Manchester clean air zone May 2022

[New POD]

8 minutes ago, Ghosty said:

I don't mind paying for the M6 toll on the grounds I'm paying not to use a smart motorway, but instead, a beautifully maintained, smooth, PROPER motorway, built to the standard all UK motorways should be. 

 

With no speed limits. 

[Fumbler]

16 minutes ago, Ghosty said:

I don't mind paying for the M6 toll on the grounds I'm paying not to use a smart motorway, but instead, a beautifully maintained, smooth, PROPER motorway, built to the standard all UK motorways should be. 

 

Oh yes, I'd love it.

[SiC]

19 hours ago, Wack said:

campsite in greater manchester

I haven't seen anything grimmer mentioned all week 

[bigstraight6]

I think the real upshot from these CEZ zones will be people will be even less inclined to go into City centres if they are forced to use public transport and not their own vehicles,  they don’t need to just click on buy it now. The City centre as we knew it is finished.

[Matty]

I genuinely don't get where we are going with demonising vehicle usage in order to reverse climate change. Amg a classes with 450 bhp. 5 series class vehicles that weigh nearly 2 ton. The proliferation of suv type vehicles. It would appear to me that increases in passenger vehicle efficiency are being nullified by wasteful use of the materials to build them, their size and performance output. Me dad told me this week (probably Wikipedia type citation needed knowing my old fella) that peugeot now sell a 3008 crossover ev with 300 odd horsepower. If that's true then why, for fucks sake, didn't they concentrate on giving it around 150 bhp output but a real world range of 3 to 400 miles instead? 

[lisbon_road]

I'd guess that it is reasonably efficient over a wide range of power, so reducing the maximum power wouldn't increase the range so much.  Don't get me wrong: I totally agree with your general point.  I've been in three electric cars and have been seriously impressed with them, but the idea that they are 'guilt free travelling' isn't right.  They need masses of resources and electricity and so on.  I don't want to stop them, but we do need some realism. 

[Wack]

On 8/7/2021 at 7:32 PM, Ghosty said:

I don't mind paying for the M6 toll on the grounds I'm paying not to use a smart motorway, but instead, a beautifully maintained, smooth, PROPER motorway, built to the standard all UK motorways should be. 

 

In a car maybe , would you still pay it if it was £23 return like a van 

[ETCHY]

On 8/7/2021 at 9:28 PM, Matty said:

I genuinely don't get where we are going with demonising vehicle usage in order to reverse climate change. Amg a classes with 450 bhp. 5 series class vehicles that weigh nearly 2 ton. The proliferation of suv type vehicles. It would appear to me that increases in passenger vehicle efficiency are being nullified by wasteful use of the materials to build them, their size and performance output. Me dad told me this week (probably Wikipedia type citation needed knowing my old fella) that peugeot now sell a 3008 crossover ev with 300 odd horsepower. If that's true then why, for fucks sake, didn't they concentrate on giving it around 150 bhp output but a real world range of 3 to 400 miles instead? 

Because many folk are obsessed with power not range. Especially if you read car reviews. Yes range is mentioned but check out something like carwow and all that irritating twat goes on about is power & launch times etc etc - stuff that is basically pointless but many arseholes are into.

 

[bangernomics]

I think the real upshot from these CEZ zones will be people will be even less inclined to go into City centres if they are forced to use public transport and not their own vehicles,  they don’t need to just click on buy it now. The City centre as we knew it is finished.

Manchester centre has only just recovered from the Trafford centre effect, that and the idiots in the council introducing parking charges for on street after 6/7pm which did a lot of restaurants over.

I get that they don’t want you to use your car, but really Manchester is congested because it like London was managed into congestion.

Lights rephased to screw flow, double lanes painted to single, mindless one way systems that all stack up to slower flow and more local emissions.

Perversely the worse the car flow gets the worse it is for cycling, the motorists are stuck still, cycles struggling to get by on the inside and motorcycles down the middle it becomes carnage.

We would be better off taxing the shit out of air travel.

[Dead_E23]

On 05/08/2021 at 23:33, Dead_E23 said:

Due to the expansion of the London LEZ to the North Circular in October, I intend to scrap a perfectly serviceable but scruffy Mondeo which easily has another 100k of life in it upon the expiry of its MOT a month later, and I expect there'll be thousands of older cars with a similar fate.

The doomed Mondeo has been granted a temporary reprieve due to me not bothering to purchase a replacement and it sailing through its MOT with a couple of advisories.

As it doesn't often need to cross the north circular into the ULEZ and swmbo's requirements for its replacement are vague and contradictory I'll just keep half an eye out until something half suitable comes along.

[Spurious]

This has been delayed, revised plan to come out in the Summer. 

Burnham has come out swinging with this, he's rather pissed off... 

 

 

[Matty]

18 minutes ago, Spurious said:

This has been delayed, revised plan to come out in the Summer. 

Burnham has come out swinging with this, he's rather pissed off... 

 

 

At the end of the day it's a central government edict. They have to do it whether they think its a good idea or not. And that spud you look like is jake Berry, our mp. A slimy useless fucker who makes a chocolate cock look useful. Kind of indicative of the current govt in general

[Wack]

On 8/22/2021 at 12:12 PM, bangernomics said:

Manchester centre has only just recovered from the Trafford centre effect, that and the idiots in the council introducing parking charges for on street after 6/7pm which did a lot of restaurants over.

I get that they don’t want you to use your car, but really Manchester is congested because it like London was managed into congestion.

Lights rephased to screw flow, double lanes painted to single, mindless one way systems that all stack up to slower flow and more local emissions.

Perversely the worse the car flow gets the worse it is for cycling, the motorists are stuck still, cycles struggling to get by on the inside and motorcycles down the middle it becomes carnage.

We would be better off taxing the shit out of air travel.

Last time we had a night out in Manchester we had to come home at 10:30pm because I didn't want to be on the last train which was only about 11:15 , if you want people to use public transport it has to be when people want to use it , it's not 1955 , the pubs don't close at 11pm 

[Ghosty]

Very true, and the night bus offering is abysmal - Fri/Sat nights only and it doesn't run after kicking out time - nor does it take me all the way home. If I want to go on a proper night out in Manc it's either a £20 Uber home or I have to find somewhere to stay.
Manchester was indeed engineered to be anti-car, and it continues, with the intended pedestrianisation of Deansgate- which was leveraged in by closing part of the road altogether under the veil of social distancing. 
It didn't work though as the bus companies got majorly fucked off by it and were forced to reopen the road to buses. It's much worse now than pre-Covid, I do have to drive into the city sometimes and it just gets more and more confusing. 
There's also the matter of the Oxford Road bus corridor which is a massive waste of capacity - and the fact it was never properly implemented so a lot of the fines it generated from confused motorists were moot. 


Leeds did the right thing. They had a CAZ, then when the air quality rose they declared it had served its purpose and got rid of it. 

[Ghosty]

I hope the new plan is good, and has a much smaller area than just a blanket CAZ for all of GM - whoever thought that through was an absolute cretin. The CAZ needs to be limited to inside the M60 at the absolute biggest - though honestly I'd rather it was just inside the inner ring road or thereabouts. The city centre is almost entirely surrounded by low rise residential areas. 

[Spurious]

3 minutes ago, Ghosty said:

I hope the new plan is good, and has a much smaller area than just a blanket CAZ for all of GM - whoever thought that through was an absolute cretin. The CAZ needs to be limited to inside the M60 at the absolute biggest - though honestly I'd rather it was just inside the inner ring road or thereabouts. The city centre is almost entirely surrounded by low rise residential areas. 

Yea, correct. The current iteration has places like Saddleworth in the zone. It's practically in the sticks up there, open moorland and very little residential/commercial activity.

[Ghosty]

46 minutes ago, Spurious said:

Yea, correct. The current iteration has places like Saddleworth in the zone. It's practically in the sticks up there, open moorland and very little residential/commercial activity.

Saddleworth is on my doorstep (Stalybridge). This part of the world really seriously doesn't need to be a CAZ. 
There are vast swathes of moorland that are CAZ and that's where all the camper owners live, and they're getting fucked by it. 

[bigstraight6]

I can’t believe Saddleworth is in the CAZ,  just proves what a nonsense all this is and it’s just about screwing more money out of people. If they introduce such a scheme in my home City they would need to replace nearly all of the entire dirty diesel bus fleet, for new ones nobody would use to travel to an already dyeing City centre of mainly empty shop units.

[SiC]

1 minute ago, bigstraight6 said:

they would need to replace nearly all of the entire dirty diesel bus fleet

Many old buses can have stuff put on them to meet Euro 6. There are quite a few 2008 busses running around Bristol that proudly proclaim they're Euro 6. Bristol is supposed to be getting a CAZ later this year and around the summer time.

[Ghosty]

3 minutes ago, bigstraight6 said:

I can’t believe Saddleworth is in the CAZ,  just proves what a nonsense all this is

They put no thought at all to making a border for the CAZ, they just took the combined border of the eleven GM councils and made the entire conurbation a CAZ, it was moronic. The area is much, much bigger than the LEZ and includes masses of undeveloped moorland and green space. 

[Matty]

4 minutes ago, Ghosty said:

They put no thought at all to making a border for the CAZ, they just took the combined border of the eleven GM councils and made the entire conurbation a CAZ, it was moronic. The area is much, much bigger than the LEZ and includes masses of undeveloped moorland and green space. 

I know it's been delayed ghosty, but the signage put up indicates that it starts at each end of rossendale where I live. At the end of the valley where I live bordering Bury and at the Bacup end bordering Rochdale. Utter fucking madness. Both of them areas the Valley ends in open moorland.

[Dave_Q]

Some of the places that are claimed to be in Greater Manchester are a world away from the city centre. If they expand one more time my house will be in GM.

[Ghosty]

This is in the Greater Manchester CAZ.

[Matty]

4 minutes ago, Ghosty said:

This is in the Greater Manchester CAZ.

Is that above the Whitehouse in Littleborough?

[Matty]

6 minutes ago, Dave_Q said:

Some of the places that are claimed to be in Greater Manchester are a world away from the city centre. If they expand one more time my house will be in GM.

I'm firmly in East Lancashire. I believe we offered to join GM but they said fuck you scruffy oiks 😁

[Dave_Q]

Ghostys pic I think might be the Isle of Skye climb from Greenfield towards Meltham? Don't think it's near the White House as that's Rochdale/Halifax Road.

[Dave_Q]

Actually his pic is the A672 somewhere between Denshaw and J22. 

Here is the entrance to the CAZ/GM as you drive over from Meltham: note the clouds of smog just past the sign

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@53.5532097,-1.9255064,3a,75y,277.98h,82.88t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sKvaqvaW3rIfQqCP4-TQoeQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

[Spurious]

Yea it's not far from the Rishworth moor exit of the M62 on Ripponden Road. 

To be fair, open moor looks alike up there. 

[Wack]

I own a motorhome , luckily I'm not in GM so I can just choose to avoid it 

I can't imagine how pissed off i'd be if I got charged £10 to leave my house and £10 to come back to it a few days later while the guy in his diesel range rover towing a caravan pays fuck all

My motorhome is 14 years old and has 37000 miles on it ,probably the same as a diesel taxi does in 6 months so it's hardly high on emissions .

They just can't be bothered to separate a motorhome from the van chassis it's on for taxation purposes 

[Wack]

On 8/5/2021 at 9:43 AM, sierraman said:

Despite all this we are wasting Christ knows how much on HS2, a rail link so you can get to London 20 minutes quicker, by the time that’s built the cost of the tickets will be prohibitive. Here’s a thought, scrap HS2 and spend the money fixing to local rail network. 

HS2 is the answer to a question nobody had asked. 

If they build HS2 by the time it's finished the driverless rental car will be here , 4 people will be picked up from their house , be driven to the door in  Glasgow , and it'll drive itself off to be charged up 

The £150+ a ticket Train will be obsolete