1963 Rover P4 95 “fueling issues”

[calebaaront]

The old boat is having a rest today seeing as the weather is awful. I’ve used it everyday since Sunday so it’s about time I took the Audi to work. 

[adw1977]

3 hours ago, tooSavvy said:

Didn't someone here have a 'splitter/greaser' widget.... You wind it into the gap twixt leaves + inject grease @nipple...

🤔

🚙💨

https://autoshite.com/topic/60243-1971-mgb-gt-test-drive-achieved-see-page-14/page/4/#findComment-3099138

[Zelandeth]

Meant to mention earlier regarding the headlights etc - if it's helpful I'm pretty sure that I still have the scans I took of the electrical system schematics from when I was hunting gremlins back when I had mine - if you're in need of diagrams let me know and I can dig them out.

[calebaaront]

59 minutes ago, Zelandeth said:

Meant to mention earlier regarding the headlights etc - if it's helpful I'm pretty sure that I still have the scans I took of the electrical system schematics from when I was hunting gremlins back when I had mine - if you're in need of diagrams let me know and I can dig them out.

That would be fantastic! Thank you,

[HMC]

This has got some top notch giffer additions- spark plug caps that light up, and an engine bay mounted vacuum and oil pressure gauge - which iirc were no longer working. but still- epic accessorage!

[HMC]

@Lankytim did a magic job on the paint- it came up really well.

[calebaaront]

1 minute ago, HMC said:

This has got some top notch giffer additions- spark plug caps that light up, and an engine bay mounted vacuum and oil pressure gauge - which iirc were no longer working. but still- epic accessorage!

I haven’t had a proper look yet, I’ve noticed the plug caps but not the pressure guage!! 🤣

[Zelandeth]

1 hour ago, calebaaront said:

That would be fantastic! Thank you,

Hopefully the forum software hasn't mangled that too badly.  If it's not clear enough let me know and I'll stick the original up somewhere for you to download.

[calebaaront]

7 minutes ago, HMC said:

@Lankytim did a magic job on the paint- it came up really well.

I agree! Looks brill, I’m torn between painting the mismatched wing or leaving it as is. 

[calebaaront]

4 minutes ago, Zelandeth said:

Hopefully the forum software hasn't mangled that too badly.  If it's not clear enough let me know and I'll stick the original up somewhere for you to download.

That’s a massive help thank you! Looks readable 🙂

[Zelandeth]

13 minutes ago, calebaaront said:

That’s a massive help thank you! Looks readable 🙂

No worries.  It's actually the 95/110 diagram...not 105.  I remember I labelled it wrong and have been meaning to correct the file name since I scanned it!

Wiring colours don't look too clear on some bits - I'll put a link up to the full size scan when I'm back upstairs after dinner.

[Lankytim]

30 minutes ago, HMC said:

This has got some top notch giffer additions- spark plug caps that light up, and an engine bay mounted vacuum and oil pressure gauge - which iirc were no longer working. but still- epic accessorage!

I took the additional gauges out of the engine bay as they didn’t work and were really shite. I went of a bit of a “de-gifferage” exercise when I was trying to get everything working. Random additional non operational non original equipment was stripped out and binned. 

[ETCHY]

6 hours ago, calebaaront said:

I find this too, even with this one. Especially when trying to park! Not sure if Rover intended for it to be that heavy? 

Perhaps Radial as opposed to Crossply  tyres is what makes the steering so heavy on these nowadays ?

[High Jetter]

Just a note for the P4 botherers, I now have both my parts catalogues for the range here at home now, so looking up any numbers you may need should be fairly swift.

[eddyramrod]

10 hours ago, calebaaront said:

The old boat is having a rest today seeing as the weather is awful. I’ve used it everyday since Sunday so it’s about time I took the Audi to WBAC. 

FTFY

[Zelandeth]

That should be a link to the full size image hosted on ImgBB - if it doesn't work for some reason, here's a link to it.

Wiring colours should be perfectly visible on the original 400dpi scan.  Moreso than the were to the naked eye in the manual as that whole diagram is about 1/4 of a page in size!

[calebaaront]

So I thought I’d take the P4 to the shops this morning, got in and tried to start it…. Nothing. Full choke, half choke and even no choke. The fuel guage was reading 1/4 of a tank so I assumed that was empty so switched the reserve tank on @Lankytim had installed a new fuel tank so I wasn’t concerned about any debris getting sucked into the carb. It fired straight up after I did that. Went and got fuel and switched it back to Main. Still nothing, wouldn’t start at all. So I ran it on reserve and switched it to Main after 2 mins of idling it cut out. Any suggestions? Is there a reset switch? I could run it on reserve for the time being but would prefer to run it normally. 

[IronStar]

Fuel pump for that reservoir? One of the fuel lines split/kinked? 
It ran for two minutes on what was left in the pipes/bowl from reserve one, and starved after it ran out. 

[calebaaront]

5 minutes ago, IronStar said:

Fuel pump for that reservoir? One of the fuel lines split/kinked? 
It ran for two minutes on what was left in the pipes/bowl from reserve one, and starved after it ran out. 

There is a separate pump for the reserve tank I think as I can hear it click when I switch it over. So I’m thinking either the main fuel pump has failed or maybe as you said it’s a split line or kinked line? I can’t smell any fuel or see any though 

[Mr Pastry]

Diagram shows separate fuel pumps for main and reserve with a changeover switch.  Swap the output cables at the switch, and see if that brings the main pump back on.  

[Zelandeth]

These have a "double ended" pump if I remember rightly which combines the separate pumps for main and reserve into a single body.  There is only one tank, the reserve just has a dip tube which sits lower in the tank than the main.  I got caught out by the gauge on mine being a little optimistic as well.  Empty in my case was just below 1/4 a tank.

Most likely problem (assuming power is getting to it) is that there's a bit of crud on the points in the pump - you may find that percussive maintenance gets it running again.

[calebaaront]

So after having a look and tapping it a few times it still doesn’t want to run on the main fuel supply, I did find this switch in the boot. Flipped it back and forth but still nothing. I’ll try having a better look when I have more time. I can only hear the pump click when I switch to reserve so it could possibly be a bad earth somewhere 

[lesapandre]

I think it may have two sets of points. Sounds like one set (main) are stuck. I think (?) they are dismantleable. 

If you intend to keep it I'd get a second pump to swap from time to time as these old pumps can be temperamental after 60 years I recall from running lots old cars from this era.

[lesapandre]

You probably know the P4 stars in the British art house movie from the 80's - 'Radio On'.

 

[jonathan_dyane]

The points are probably dirty, if you look on my P4 thread there are some photos which may be helpful 

 

 

[Lankytim]

I need to rebuild the SU pump on my 100 as it doesn’t do much when power is added. I’ve never worked on one before so I’ll need to do some research, or just replace with one of those cube style pumps that seem to be popular. 
 

@calebaaront this 95 did have occasional starting issues when I first got it, I thought it was flooding and seemed to clear if the car was left for half an hour or so. The issue seemed to disappear with regular use. When I replaced the tank I had a look at the pipe work and couldn’t figure out how the reserve fuel thing could work, the pick up pipe just goes up into the pump so I don’t know where the “reserve” fuel comes from. I assumed it was a feature that had been deleted over the years. 

[Zelandeth]

24 minutes ago, Lankytim said:

I need to rebuild the SU pump on my 100 as it doesn’t do much when power is added. I’ve never worked on one before so I’ll need to do some research, or just replace with one of those cube style pumps that seem to be popular. 
 

@calebaaront this 95 did have occasional starting issues when I first got it, I thought it was flooding and seemed to clear if the car was left for half an hour or so. The issue seemed to disappear with regular use. When I replaced the tank I had a look at the pipe work and couldn’t figure out how the reserve fuel thing could work, the pick up pipe just goes up into the pump so I don’t know where the “reserve” fuel comes from. I assumed it was a feature that had been deleted over the years. 

I'd vote for cleaning up and if necessary rebuilding the original pump.  The ones Rover used on these are really good quality and with some TLC are likely to be far more reliable than any modern tat.  Especially as you've always essentially got a backup because there are two.

It is good practice to run the reserve pump once a month or so to ensure it's not gummed up if you need it.

Fuel system on these cars really was over engineered, the complete lack of rubber hoses really surprised me - all either metal or nylon.  

[High Jetter]

1 hour ago, Zelandeth said:

I'd vote for cleaning up and if necessary rebuilding the original pump.  The ones Rover used on these are really good quality and with some TLC are likely to be far more reliable than any modern tat.  Especially as you've always essentially got a backup because there are two.

It is good practice to run the reserve pump once a month or so to ensure it's not gummed up if you need it.

Fuel system on these cars really was over engineered, the complete lack of rubber hoses really surprised me - all either metal or nylon.  

Yup, mend & make do, old kit is the best

[calebaaront]

Thank you all for your replies/suggestions. When I get a spare 5 mins I’ll take the pump out and give it a clean and see if I can mend it. I’m now leaning towards it being the main set of points being stuck. I’ve taken it to work today and it drove absolutely faultlessly on the reserve line.