2003 Citroen C5 estate.....the end

[maxxo]

If I drive home from work a slightly different way, thus delaying getting on a dual carriageway by about 5 minutes it doesn't go into limp mode! From cold that is, the car is fine when warm

I'm now like hahaha beeps be gone!

Was sat in traffic today outside a Toyota dealer, of course nosying at what they have, now imagine if I bought a brand new Toyota, it would be so boring and probably have no faults and no character 

[maxxo]

still being managable regarding the transmission issue

gets sorted 3 weeks on monday, hopefully

it's quite bad when cold, but fine when hot usually

otherwise, the car is still doing fine, almost 164k on it now.....i've done around 14,000 of those miles, ish

i still really, really like it, love it in fact

after the transmission gets repaired, theres not much left to do really

service, timing belt, fix the heater blower and replace the spheres

then i dare say mechanically we're done

oh and tyres

[maxxo]

could be worse......

i see my old picasso has had a decently bad MOT fail, sill rot, ball joint and advisories for rot on the floor, oh and brake pipes

yes rotted the sills for the third time

[jamescarruthers]

Glad to hear it is all going well. 

Just FYI, I called Pleiades a few weeks ago about regassing the C6's spheres next month (and my sister's  C5 in the future when I get my hands on it again).  They said it was £25/sphere to re-gas the saucers, plus labour to take them off/on, which I would hope would not go over 2 hours.  That's not too bad overall price for a non-hydractive car-- have you just got 5 spheres like a big jelly shaped BX: x4 corners plus an accumulator? 

They also warned me previously re: C5 rear ram that the ram end can corrode at the mating face where it meets the sphere-- this isn't a show stopper, but would require the whole ram to be removed, put in a lathe and made flat again which would add cost.  If it isn't too bad, there is talk on FCF of getting the correct Dowty washers to take up imperfections if cleaned up in situ.  Just a heads up of what could go wrong.

Oh, and I remember that you said you don't use the handbrake as it has the Park position in the automatic.  Two things on this:

1) the handbrake cables go through a shitty design of a guide tube which collects water and corrodes the handbrake cables, meaning that not only do they stop working very well, but they can also hold the brakes on-- I think it is best to use the handbrake as much as possible to try and keep things free.  I had my sister's cables replaced at Pleiades, which was quite pricey.  They will have lubricated the hell out of the cables and tubes after install.  If you can get some lubrication down the tube and then close the top off with some self-amalgamiting tape, this would be a good bit of preventative maintenance.

2) (this could be bollocks) but I remember being told that if an automatic car gets hit when parked using only the gearbox to hold it, the parking pawl could possibly be destroyed and the car just fucks off the the road/hill with nothing to stop it, whereas the handbrake would remain applied.  Food for thought-- I used to ignore the handbrake but now its always on.

 

 

[maxxo]

3 hours ago, jamescarruthers said:

Just FYI, I called Pleiades a few weeks ago about regassing the C6's spheres next month (and my sister's  C5 in the future when I get my hands on it again).  They said it was £25/sphere to re-gas the saucers, plus labour to take them off/on, which I would hope would not go over 2 hours.  That's not too bad overall price for a non-hydractive car-- have you just got 5 spheres like a big jelly shaped BX: x4 corners plus an accumulator? 

nope, mines the basic hydractive 3 so just the 4 corner spheres, i would consdier a regas but i feel in the long run replacement would be better, especially due to the fact mine are the originals

the ride is still good, excellent in fact but i feel it's slightly less floaty than it should be

albeit replacing the rear arm bearings brought all of the float back

3 hours ago, jamescarruthers said:

Oh, and I remember that you said you don't use the handbrake as it has the Park position in the automatic.  Two things on this:

1) the handbrake cables go through a shitty design of a guide tube which collects water and corrodes the handbrake cables, meaning that not only do they stop working very well, but they can also hold the brakes on-- I think it is best to use the handbrake as much as possible to try and keep things free.  I had my sister's cables replaced at Pleiades, which was quite pricey.  They will have lubricated the hell out of the cables and tubes after install.  If you can get some lubrication down the tube and then close the top off with some self-amalgamiting tape, this would be a good bit of preventative maintenance.

2) (this could be bollocks) but I remember being told that if an automatic car gets hit when parked using only the gearbox to hold it, the parking pawl could possibly be destroyed and the car just fucks off the the road/hill with nothing to stop it, whereas the handbrake would remain applied.  Food for thought-- I used to ignore the handbrake but now its always on.

i have been told it could do with new cables, i used the handbrake today in fact, as i always do when parked on anything more than a slight incline

i try to avoid using it for one reason, i have had issues in the past with it sticking on

i feel if it's been hit hard enough to destroy the parking pawl i have more things to worry about than that, but if it's on a hill then the handbrake will be applied

say around once a week or so i use the handbrake on average, it's strong enough to lock the front wheels whilst moving in neutral so the adjustment they did to it during the brake fluid change really worked

and that's another thing, the brakes on this car are absolutely fierce, really firm pedal, not much travel but very linear if that makes sense, really does stop brilliantly

[maxxo]

oh did i mention i'm doing around 500 miles a week in this at the moment

220 of that going to work and back, and the rest me going on trips out etc

so far, it's been honestly fantastically reliable

i dare say it may even pass it's MOT!

[jamescarruthers]

Interesting to hear that the rear arm bearings made the ride better. This is in my sister’s car’s future— next year or the one after. 
 

Am I right in thinking that you are around Durham way? If I’m passing on a solo trip one day to Newcastle, it would be fun to do a compare/contrast of the two engines and suspension systems if you fancy? 
 

Yours is going to factory smooooooth with new spheres! 

[myglaren]

16 hours ago, maxxo said:

and that's another thing, the brakes on this car are absolutely fierce, really firm pedal, not much travel but very linear if that makes sense, really does stop brilliantly

Try the EBA!  Phenomenal.

I 'tested' mine at 120 mph. when someone pulled out in front of me.

Didn't even know I had it but was pleased it was there.  Completely resigned to having a serious crash.

Pulled up straight and smooth, no drama at all.

[maxxo]

On 10/21/2021 at 11:19 AM, jamescarruthers said:

Interesting to hear that the rear arm bearings made the ride better. This is in my sister’s car’s future— next year or the one after. 
 

Am I right in thinking that you are around Durham way? If I’m passing on a solo trip one day to Newcastle, it would be fun to do a compare/contrast of the two engines and suspension systems if you fancy? 
 

Yours is going to factory smooooooth with new spheres! 

Yes, Middlesbrough so sort of Durham way

i'd be very happy to compare them! always up for doing citroen stuff

On 10/21/2021 at 12:02 PM, myglaren said:

Try the EBA!  Phenomenal.

I 'tested' mine at 120 mph. when someone pulled out in front of me.

Didn't even know I had it but was pleased it was there.  Completely resigned to having a serious crash.

Pulled up straight and smooth, no drama at all.

i think i may have had that kick in once before, when the traffic stopped suddently

best thing i did for my brakes was change the fluid, it made it feel significantly better

[maxxo]

did a 300 mile round trip in the C5 today

apart from it being absolutely wonderful, quiet, floaty, effortless and extremely comfy!

i achieved this, i had reset the trip computer before i left as i hadn't done it in ages

but look at those mega emm pee geees!

yes that is the computer average for the trip, and i've found it to be pretty bang on

[maxxo]

getting more of a lunatic

i saw a C6 today, now, i have driven one and i said to myself "max, you must never buy one"

but

i want a C6, will it be any good?

[jamescarruthers]

8 hours ago, maxxo said:

getting more of a lunatic

i saw a C6 today, now, i have driven one and i said to myself "max, you must never buy one"

but

i want a C6, will it be any good?

You are probably In a good position to judge yourself as lots “scary” stuff on the C5 is the same on the C6. 
 

They are both sublime to drive, until they break… but my experience of the C5 and C6 makes me think of both in this way!  
 

If it helps get this ruinous idea out of your head: I don’t think my sister’s 190k miles, 2001 2.2 diesel Hydractive 3 C5 floats along any better or worse than my 90k miles, 2006 3.0 petrol Hydractive 3 (+AMVAR) C6 🙂

My experience of both is that paying the expensive preventative maintenance (probably neglected by previous owners) makes them both pretty reliable. I would happily get in either and drive abroad now.
 

My sister’s has let itself down majorly twice (DPF blocked due to probably having EOLYS level reset but not topped up in the past and cheap single-mass flywheel conversion which let go)— neither of which I can really blame on the car. But, once these have been reversed, and lots of preventative maintenance done to bring it back to spec, it is actually quite reliable. I think the last owner was on a maintenance wind-down as it got older but this was easily reversed. 
 

Probably a little more than other elderly cars, both really don’t take well to neglect. 
 

The C6, and the one before, were pampered at BL Autos and it’s hard to get out of there without approaching 4-figures— but then they have basically worked without issue for a year until their next visit.

[jamescarruthers]

Oh, and as you probably know your non-hydractive (no matter what it claims on the black panel under the bonnet!) will be just as soft and lovely in normal circumstances a full hydractive car, it just can’t tighten itself up for corners, spirited driving, braking, etc. 

[maxxo]

4 hours ago, jamescarruthers said:

You are probably In a good position to judge yourself as lots “scary” stuff on the C5 is the same on the C6. 
 

They are both sublime to drive, until they break… but my experience of the C5 and C6 makes me think of both in this way!  
 

If it helps get this ruinous idea out of your head: I don’t think my sister’s 190k miles, 2001 2.2 diesel Hydractive 3 C5 floats along any better or worse than my 90k miles, 2006 3.0 petrol Hydractive 3 (+AMVAR) C6 🙂

My experience of both is that paying the expensive preventative maintenance (probably neglected by previous owners) makes them both pretty reliable. I would happily get in either and drive abroad now.
 

My sister’s has let itself down majorly twice (DPF blocked due to probably having EOLYS level reset but not topped up in the past and cheap single-mass flywheel conversion which let go)— neither of which I can really blame on the car. But, once these have been reversed, and lots of preventative maintenance done to bring it back to spec, it is actually quite reliable. I think the last owner was on a maintenance wind-down as it got older but this was easily reversed. 
 

Probably a little more than other elderly cars, both really don’t take well to neglect. 
 

The C6, and the one before, were pampered at BL Autos and it’s hard to get out of there without approaching 4-figures— but then they have basically worked without issue for a year until their next visit.

but the C5 isn't scary, it's quite the opposite

i'm realising to actually enjoy a C6 a cheap one won't work.....

[maxxo]

2 hours ago, jamescarruthers said:

Oh, and as you probably know your non-hydractive (no matter what it claims on the black panel under the bonnet!) will be just as soft and lovely in normal circumstances a full hydractive car, it just can’t tighten itself up for corners, spirited driving, braking, etc. 

still don't think the C5s really need it, they handle well in 4 sphere form

[jamescarruthers]

44 minutes ago, maxxo said:

but the C5 isn't scary, it's quite the opposite

i'm realising to actually enjoy a C6 a cheap one won't work.....

Ah yes, I was referring to mere-mortal, non-Citroen owners finding them scary.... you would be a great C6 owner going in with your eyes wide open! If you can cope with a C5, a C6 is not much more complication.  In fact, its the C5 I've had the most difficulty getting parts for-- had to get a three pipes from a scrap car and send the smaller one via Pleiades for a pressure test first for piece of mind.

 

43 minutes ago, maxxo said:

still don't think the C5s really need it, they handle well in 4 sphere form

You are probably right there. Its a nice to have "feature" but a "big BX" is a superb thing to waft about in.  I feel I am currently occupying my "peak car" dreams with the C6 and 480 but if I had the space I'd also have a BX; and if I had the money I'd have a DS sitting along side them all too-- all non-hydractive Citroens that ride very nicely, like your C5.

[maxxo]

filling the van up at work one of the people at the fuel station said

"oh you drive that big citroen, you can always tell where you park as there's always a puddle"

how rude!

implying my car leaks LDS!

well let me tell you.................this car is very well maintained and love

 

 

so of course it does leak.........

do i fuck around sorting that?

or do i just wait a month and get the usual garage to do it when i drop the car off for a service

but my god look how clean it is underneath!!!

i'm quite surprised how clean this car actually is, zero rot.......tiny bit of surface stuff in some areas but that's it

 

[maxxo]

On 10/27/2021 at 2:22 PM, jamescarruthers said:

Ah yes, I was referring to mere-mortal, non-Citroen owners finding them scary.... you would be a great C6 owner going in with your eyes wide open! If you can cope with a C5, a C6 is not much more complication.  In fact, its the C5 I've had the most difficulty getting parts for-- had to get a three pipes from a scrap car and send the smaller one via Pleiades for a pressure test first for piece of mind.

to be fair, would an equivelantly aged and mileage passat or mondeo have help up better? i doubt it

you can't run them on a budget, that's all i'll say

i'm willing to spend what it takes on this, not doing much work myself as i want it doing properly hahaha

[maxxo]

3k miles this month in comfort and reliability

it really does deserve to have money spent on it

so sod it, that's what i'm doing

obviously waiting for the gearbox to get sorted first just in case

[maxxo]

Its not fine anymore

Gearbox is not rather bad, okay most the time when warmed up but now starts going into limp mode on motorways etc which I don't like

Hopefully getting sorted on Monday 

[maxxo]

if this repair doesn't sort it, i'm rather reluctant to throw money at a gearbox that may just need replacing

i am also very very reluctant to actually replace the box........

not sure what i'll do, C5 prices have gone ridiculous recently

xantia as a daily is something i'm not overly keen on

facelift C5 exclusive, not the biggest fan of the centre console

i just want this one to work

[Jim Bell]

https://austrin-engineering.co.uk/

 

Is it worth getting a quote for a rebuild?

No idea how deadly the cost would be, but asking is free man. 

[Gman88667733]

Tricky scenario. Hopefully it won't be as bad as you are thinking.

However, if the worst comes to light, remember that any similar car could easily throw a bill that would match that of the C5. I reckon if you really like the car and it isn't a half bad example, you may be better off in the long run rebuilding the gearbox/replacing...

Saying that, I really hope the repair will sort it. 

I usually work out the cost of a repair and then work out how much a new car would cost by the time I sell the current one and then sort out the inevitable teething problems, big or small... Usually ends up making more sense to suck up the bill.

Good luck!

[maxxo]

4 hours ago, Jim Bell said:

https://austrin-engineering.co.uk/

 

Is it worth getting a quote for a rebuild?

No idea how deadly the cost would be, but asking is free man. 

very true, certainly an option if the worst happens......remember, if the worst happens i'm still £500 down on the repair cost which may be slightly displeasing

[maxxo]

29 minutes ago, Gman88667733 said:

Tricky scenario. Hopefully it won't be as bad as you are thinking.

However, if the worst comes to light, remember that any similar car could easily throw a bill that would match that of the C5. I reckon if you really like the car and it isn't a half bad example, you may be better off in the long run rebuilding the gearbox/replacing...

Saying that, I really hope the repair will sort it. 

I usually work out the cost of a repair and then work out how much a new car would cost by the time I sell the current one and then sort out the inevitable teething problems, big or small... Usually ends up making more sense to suck up the bill.

Good luck!

bodywork is reasonable for it's age

but underneath it's absolutely spotless, zero corrosion at all, and the very slightest in surface corrosion

i must admit i won't be too happy if the repair doesn't sort it, as it's rapidly getting worse to the point where i'm not doing any long journeys unless it's unavoidable at the moment

i don't trust it

i fear if it doesn't sort it i may end up with a modern for a couple of years, i can afford it but it's probably going to be boringly reliable

don't know what i'm going to do

[Braddon81]

You need a proper Lexia diagnosis to pinpoint the fault. If it's an AL4 box its usually the solanoid valve packs that go rogue  with age and old fluid -  not an involved job to change and replacements are readily available and quite reasonable in cost.

[grogee]

I sympathize, tricky decision. I think with the amount of miles on it I would be tempted to weigh it in and spend £500 sorting another one out. You could even pull off the 'good' bits from yours for a future replacement (eg spheres). They seem to be quite plentiful. 

Does it have to be an auto or is that just a 'nice to have'?

Another cheap gamble could be to throw in some automatic fluid 'snake oil' from Hellfrauds - there is probably some product that claims to recondition everything for zero effort. If that buys you some miles then it would be a result.

[grogee]

There is some (American) guff on it here but one of the products is Lucas so should be available here:

https://www.thedrive.com/reviews/28242/best-transmission-additives

I cannot speak from experience and I am not affiliated with any of these manufacturers! I just think it's worth a go.

[grogee]

As an example of "what you could have won" here is a low spec 2.0 dizzle manuel one with just 54k on the clock near me. Buy it and make one good one?

 

https://www.gumtree.com/p/cars-vans-motorbikes/citroen-c5-2003-very-low-mileage/1418616169?utm_source=com.atomczak.notepat&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=socialbuttons&utm_content=app_android

[maxxo]

8 hours ago, Braddon81 said:

You need a proper Lexia diagnosis to pinpoint the fault. If it's an AL4 box its usually the solanoid valve packs that go rogue  with age and old fluid -  not an involved job to change and replacements are readily available and quite reasonable in cost.

The fault is a pressure regulation fault, which points to the pressure regulation solenoid, which is what I'm getting repaired on Monday

It was extremely difficult to find someone to do the job, out of several garages I tried only one seems willing to do it