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dieselnutjob

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I always do whatever I want with my cars and I couldn't give a monkeys what anybody thinks about it.If it gives some people pleasure to preserve them as close as possible to original then good for them, but that shouldn't have any bearing on how I chose to own/enjoy different ones!With a fair number of "originality freaks" in the world, it suprises me that more of them don't club together to preserve a collection of vehicles that it isn't practical for them to own as individuals, if that's what tickles their fancy - a bit like railway enthusiasts do with steam engines!

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Right, here goes........................If it's done safely, I'm fully in favour in modding the Bejasus out of anything, just to hack off the purists. I've had a few "unusually" modified cars, most of which people have liked and admired, APART from the anally retentive twonks who slag it off because "it's not original". These are the same oily fingered retards who drive aound in poo brown Austin Somersets, with 40 year old crossplies , arthritic reconned lever arm shockers, and appalling brakes, because "that's how they were originally"Yes they were and the were a pile of crap then..........I once owned a sit up and beg Pop, with a 455 cu.in Buick big block, Viva front end and Jag irs.....I bought it off the bloke who had built it, who rescued it from a scrap yard, and offered it to the owners club.....for nothing. He got pissed about by so many tossers wasting his time, that he decided to make it as offensive to the purists as he possibly could,,,[painting it purple and lime green helped]

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Right, here goes........................If it's done safely, I'm fully in favour in modding the Bejasus out of anything, just to hack off the purists. I've had a few "unusually" modified cars, most of which people have liked and admired, APART from the anally retentive twonks who slag it off because "it's not original". These are the same oily fingered retards who drive aound in poo brown Austin Somersets, with 40 year old crossplies , arthritic reconned lever arm shockers, and appalling brakes, because "that's how they were originally"

Not to offend any of the Brit car lovers but a lot of older British cars are pure crap IMO and just shouldn't be on the road as they were built. A good deal of French, Italian and German cars of that era really could be restored to original condition and would be pretty much drivable as daily drivers these days. Safety should always come first IMHO and like you say a lot of those "original" cars are just crap. My 504 would run rings around a lot of these cars even if it did have metallic green wings, bonnet and front panels on a beige car :lol:

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I have found with the classic Landy crowd that most folk who are really vocal/abusive when it comes to mods either -A) don't own one at all, B) have one but in bits with zero chance of completion as they are a mechanical mong, or C) have one but NEVER drive it. I use the 165 mile trip to my mum's as the acid test, if a car I own cannot do that trip (as a bare minimum) safely without breaking down or leaving me in pain then I will repair or modify it until it does.

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504GL - there's no bias showing through is there? :lol::lol::lol:

Not at all! :lol: But you have to admit that if you look crap cars up in the dictionary there will be a lot of British cars there. To be fair when it came to the 80's built quality was more of a problem and things like brakes and suspension were better sorted. I think Mr Scruff's quite right, if it can't do a long trip like that without breaking or just being plain unsafe then it's a rubbish car. Now personally I'd rather just buy something that's up to it in the first place than modifying it to get it up to the task but that's just me. My 504 coped with a lot of abuse from me in its time and it had no breakages/failures to speak of apart from a starter motor and a loose nut on the front lower suspension arm but because of the way it was designed the nut couldn't come off unless the suspension was at full droop.You are right though, I do have a case of auto-xenophobia :D

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When I drive the Triumph, I like to wear:Triumph baseball capTriumph bomber jacketBelt with Triumph logoTriumph driving gloves.Gets the ladies 'hot'.

I thought the ladies were 'hot' because you always had the heater on to keep cooling the engine down? :P

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Not to offend any of the Brit car lovers but a lot of older British cars are pure crap IMO and just shouldn't be on the road as they were built. A good deal of French, Italian and German cars of that era really could be restored to original condition and would be pretty much drivable as daily drivers these days.

Can't really comment on other British classics as I've never owned one but I'm surprised by how easy my German made 02 is to live with.For a 35 year old car it has lots of mod-cons like cigarette lighter, Intermittent wipers, parking lights and heated rear window.You could easily use it for everyday live if you don't do many miles although i wouldn't fancy using it so much during the winter.

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Right, here goes........................If it's done safely, I'm fully in favour in modding the Bejasus out of anything, just to hack off the purists. I've had a few "unusually" modified cars, most of which people have liked and admired, APART from the anally retentive twonks who slag it off because "it's not original". These are the same oily fingered retards who drive aound in poo brown Austin Somersets, with 40 year old crossplies , arthritic reconned lever arm shockers, and appalling brakes, because "that's how they were originally"

Not to offend any of the Brit car lovers but a lot of older British cars are pure crap IMO and just shouldn't be on the road as they were built. A good deal of French, Italian and German cars of that era really could be restored to original condition and would be pretty much drivable as daily drivers these days. Safety should always come first IMHO and like you say a lot of those "original" cars are just crap. My 504 would run rings around a lot of these cars even if it did have metallic green wings, bonnet and front panels on a beige car :lol:
Yo 504, you wanna listen to yourself, you're coming out with some right old tripe! Liking one car over another is one thing, but you're taking it to another level there.

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Right, here goes........................If it's done safely, I'm fully in favour in modding the Bejasus out of anything, just to hack off the purists. I've had a few "unusually" modified cars, most of which people have liked and admired, APART from the anally retentive twonks who slag it off because "it's not original". These are the same oily fingered retards who drive aound in poo brown Austin Somersets, with 40 year old crossplies , arthritic reconned lever arm shockers, and appalling brakes, because "that's how they were originally"

Not to offend any of the Brit car lovers but a lot of older British cars are pure crap IMO and just shouldn't be on the road as they were built. A good deal of French, Italian and German cars of that era really could be restored to original condition and would be pretty much drivable as daily drivers these days. Safety should always come first IMHO and like you say a lot of those "original" cars are just crap. My 504 would run rings around a lot of these cars even if it did have metallic green wings, bonnet and front panels on a beige car :lol:
Yo 504, you wanna listen to yourself, you're coming out with some right old tripe! Liking one car over another is one thing, but you're taking it to another level there.
Ah come on. Have you driven one? I'm only relaying my experience of what I found to be a rather decent car :) Sure there are far better cars around from that era but the 504 can still be driven as a daily driver with no issues and like I said there are a lot of cars that aren't as good from that era. Please don't think I'm some kind of Comical Ali figure spreading my 504 doctrine :lol: The streets of Britain will run with the oil and coolant of a million badly designed 60's and 70's British cars! The 504 will slaughter you all! :lol: etc etcSomeone can come and humanely euthanise me when I start saying things like that :shock:

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I use the 165 mile trip to my mum's as the acid test, if a car I own cannot do that trip (as a bare minimum) safely without breaking down or leaving me in pain then I will repair or modify it until it does.

Like it. An ideal benchmark.I personally like seeing rare cars in their originality but the truth is, there are actually quite a few 604s and your mods are hardly 'rip out the motor, lob in a V8 and Jag IRS' are they? I'm not a fan of huge mods, though I sometimes see stuff on RR and feel the need to bow in a 'we're not worthy' kind of way when you see what some people can do given half a chance. I'm not a stickler for strict originality either though. Any twat who boasts that his car is so original that it still has the original tyres should be shot. My 2CV has points-assisted ignition, bull bars and is missing a coachline or two. In fact, 2CVs are a good example as you'll rarely see two that are exactly the same. They all 'develop' overtime, and that's one of the things I love about the 2CV crowd. Makes the completely original timewarp ones all the more special.Blanket slagging off of Brit tin seems a bit daft though. My wife's Mini is perfectly safe and surprisingly capable.

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I think the modification thing can go two ways, there's the owner who buys the car he's always wanted, improves it to make it more useable, 5 speed box is gr8 for not ragging the nuts off it on motorways, modern dampers save getting wrapped around lamp posts, etc. this guy will usually keep the car for a very long time.Then there's the dickheads who are trying to impress, these cars at best are merely laughable, at worst deathtraps, slammed, rammed, jammed bro', their cars are beyond salvation, we see many of them on ebay, usually with comically illiterate description.One thought, if the Peugeot in question way back at the start of this were to be offered up for sale, however rare it may be, the sad fact is that it would probably struggle to fetch a tenth of what it is worth to its owner. This rarity and low price make it very attractive to banger fags.Should this discussion lead to the formation of an extreme right guerilla movement with the objective of seizing control in order to police the modification of old smokers, might I offer my services. I want to be kommandant inspector of sherpa coupes, just give me an air ratchet and a luger, I'll check for hardened valve seats, 'Verboten mod, for you Tommy ze restore is over' off to the deathcamp flatcap.

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Most [and I repeat most] of the "family motoring" stuff coming out of British factories in the 50's / 60's was out of date before it reached the showroom. Drive a Peugeot 404, then drive an Austin Cambridge, and you'll see exactly what I mean. In the 70's it wasn't so much out of date, as [with the possible exception of Ford] disasterously compromised, or completely woeful in build quality. The original Allegro design is almost completely unrecognisable from the car that came out of the factory, theStag was saddled with an engine design that was heroically crap, the TR7 was the right car for the wrong market,...........I could go on.With a few notable exceptions, most post war British cars were either badly designed, badly built, or a combination of both.The British motor industry was ruined by a conglomeration of arrogant, short sighted ego maniacs [Lord Stokes and his ilk] who thought that "they knew best", and new fangled johnny foreigner ideas had no place in Britain. When they did swallow a brave pill, and commision stuff like the Mini, not one of them had the brains to make sure it was either costed, or R&D'd properly.

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Blanket slagging off of Brit tin seems a bit daft though. My wife's Mini is perfectly safe and surprisingly capable.

Didn't say all british tin ;) Just a lot of it. You admit that they made some crap cars here and I'll admit that the French have made their fair share of mistakes and just generally bad cars :P I like things like Escorts, Capri's, Early Cortina's and the like because they were just decent cars full stop. Mini's are decent as well.

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Ah yeah, my particular choice of classic car is frankly vastly superior to most others, its got this feature and that feature which clearly shows it operates on a higher plane than pretty much all other cars built in the same time period and featuring similar technology. In fact, i tend to think this reflects my own superiority in being able to see these benefits, while other struggle with inferior products of which they cannot see the (obvious to me) inherent non-specific crapness.

Any suggestion that there is a link between nationality and 'crapness' of a vehcle is purely xenophobic and entirely without any basis whatsoever, unless you're comparing the latest Audi A4 with some Iranian licence-built 1960's motor.

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Most [and I repeat most] of the "family motoring" stuff coming out of British factories in the 50's / 60's was out of date before it reached the showroom. Drive a Peugeot 404, then drive an Austin Cambridge, and you'll see exactly what I mean. In the 70's it wasn't so much out of date, as [with the possible exception of Ford] disasterously compromised, or completely woeful in build quality. The original Allegro design is almost completely unrecognisable from the originally designed car, theStag was saddled with an engine design that was heroically crap, the TR7 was the right car for the wrong market,...........I could go on.With a few notable exceptions, most post war British cars were either badly designed, badly built, or a combination of both.

Zut alor! Ze calvary she az arrived!That's pretty much what I mean.

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Ah yeah, my particular choice of classic car is frankly vastly superior to most others, its got this feature and that feature which clearly shows it operates on a higher plane than pretty much all other cars built in the same time period and featuring similar technology. In fact, i tend to think this reflects my own superiority in being able to see these benefits, while other struggle with inferior products of which they cannot see the (obvious to me) inherent non-specific crapness.

LOLZERZ!! :lol::lol: That so perfectly sums up an attitude I unfortunately see so much of.

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Ah yeah, my particular choice of classic car is frankly vastly superior to most others, its got this feature and that feature which clearly shows it operates on a higher plane than pretty much all other cars built in the same time period and featuring similar technology. In fact, i tend to think this reflects my own superiority in being able to see these benefits, while other struggle with inferior products of which they cannot see the (obvious to me) inherent non-specific crapness.

Any suggestion that there is a link between nationality and 'crapness' of a vehcle is purely xenophobic and entirely without any basis whatsoever, unless you're comparing the latest Audi A4 with some Iranian licence-built 1960's motor.
Mr B I think your editing of my quote is pretty unfair. I don't even own a 504 anymore. I have Fiat 500 with the bottom of the range engine and suspension which wants to chuck you off the road at mere sight of a bump. All I'm relaying is my experiences and my opinions as I see them. I'm not on here to try and offend anyone intentionally. There are good reasons why the British motor industry pretty much doesn't exist anymore aside from a few foreign owned companies which produce cars here and Morgan. Accusing me of being xenophobic is a bit strange and perhaps even a little PC. Surely we can recognise that cars of a different nationality tend to have different characteristics? Modern German cars are as hard as a rock in terms of suspension, the French are a bit more softly sprung and the Italians still haven't realised that you need to match the dampers and springs together.

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I think the modification thing can go two ways, there's the owner who buys the car he's always wanted, improves it to make it more useable, 5 speed box is gr8 for not ragging the nuts off it on motorways, modern dampers save getting wrapped around lamp posts, etc. this guy will usually keep the car for a very long time.Then there's the dickheads who are trying to impress, these cars at best are merely laughable, at worst deathtraps, slammed, rammed, jammed bro', their cars are beyond salvation, we see many of them on ebay, usually with comically illiterate description.One thought, if the Peugeot in question way back at the start of this were to be offered up for sale, however rare it may be, the sad fact is that it would probably struggle to fetch a tenth of what it is worth to its owner. This rarity and low price make it very attractive to banger fags.Should this discussion lead to the formation of an extreme right guerilla movement with the objective of seizing control in order to police the modification of old smokers, might I offer my services. I want to be kommandant inspector of sherpa coupes, just give me an air ratchet and a luger, I'll check for hardened valve seats, 'Verboten mod, for you Tommy ze restore is over' off to the deathcamp flatcap.

In the midst of all the seriousness this did make me laugh somewhat. If you get to be a Commandant type figure I will want to be a sort of Allo Allo type person with onions around my neck and a crappy accent which thinly disguises the fact that I am indeed Australian.

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Most post war British built stuff is shite....which is why we quite like them. Foreign built stuff of the same era has the added bonus of shiteness with a touch of zaniness/idiocy/brilliance [delete where applicable] which is why they're even better. If I could find one, I'd have a 404 / Renner 16 / 20 /30 Fiat 131 etc in a heartbeat, just because it would still be a perfectly capable mode of transport. Nothing British Leyland built in the same era would give me enough confidence to make it out of the end of my road without something falling off/disolving/exploding [again, delete where applicable...........]

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I'm just sat here now wondering what some people will think when I start modifying a exceptionally rare, well engineered and highly regarded German classic. :D 504, nice to see you don't think all British cars are crap, just I suppose all of half of them - that is to say the ones you dislike.

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I'm just sat here now wondering what some people will think when I start modifying a exceptionally rare, well engineered and highly regarded German classic. :D 504, nice to see you don't think all British cars are crap, just I suppose all of half of them - that is to say the ones you dislike.

Just hope that you don't find out like my dad did, that the front and rear of your 2002 weren't originally together. That was a modification my dad could have done without!

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there are actually quite a few 604

I thought one of the mags had highlighted the 604 as being in very short supply - if there are plenty that's great.
Well, I've seen quite a few for sale in the last six months, so there's more than one left. I really don't see the problem with someone modifying his regular driver though. I'd rather see a lightly-modded classic in regular use than a polished trinket just sitting in a garage gathering dust.

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504GL - there's no bias showing through is there? :lol::lol::lol:

I think Mr Scruff's quite right, if it can't do a long trip like that without breaking or just being plain unsafe then it's a rubbish car. Now personally I'd rather just buy something that's up to it in the first place than modifying it to get it up to the task but that's just me. My 504 coped with a lot of abuse from me in its time and it had no breakages/failures to speak of apart from a starter motor and a loose nut on the front lower suspension arm but because of the way it was designed the nut couldn't come off unless the suspension was at full droop.
Thanks, but I think you are missing the point (or I didn't make it well enough). Pretty much every car built since WW2 should be able to do a long trip without breaking down or killing you in the process, regardless of which country it was built in. If it can't, then fuggin fix it!! This is a personal bugbear of mine - when we got our Mini someone said "oooh, you don't want one of those, mine was forever breaking down!" When questioned about servicing it turned out it never got touched. As regards to modifying then I'll do things which make it more comfortable and/or reliable - radials, overdrive, electronic ignition. My take on engine swaps is as long as it is 'in character' or done in such a way that it is reversible then brilliant - especially if it allows the owner to keep the thing on the road. I could not afford to daily my LR (a bit different I know as there are shit loads of them left) with the "original" petrol donk and I wouldn't want to either. I can think of several excellent older daily drives which just keep on going with a bit of TLC now-and-then, only one of them is French and that's our pal dollywobbler's 2CV.

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504GL - there's no bias showing through is there? :lol::lol::lol:

I think Mr Scruff's quite right, if it can't do a long trip like that without breaking or just being plain unsafe then it's a rubbish car. Now personally I'd rather just buy something that's up to it in the first place than modifying it to get it up to the task but that's just me. My 504 coped with a lot of abuse from me in its time and it had no breakages/failures to speak of apart from a starter motor and a loose nut on the front lower suspension arm but because of the way it was designed the nut couldn't come off unless the suspension was at full droop.
Thanks, but I think you are missing the point (or I didn't make it well enough). Pretty much every car built since WW2 should be able to do a long trip without breaking down or killing you in the process, regardless of which country it was built in. If it can't, then fuggin fix it!! This is a personal bugbear of mine - when we got our Mini someone said "oooh, you don't want one of those, mine was forever breaking down!" When questioned about servicing it turned out it never got touched. As regards to modifying then I'll do things which make it more comfortable and/or reliable - radials, overdrive, electronic ignition. My take on engine swaps is as long as it is 'in character' or done in such a way that it is reversible then brilliant - especially if it allows the owner to keep the thing on the road. I could not afford to daily my LR (a bit different I know as there are shit loads of them left) with the "original" petrol donk and I wouldn't want to either. I can think of several excellent older daily drives which just keep on going with a bit of TLC now-and-then, only one of them is French and that's our pal dollywobbler's 2CV.
I know exactly what you mean :) All I'm saying is that there are some cars which are better than others.Perhaps you've got a point about servicing. I think a lot of people just don't bother to service their cars as the manufactuers specify and then complain about them being unreliable :roll:Anyway I really have had enough and I'd like to publicly state that all Britist cars are excellent, reliable and superior to anything the continent has ever made and can't think why the British motor industry went through a rapid decline and then pretty much died off. Sherpa coupe's are excellent.

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Dammit. This is normally where I get all shouty, but this thread has been fun to read the last couple of pages of.Just to chuck a bit of four star on, I'll add my bit.I love some old British cars. Rover P4s,P5s, P6s, SD1s, XJs, Range Rovers, Dolly Sprints, TR6s, 2500PIs, Scimitars, Loti, Ginettas, 60's Jags, Aston Martins, Minis, Rolls Royce and Bentleys, loads of pre-BL stuff, I even like MG Magnettes. I'm not a fan of the majority of BL dross - but I still like loads of the 70's Jaguar-Rover-Triumph stuff. Sherpa Coupés and Dropheads I can do without, but I like MG Midgets and Sprites.I also love 60's/70's/80's Foreign stuff. Old Alfas, Renaults, Lancias, Fiats, Audis, VWs (well, I like the Microbus), Peugeots, Tatras, Fords especially, RWD Opels and Vauxhalls, Skodas, Wartburgs, Barkas, Bitters.Jap stuff doesn't tend to interest me at all much. Love Subarus, quite like late '90s Galants, l appreciate Honda engineering, like Datsun 240/260Zs, Toyota Crowns for some reason - and 260/280Cs, MX5s, RX7s, Whizzkids, but they don't make me want to buy them.Some yank stuff amuses me greatly. I drove a '70 Cadillac Fleetwood across the states back in '92. That was epic, and the car was 100% reliable even though it'd only got 6000 miles on the clock. Had a manically underpowered '73 Chevy Malibu for a while, also had a mental 76 Oldsmobile with a tuned 455 and waterbed suspension. I like 'Smokey and the Bandit' Trans-Am (even the Jim Rockford one floats my boat).Modify any of these well, and I'm happy, but I like performance / reliability mods more than 'looks' mods. I like Minilites on the right cars. I like to open bonnets and see huge V8s crammed in, but it's got to be done to look factory or better. Don't like scruffy transplants. Don't like modern turbodiesel engines fitted to old cars as I think a lot of a cars 'personality' is in the engine and the way the engine responds and sounds - shoving a Mondeo TD lump in a car that should have a 3.0 V6 is a flogging offence in my book (yes, I mean you ;) ).As for the 604, if you want to sell it, I'll buy it if the price is right. I've wanted a 604 for years.

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