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Jaguar S Bype R. Sat since 2016- because there are no* problems with it M8.


Crispian_J_Hotson
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Guy is a legend. With diagnose Dan, we can diagnose it together! Lolz.

That fella reminds me to not jump to conclusions by convincing myself that I've discovered the issue, which is actually the hidden parts cannon.

One of my favourite shows was the faulty new Bosch sensor on the berlingo I think.

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I reluctantly got under the car yesterday because it was freezing but I was around there anyway fitting a missing archliner. I closely looked at the O2 system on both Cats. Bank 2 with the sparkplug was found to have an downstream sensor fitted! This has been modified for some reason by creating an O2 opening underside of the Cat and blanking off the original hole. See exhibit A.

Exhibit A.

IMG_20230121_145718124.thumb.jpg.26b8f9675d0ae35be6c840f8f23bcb38.jpg

What trickery is this?

I would assume that if one couldn't access a bad sensor or the replacement part was too big to fit in the space, then the Cat would be dropped and the sensor removed/ fitted or changed for a different dimension one. It has also been poorly spaced out with bits of metal. Is this to alter the readings somehow? It seems that quite a bit of effort has gone into this bodge and it would be useful to establish the reason to perform it.

As for the wiring, underneath it appears that nothing has been messed with. All the wires correspond to the correct sensors and the plugs for each stream cannot be swapped over because they won't plug in due to the plug guides being different. So I now have to trace this wiring back to the ECU and see if I encounter any 'modifications' along the way. This will be quite expensive to put right so correct diagnosing is essential which is going to take a bit of time. 

Luckily, the car is the gift that keeps on giving, and whist shuffling around the broken bits of front air intakes behind the bumper, gold was deposited:

IMG_20230121_143613140.thumb.jpg.6ffc0e3faac044cdaf142ec221d7e03b.jpg

This confirms that the people let loose on the car are all show and no go. 

On to better things, the NS front wheel was removed for the first time which revealed fairly recent brakes had been fitted, of course these were checked that they had been installed right and I could change the fuel filter which is located in the inner arch. More cable ties and broken clips were found here allowing fuel pipes to contact each other and rub on other things. This was all sorted out, additionally where the arch liner had been missing, it had caused crap to build up in all the awkward crevices and the panel edges to start to rust. 

I dealt with this by using my special formula for keeping rust at bay and cleaning the well up.

IMG_20230121_124451999.thumb.jpg.02e4ac3bd48672c64fb62dc58390437d.jpg

IMG_20230121_124458798.thumb.jpg.632b41a483f8238968a5275f98b4d4db.jpg

I also cleaned and protected any earth points and cleaned up, lubed, and protected any exposed threads which may need to come out in the future. All in all, the front suspension does not appear to be in bad shape despite many of the main parts being original. The back suspension suffers way more on these cars.

Then I beat back any arch lip damage that had been done by whoever forced out the original liner and bent it. The replacement liner could easily be fitted if you know how, and new fixings used to retain it.

IMG_20230121_134951159.thumb.jpg.bec84fb3f2bbec9ecf7d26b35694733e.jpg

I have no idea why the image is black and white, I was using the phone with gloves on so probably hit a setting somewhere. Note that it's jacked up on the bottom arm, don't do this unless like me you are replacing the bush. I do this to get the car up a few inches and then throw another jack under the chassis leg as it's too low to do it any other way.

I'm happy that this corner is complete at least and there's piece of mind that there's nothing untoward going on there now. The car was then put back together and served up on the frosty road, no fault appeared either.

I've ordered a small puller tool to get the passenger wiper arm off, these cars are notorious for sticking arms. They need to come off so that I can check and inevitably unblock all the drains and also change the pollen filter. There's something going on with the wiper linkage as well as it is not that secure, causing the drivers arm to contact the bonnet. I got the drivers wiper off but the passenger one is having none of it. Until I can get the scuttle cover off, i can't do sod all with it.

Onwards and upwards!

 

 

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22 hours ago, Crispian_J_Hotson said:

It has also been poorly spaced out with bits of metal. Is this to alter the readings somehow?

I seem to recall a 'popular' mod recommended for Subaru units where the fault code implicated a dodgy downstream lambda sensor - it involved fitting a spacer collar to hold the sensor out of the exhaust stream, and so convince the EML light not to come on.

Could be summat similar happening here?

22 hours ago, Crispian_J_Hotson said:

There's something going on with the wiper linkage as well as it is not that secure, causing the drivers arm to contact the bonnet.

Cog Sr's brand-new Alfa GT did that as well - the supplying dealer just shrugged and said they all did that from the factory, or rhd examples did anyway.

Looking at other examples over the years seems to indicate that this is true.

If there's no obvious slack in the linkage, I'd try cleaning up the bonnet edge and adding a sliver of silver tape to mitigate further rubbing.

As ever, fair play for all your sleuthing here - let's hope it becomes easier from here on in and your patience is rewarded!

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29 minutes ago, colino said:

I've never known an S Type where the drivers side wiper arm didn't hit the bonnet; probably why there is a brisk trade in second hand linkages and motors.

In fairness, my diesel and black ones are fine. I think someone has tried to get these off and broke something whist hanging off them. The arms hit the bonnet when people try to replace the wiper blades as they do not rise up in the traditional sense. It's a shit set up.

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11 minutes ago, Datsuncog said:

I seem to recall a 'popular' mod recommended for Subaru units where the fault code implicated a dodgy downstream lambda sensor involved fitting a spacer collar to hold the sensor out of the exhaust stream, and so convince the EML light not to come on.

Could be summat similar happening here?

 

It's definitely been 'spaced' by using all the available crap they could find under their toolboxes.

IMG_20230121_145740354.thumb.jpg.feb457c2372cdef70c28f887621d6a91.jpg

I imagine spacing it would make it contact the gearbox in the proper position, this could explain the relocation? 

The whole wiper mounting is loose or slack, no play in the mechanism... this isn't normal and feels broken.

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  • Crispian_J_Hotson changed the title to Jaguar S Bype R. Sat since 2016- because there are no* problems with it M8.

Further research points at this car requiring new Catalytic converters, sensors and some repairs to wiring. If I was to 'get by' then I'd take a chance on an upstream sensor replacement and 1 new Cat, but I want to see it done properly so the two options for me to decide is to bin the entire exhaust and get a Powerflow or something similar or install two Magnaflow high flow Cats and all new sensors. I'm looking at pricing but it's not on the priority list, the car is running and the fault is intermittent, plus it's not being used for much at the moment.

What is priority is sorting the rear bushes. The company supplying them failed to deliver and I requested a refund today. It's frustrating as I've a bit of time to spend on the car right now, not so much next month, so fingers crossed that I get refunded soon and buy bushes direct from the supplier for another £30 on top, and get them delivered asap, but it is what it is.

The priority after that is Tyres. It has deathrings on the front and 10 year old pilots on the back which have seen a bit of action with kerbstones. They all need to go and this is around a £750 bill. With an alignment, we're over £800 all in. Once done though, they'll see the best part of 2 years if I avoid all the screws, potholes, old ladies, and other shite laying in the road.

Today I spent a couple of hours sorting the shed out. It gets really untidy and blocked up very quickly. Doing all these little jobs and bits and pieces in the cold and dark usually resulted in me just chucking stuff in there and going in for me tea... until I could bear it no more.

What I did find was the old Mechatronics out of the gearbox still hanging around, so for your interest, this is what it looks like.

IMG_20230123_162301223.thumb.jpg.0db6d6aa555b8aa3e176065db4deee5a.jpg

The TCM is pretty much all the black plastic bit which includes two built in turbine speed sensors and the shift sensor, the latter being my issue and is seen being the beige coloured plastic on the left. Here is a closer image of it.

IMG_20230123_162318596.thumb.jpg.c587cb13a92725a469131f96830ee99a.jpg

This slidey bit of plastic is moved by the metal rod via the shift linkage which comes from a cable in the car and it tells the TCM what you have selected. This one has a hard time doing that and produced code P0705. They are known to have been swapped out, but it's a bit of messing around drilling rivets, cutting ribbon like connections and soldering in the replacement. It doesn't look or sound like the most reliable way of doing it.

Here is the underside and the bit you see with the sump removed.

IMG_20230123_162348615.thumb.jpg.9d1ee015b41ad3d8e56bc003a3d2d864.jpg

Those blue and yellow cylinders are the shift solenoids with can also go bad. As far as diagnostics can tell, these are ok so are kept for spares. There are several bolts to undo to get this out which are slightly larger than those you can see left in. You can only take those out, touch these and you'll split the valve block seal which I can imagine, is not fun.

This thing is thrown in all s type boxes from around 2002 onwards, as well as many other makes.

Whist I was at it, I cut open the old engine oil filter to look for crap, and it was dirty but there was no nasty bits. I cut the fuel filter open too. I was a little surprised at what I saw.

IMG_20230123_125233751.thumb.jpg.30054d0565635d15efa9ea876208de4e.jpg

Don't mind the metal shavings, I took a saw to it, what surprised me was the way in which the grey rubber had started to break up. Not so bad if the bulk of it was before filtration but I found some after too.

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And you can tell that by looking into the hole in the middle. There was actually a fragment in there. This was a Wix filter.

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I cannot tell how long it's been in there and have to assume it's longer than 6 years. It's a good reminder to change your filters gents. I now need to have a look at the fuel system after filtration and check none of this rubber crap has made it through. Great.

 

 

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Love this thread with all sorts of technical stuff I don't understand and never will but like reading.

What size tyres does it need? £800 seems expensive, I've just had four new Michelin PS5  225/40/18 fitted for about £500. I need to get the alignment done still, but £50 should sort it.

Anyway carry on with the baffling but interesting work!

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The rears are awkward. To get a set of 4 matching limits the choices. Most make the fronts, not so much on the rears. There are cheaper options, but I don't want to go there.

245/40 18 Fronts

275/35 18 Bastard rears

I need to find the most cost effective way of getting pilots yet and as I understand, the Pilot 4 is out and New Pilot 5 is currently being introduced, so I may end up with a mix of 4's and 5's which is no big deal.

The place I get the 4 wheel alignment done has some nice kit and they persist, and get it right. I used to do this crap so know what their mark up is and they know I know, but they get it done first time, so I stick with that despite it costing £60 more than it should do!

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11 hours ago, Crispian_J_Hotson said:

What I did find was the old Mechatronics out of the gearbox still hanging around, so for your interest, this is what it looks like.

IMG_20230123_162301223.thumb.jpg.0db6d6aa555b8aa3e176065db4deee5a.jpg

The TCM is pretty much all the black plastic bit which includes two built in turbine speed sensors and the shift sensor

IMG_20230123_162348615.thumb.jpg.9d1ee015b41ad3d8e56bc003a3d2d864.jpg

 

I've just read this whole thread in a couple of sittings.

I can't remember exactly when I formed a mental image of hell. It was the stereotypical furnace of fire guarded by an unpleasant chap with a fake smile holding a pitchfork though. 

However, I reckon it's time to update that mental image and replace it with the vision of the internals of your autobox. In fact, in the corner of my mental image I spy your S Type parked up with wonky wipers and rear wheel akimbo. It's purring like a kitten cat though, just for that deceptive sense of security. 

Cap doffed multiple times to you for sticking with this ungrateful cat. The reading's both fascinating and horrifying in equal measure. You are winning though - just remember that. The old girl will run out of toys to throw out of the pram soon enough. 

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Cor, all my recent orders turned up at once today, except one and I'll get onto that later.

The O2 sensor sockets, the supercharger oil kit and the cutest little puller that I've ever seen, so I've called it Brian. This will get that pesky wiper off.

What didn't turn up was the rear poly bushes and that's because they never ordered them and never told me. So I've been chasing my tail with it. I got notification of a refund today which means once that is in my bottomless pit of a bank account, I will go direct to Powerflex and pay the full price. I took a gamble and lost this time.

GB Enterprises Performance Engine Solutions- get in the sea.

I'm going to have to hit the car hard tomorrow as now I have the:

  • Fuel supply to look at for debris from the fuel filter that shat itself.
  • Supercharger oil to change- recommended at 40,000 miles, not lifetime. This won't have ever been done. Once that's done, it'll grenade itself.
  • Bulkhead drains to clear and wiper mounting to 'fix', whatever that issue is, and a pollen filter to stick in.

I may be called back to site, yeah, actual work next week, which on one hand will cut the bush fitment plans really tight but on the other, will allow for gathering cash to give to Michelin.

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7 minutes ago, Crispian_J_Hotson said:

Cor, all my recent orders turned up at once today, except one and I'll get onto that later.

The O2 sensor sockets, the supercharger oil kit and the cutest little puller that I've ever seen, so I've called it Brian. This will get that pesky wiper off.

What didn't turn up was the rear poly bushes and that's because they never ordered them and never told me. So I've been chasing my tail with it. I got notification of a refund today which means once that is in my bottomless pit of a bank account, I will go direct to Powerflex and pay the full price. I took a gamble and lost this time.

GB Enterprises Performance Engine Solutions- get in the sea.

I'm going to have to hit the car hard tomorrow as now I have the:

  • Fuel supply to look at for debris from the fuel filter that shat itself.
  • Supercharger oil to change- recommended at 40,000 miles, not lifetime. This won't have ever been done. Once that's done, it'll grenade itself.
  • Bulkhead drains to clear and wiper mounting to 'fix', whatever that issue is, and a pollen filter to stick in.

I may be called back to site, yeah, actual work next week, which on one hand will cut the bush fitment plans really tight but on the other, will allow for gathering cash to give to Michelin.

Bon chance, mon ami. 

The good news is that the weather is climbing to a balmy* 7¬įC tomorrow, so by the time you've sweated blood removing those wipers with Brian, you should be toasty warm.

(I also have a Brian, which has a 100% success rate on 2 (two) wiper arms)

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God, this cold is tragic. It's not so much the air, it's the ground. I'm layering up my socks, I think I'm on the 27th layer right now. It's a sod to get them all off but man, I'm like 7 inches taller!

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I think this thread is great because all of us have punted somewhere between a few hundred and a few thousand on some sexheap pretty much or entirely unseen.

Many of us have gotten away with it by finding that truly, only minor tlc was needed, or it wasn't as bad as it could be.

Statistically someone has to get guts deep in a brokened autobox and send Michelin the GDP of a small country for a pair of rear tyres that happen to be the same size as a McLaren F1 and this time it's you.

So we're with you because we all know how close we've been to SBYPEAGEDDON ourselves.

Chodspeed sir.

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Great read, like @Dave_Q says we've all been there to some extent or another but you seem to have taken a fair old bite out of the sprotsbarge pie and I commend you for it. I have had some involvement with a ZF 6HP and I don't yearn for any more, you got lucky with your repair on it at least. Well done, 11/10 etc and good luck, I hope you are rewarded with a reasonable period of time to enjoy it once it's mostly fixed before it breaks again.

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4 hours ago, Dave_Q said:

I think this thread is great because all of us have punted somewhere between a few hundred and a few thousand on some sexheap pretty much or entirely unseen.

Many of us have gotten away with it by finding that truly, only minor tlc was needed, or it wasn't as bad as it could be.

Statistically someone has to get guts deep in a brokened autobox and send Michelin the GDP of a small country for a pair of rear tyres that happen to be the same size as a McLaren F1 and this time it's you.

So we're with you because we all know how close we've been to SBYPEAGEDDON ourselves.

Chodspeed sir.

Yeah, I knew it was going to be an arsehole so was pretty prepared. The bullshit with the sayle was the worst bit and I didn't expect any of that.

I gotta admit though, it's been coming thick and fast but then I've been looking for it and it just makes me more determined to put it right. But I'll end up with a well sorted motah that I've wanted for a long time and to be honest, thought I'd missed the boat on. Currently hanging off the back of said boat, and trying to clamber on. 

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