Thanks. I'll check the gearbox earth tomorrow. After that, if it doesn't work, I think it's a garage job as I can't see how to get the ignition barrel off at all.

Dead easy- 2 security bolts, but they come out easily by tapping them round with a small chisel or screwdriver, new switch comes with new security bolts. Whole collumn comes out with 4 bolts and 1 at the uj- easier to do on the bench.

 

[richardmorris]

Thanks.

[Guest Hooli]

It's no help at all but a mate had a X1/9 years ago & all I know about them is they go sideways forever around wet roundabouts.

[Barry Cade]

It's no help at all but a mate had a X1/9 years ago & all I know about them is they go sideways forever around wet roundabouts.

OOOOOhhhh yes, specially with a turbo in them! Tricky little buggers though, they spin in their own length.

[matty879]

dunno if its the same setup as a 124 spyder,but we had one which had a dicky solenoid,the starter spinning when shorted suggests the earth to the engine is probably good,if you can drop a multimeter to the trigger wire at the solenoid get someone turn the key to check voltage,is a good place to start,sounds like solenoid to me though

[Guest Hooli]

OOOOOhhhh yes, specially with a turbo in them! Tricky little buggers though, they spin in their own length.

 

Graham had the measure of it, it was never pointing where it was going. Couldn't get the seat far enough back for me to be comfy though, odd that as my missus is a few inches shorter than me & I always have to move the seat forward in everything to drive it.

 

If memory serves they made a damn nice noise.

[Barry Cade]

 Couldn't get the seat far enough back for me to be comfy though, odd that as my missus is a few inches shorter than me & I always have to move the seat forward in everything to drive it.

 

Loads of people say that, but I'm 6ft4 and drove from Fife-Stansted non stop with no issues,must be Italian shaped? I did drive them in my socks though..