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outlaw118

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A lot of people say "oh they make them to break just after the warranty ends" and I don't entirely believe this for a lot of products/appliances - as we get better at designing and simulating stuff it's simply inevitable that things will be cheaper and last just long enough to not really annoy the customer, in order to reduce the material cost.

 

However, I am 100% convinced they they are making tumble dryers with many weak points like this entirely on purpose, they really want them to fail early on and in a relatively safe but annoying way

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18 minutes ago, cobblers said:

A lot of people say "oh they make them to break just after the warranty ends" and I don't entirely believe this for a lot of products/appliances - as we get better at designing and simulating stuff it's simply inevitable that things will be cheaper and last just long enough to not really annoy the customer, in order to reduce the material cost.

 

However, I am 100% convinced they they are making tumble dryers with many weak points like this entirely on purpose, they really want them to fail early on and in a relatively safe but annoying way

Pretty sure this is still under warranty...though trying to claim on it for the sake of a £10 part really isn't worth the hassle.

Thing is this apparently doesn't fail in a safe but annoying way if you ignore the squeak...which I imagine a not insignificant number of people would...eventually it gets to a point where it can fail in a very much not safe way apparently.

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2 hours ago, Zelandeth said:

You may recall a few years back there was quite a lot of publicity around issues with some very common tumble driers self immolating and there being a big recall surrounding it.

The issue apparently was lint getting into the heater ducting.

Ours was one of those affected, so was replaced.  Given it was going on for seven years old at that point we weren't too put out by that!

The only way I could see that happening though (the in and out air paths are totally separate) is if the drum is allowed to drop, which opens a gap at the front edge allowing exhaust air into the main outer casing.

This is entirely likely to happen as the rear of the drum was supported on a horribly cheap bushing rather than a proper bearing.  I'd replaced this at least twice on our old machine when it started squeaking.

So... you'd think they would have improved that on the replacement model, right?  Nope!

IMG_20220526_165637.thumb.jpg.a8dd09ad8bab771c0ef90aa00347e449.jpg

Ours has chewed it's way entirely through the bushing and about 1/8" through the casing.  It only started squeaking about an hour ago.  This machine arrived just before lockdown I think.

I've already looked inside the covers (I was curious to see what they'd changed - as far as I can see bugger all!) so there's nothing changed with regards to the air path, no change to the rating or position of the thermal cut outs etc...so it really feels like they've just chucked new machines out there and hoped that the problem goes away.  They obviously haven't improved the weak bearing situation.

Off to go buy a couple of replacement bushings for this and making a point of treating it as roughly a yearly consumable.  Fact is it's a £2 part that takes about five minutes to install meant it didn't bother me too much prior to the whole recall thing.

Except it now appears to be a £10-20 part....

I have a feeling that I may be measuring the shaft diameter and ordering a nice good quality ball bearing set to do away with this problem once and for all.

 

we bought a small  Bush tumble dryer a few years back ....   its shite , you would be better waving wet clothes around your head in a thunderstorm ..

we had a white knight  before hand and it lasted years ( with the odd repair ) , but that setup is shite , what brand is that ?

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2 minutes ago, MikeR said:

we bought a small  Bush tumble dryer a few years back ....   its shite , you would be better waving wet clothes around your head in a thunderstorm ..

we had a white knight  before hand and it lasted years ( with the odd repair ) , but that setup is shite , what brand is that ?

IMG_20220526_165723.thumb.jpg.f3b08633db301baff543f04569fb9a9f.jpg

Though same model is badged up as about five different brands I believe.

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7 hours ago, grogee said:

I really really shouldn't be grumpy about escaping this poisoned isle and its doom-laden grey skies, but... Here's Birmingham airport: our whole plane has one check in desk. 45min in and we're halfway through the queue. 

Then, funtime security queue to follow. Yay!

IMG_20220526_112651197.jpg

we have a caravan near the lakes 90 mins each way and a car parking place outside the door , no checking in etc , f in 10/10 for travel !!

despite the insurance companies wanting to ream me out for daring to have cancer I have no desire to use an airport

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14 minutes ago, Zelandeth said:

IMG_20220526_165723.thumb.jpg.f3b08633db301baff543f04569fb9a9f.jpg

Though same model is badged up as about five different brands I believe.

We had a Hotpoint/indesit/Creda tumble dryer and it must have been fixed about 8 times in the 5 years we had it, when the bearing mounting sheared out of the back of the drum we binned it  and bought a Gorenge which is now over 6 years old and never given trouble, built properly with decent components

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16 minutes ago, MikeR said:

we have a caravan near the lakes 90 mins each way and a car parking place outside the door , no checking in etc , f in 10/10 for travel !!

despite the insurance companies wanting to ream me out for daring to have cancer I have no desire to use an airport

How's the weather in the Lakes?

We're never going on holiday in Brexit Island again. We've got kids and trying to entertain them in a rainy Devon or Cornwall is impossible without £££. So we've taken a "cheap" package deal for some sunshine. 

Basically if the kids are happy then it's a holiday, if they're not then it's hell on earth - hence swimming pools and sun are compulsory. 

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3 hours ago, Zelandeth said:

You may recall a few years back there was quite a lot of publicity around issues with some very common tumble driers self immolating and there being a big recall surrounding it.

The issue apparently was lint getting into the heater ducting.

Ours was one of those affected, so was replaced.  Given it was going on for seven years old at that point we weren't too put out by that!

The only way I could see that happening though (the in and out air paths are totally separate) is if the drum is allowed to drop, which opens a gap at the front edge allowing exhaust air into the main outer casing.

This is entirely likely to happen as the rear of the drum was supported on a horribly cheap bushing rather than a proper bearing.  I'd replaced this at least twice on our old machine when it started squeaking.

So... you'd think they would have improved that on the replacement model, right?  Nope!

IMG_20220526_165637.thumb.jpg.a8dd09ad8bab771c0ef90aa00347e449.jpg

Ours has chewed it's way entirely through the bushing and about 1/8" through the casing.  It only started squeaking about an hour ago.  This machine arrived just before lockdown I think.

I've already looked inside the covers (I was curious to see what they'd changed - as far as I can see bugger all!) so there's nothing changed with regards to the air path, no change to the rating or position of the thermal cut outs etc...so it really feels like they've just chucked new machines out there and hoped that the problem goes away.  They obviously haven't improved the weak bearing situation.

Off to go buy a couple of replacement bushings for this and making a point of treating it as roughly a yearly consumable.  Fact is it's a £2 part that takes about five minutes to install meant it didn't bother me too much prior to the whole recall thing.

Except it now appears to be a £10-20 part....

I have a feeling that I may be measuring the shaft diameter and ordering a nice good quality ball bearing set to do away with this problem once and for all.

 

I have been involved in the restorations of a number of properties following tumble drier fires. I can’t remember the make but one customer’s machine had already had the manufacturers approved modification prior to it still catching fire. The “modification” was a self tapper through the drum to try to scrape of any build up of lint. Very effective*

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11 minutes ago, Wibble said:

I have been involved in the restorations of a number of properties following tumble drier fires. I can’t remember the make but one customer’s machine had already had the manufacturers approved modification prior to it still catching fire. The “modification” was a self tapper through the drum to try to scrape of any build up of lint. Very effective*

I actually had a machine where the internal wires for the machine rubbed against the drum , the drum wore the wire insulation and " started a lot of electrical noise " on my sons sterio , the penny dropped , I fixed the problem and informed the supplier , who offerd a new machine !!

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1 hour ago, grogee said:

How's the weather in the Lakes?

We're never going on holiday in Brexit Island again. We've got kids and trying to entertain them in a rainy Devon or Cornwall is impossible without £££. So we've taken a "cheap" package deal for some sunshine. 

Basically if the kids are happy then it's a holiday, if they're not then it's hell on earth - hence swimming pools and sun are compulsory. 

we have some woods, parking and wifi  , deer and F all else , but it works , the more u wont , the more u miss , center parks it is not , but I dont  miss the book in and parking

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11 minutes ago, MikeR said:

I actually had a machine where the internal wires for the machine rubbed against the drum , the drum wore the wire insulation and " started a lot of electrical noise " on my sons sterio , the penny dropped , I fixed the problem and informed the supplier , who offerd a new machine !!

Thank goodness you twigged what was happening. I attend the aftermath of house fires every week. My advice to all is do not leave anything on, or on standby, overnight or whilst you’re out. The exception of course being fridges/freezers, as you have no choice. Most fire claims we deal with are electrical, although not all. One major one was caused by sun reflecting through the owner’s crystal ball, setting light to the sofa. I really struggled not to ask how she hadn’t seen that coming😬

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3 hours ago, Zelandeth said:

IMG_20220526_165723.thumb.jpg.f3b08633db301baff543f04569fb9a9f.jpg

Though same model is badged up as about five different brands I believe.

Absolutely would never buy a Hotpoint appliance... Ever. (Or whirlpool, indeshit etc) 

When they looked like this, they were ok.. excellent in fact 

image.png.4bbb641d3a3af79fcbc4e50758572570.png

 

Late 2019 they issued a recall for a list of models for recall. An elderly relative had one of the models, but in a different colour. I couldn't fathom how the colour made any difference but since it wasn't on the list we weren't concerned. You may remember at the time it was all over the news how people were told not to use their washing machine right upon Christmas 

Fast forward to April 2020, quelle surprise, elderly relative's model is added to the list. I knew it deep down. The recall is those models sold between 2014 - 2018. Elderly relative bought it in 2015, and it was an affected model on the list

Phoned up customer service* to be spoken to like some sort of delinquent.. I gave the model and serial, and after a couple of seconds "nope, that ones not affected pal" - I asked how he's come to that conclusion "it just isn't affected"

I was extremely dubious, and asked if they can put it in writing that this model and serial number is not affected because as far as I'm concerned it's part of the recall, and should it catch fire then the insurance company would wonder why she was using an appliance announced as unsafe and condemned for use "no sorry can't do that" 

I was very unhappy, and so was the relative who was now worried that the washing machine could catch fire without her noticing until it was too late.

Not something either of us were willing to risk so just took the fucking washing machine to the tip in the end, absolute bag of noisy shite it was anyway. The bearings were noisy from about 18 months old, conveniently just out of warranty but never got any worse strangely. 

https://www.electricalsafetyfirst.org.uk/product-recalls/2019/12/hotpoint-and-indesit-washing-machines/

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6 minutes ago, RoverFolkUs said:

Absolutely would never buy a Hotpoint appliance... Ever. (Or whirlpool, indeshit etc) 

This.  Absolutely shameful company.  Sold lethal machines and then fucked people about making them wait months for repairs or replacement instead of doing the decent thing and just giving them their money back.

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Just now, adw1977 said:

This.  Absolutely shameful company.  Sold lethal machines and then fucked people about making them wait months for repairs or replacement instead of doing the decent thing and just giving them their money back.

I recall people waiting upto a year for replacement tumble driers back when that scandal first started. And they were forced to pay an £80 excess, and it seems as zelandeth mentions above the replacements may not have been any different anyway, bunch of sharks! :(

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10 minutes ago, RoverFolkUs said:

Absolutely would never buy a Hotpoint appliance... Ever. (Or whirlpool, indeshit etc) 

When they looked like this, they were ok.. excellent in fact 

image.png.4bbb641d3a3af79fcbc4e50758572570.png

 

Late 2019 they issued a recall for a list of models for recall. An elderly relative had one of the models, but in a different colour. I couldn't fathom how the colour made any difference but since it wasn't on the list we weren't concerned. You may remember at the time it was all over the news how people were told not to use their washing machine right upon Christmas 

Fast forward to April 2020, quelle surprise, elderly relative's model is added to the list. I knew it deep down. The recall is those models sold between 2014 - 2018. Elderly relative bought it in 2015, and it was an affected model on the list

Phoned up customer service* to be spoken to like some sort of delinquent.. I gave the model and serial, and after a couple of seconds "nope, that ones not affected pal" - I asked how he's come to that conclusion "it just isn't affected"

I was extremely dubious, and asked if they can put it in writing that this model and serial number is not affected because as far as I'm concerned it's part of the recall, and should it catch fire then the insurance company would wonder why she was using an appliance announced as unsafe and condemned for use "no sorry can't do that" 

I was very unhappy, and so was the relative who was now worried that the washing machine could catch fire without her noticing until it was too late.

Not something either of us were willing to risk so just took the fucking washing machine to the tip in the end, absolute bag of noisy shite it was anyway. The bearings were noisy from about 18 months old, conveniently just out of warranty but never got any worse strangely. 

https://www.electricalsafetyfirst.org.uk/product-recalls/2019/12/hotpoint-and-indesit-washing-machines/

Insurers would never expect customers to know a machine was subject to a recall, they’re not as bad as people thing and usually look at ways of accepting a claim rather than declining. However, that’s not the point and, yes, the manufacturers were shameful in their actions but I’ve seen thee same problem with fridges, dishwashers too. Bosch, Beko, could name them all. Just heed what I said earlier, don’t leave things on overnight, or leave home with appliances still running👍

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On the flip side of all this appliance malarky, in around 2016/2017 I realized my Beko fridge freezer purchased around 2003/2004 ish was in fact subject to the recall they launched many years ago.

Filled out the form online, and within 2 weeks the engineer came out and replaced the dodgy component free of charge. He said if there was any signs of overheating I would have been sent a brand new fridge freezer and the old one taken away the next day free of charge! 

Just goes to show the difference. And it's why I've been buying Beko appliances more recently. They're not the best, but they're pretty good. And their customer service is great, in my experience

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1 minute ago, RoverFolkUs said:

On the flip side of all this appliance malarky, in around 2016/2017 I realized my Beko fridge freezer purchased around 2003/2004 ish was in fact subject to the recall they launched many years ago.

Filled out the form online, and within 2 weeks the engineer came out and replaced the dodgy component free of charge. He said if there was any signs of overheating I would have been sent a brand new fridge freezer and the old one taken away the next day free of charge! 

Just goes to show the difference. And it's why I've been buying Beko appliances more recently. They're not the best, but they're pretty good. And their customer service is great, in my experience

Of course we all need these appliances and I would second this and have found Beko pretty good to be fair, despite previous bouts of spontaneous combustion 🙂

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7 minutes ago, adw1977 said:

For reference when choosing an appliance:

Screenshot_20211127-112915_DuckDuckGo.thumb.jpg.7bbd5bc09a24b2efbe4e383ea41bfebb.jpg

Yeah, all rebadged crap basically. It's the same with TVs, some Panasonic models are in fact made by Vestel who make the cheap brands as well, Bush, Luxor, Digihome and other crap brands. 

5 minutes ago, Wibble said:

Insurers would never expect customers to know a machine was subject to a recall, they’re not as bad as people thing and usually look at ways of accepting a claim rather than declining. However, that’s not the point and, yes, the manufacturers were shameful in their actions but I’ve seen thee same problem with fridges, dishwashers too. Bosch, Beko, could name them all. Just heed what I said earlier, don’t leave things on overnight, or leave home with appliances still running👍

My thinking about insurance was more about the point that multiple letters were sent out and the homeowner was technically well aware she had a dodgy appliance. I do understand it's difficult for them to know whether the customer was aware/negligent but in any case as you say the point stands the manufacturers were negligent in removing faulty appliances from people's homes in good time. 

Never leaving things on is also my best advice, but unfortunately she had short term memory issues and may put a load of washing on and then go upstairs for a nap. Hard of hearing and may not hear a smoke detector until it was too late :( we were all worried sick about it and that's why the machine was taken to the tip in the end

 

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3 minutes ago, Wibble said:

Of course we all need these appliances and I would second this and have found Beko pretty good to be fair, despite previous bouts of spontaneous combustion 🙂

It is a risk but the fact mine has had the recall done does give me enough confidence :)

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1 minute ago, RoverFolkUs said:

Yeah, all rebadged crap basically. It's the same with TVs, some Panasonic models are in fact made by Vestel who make the cheap brands as well, Bush, Luxor, Digihome and other crap brands. 

My thinking about insurance was more about the point that multiple letters were sent out and the homeowner was technically well aware she had a dodgy appliance. I do understand it's difficult for them to know whether the customer was aware/negligent but in any case as you say the point stands the manufacturers were negligent in removing faulty appliances from people's homes in good time. 

Never leaving things on is also my best advice, but unfortunately she had short term memory issues and may put a load of washing on and then go upstairs for a nap. Hard of hearing and may not hear a smoke detector until it was too late :( we were all worried sick about it and that's why the machine was taken to the tip in the end

 

Edit to add - it was decided in the end that it was a faulty Hotpoint fridge that caused the Grenfell tragedy. Coincidence, Hotpoint, I think not :(

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11 hours ago, grogee said:

I really really shouldn't be grumpy about escaping this poisoned isle and its doom-laden grey skies, but... Here's Birmingham airport: our whole plane has one check in desk. 45min in and we're halfway through the queue. 

Then, funtime security queue to follow. Yay!

IMG_20220526_112651197.jpg

I went through Birmingham Airport on Wednesday am on business to Verona, today we visited Brescia and Modena. Got a call off one of the purchasing people back in the factory, could I bring 100 small components out of a batch of 12000 back with me. 

Yes, but they'll have to deliver to the hotel, as we aren't going back to that factory and they will be closed. 

Fucking twats have left 2boxes containing 560 parts, 12.7kg in each box. I have a 1hour stop over at Amsterdam, it was 10pm until I hit back to. The hotel.

how the fuck am I supposed to put them in my handluggage? 

 My colleague and I have taken then all out of the trays they are in and stacked them in one box, which just fits in his hand luggage. I have a tray in my lap top bag, he has a tray in his laptop bag. He can hardly lift his carry on bag up as it weighs at least 22kg.  Fuck knows if we'll get through security (twice) or if KLM will spot it's over weight for carry on? 

When we get to brum, we have to go to customs and declare these "samples" 

Hilarious? 

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8 minutes ago, RoverFolkUs said:

Yeah, all rebadged crap basically. It's the same with TVs, some Panasonic models are in fact made by Vestel who make the cheap brands as well, Bush, Luxor, Digihome and other crap brands. 

My thinking about insurance was more about the point that multiple letters were sent out and the homeowner was technically well aware she had a dodgy appliance. I do understand it's difficult for them to know whether the customer was aware/negligent but in any case as you say the point stands the manufacturers were negligent in removing faulty appliances from people's homes in good time. 

Never leaving things on is also my best advice, but unfortunately she had short term memory issues and may put a load of washing on and then go upstairs for a nap. Hard of hearing and may not hear a smoke detector until it was too late :( we were all worried sick about it and that's why the machine was taken to the tip in the end

 

Yep, totally understand. My parents had an affected fridge but were unaware until I visited to check it out, as I was worried for the same reasons as you. They were never contacted by the manufacturers and hadn’t seen it in the press. 

I’ve been dealing with household insurance claims for over thirty years and negligence is very hard to prove and so rarely a route pursued by insurers, so please don’t be overly worried about that.

As you say, you can’t trust old brand names that previously may have been recognised as quality, as so many now are just old names bought up and the same crap being pedalled off under different brands.

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2 minutes ago, Wibble said:

Yep, totally understand. My parents had an affected fridge but were unaware until I visited to check it out, as I was worried for the same reasons as you. They were never contacted by the manufacturers and hadn’t seen it in the press. 

I’ve been dealing with household insurance claims for over thirty years and negligence is very hard to prove and so rarely a route pursued by insurers, so please don’t be overly worried about that.

As you say, you can’t trust old brand names that previously may have been recognised as quality, as so many now are just old names bought up and the same crap being pedalled off under different brands.

Thanks that's good to know. Maybe that was just my inner cynic showing 😀

I just don't feel it's worth the risk with dodgy appliances, especially so living in a flat where a fire could affect so many other people

Brand names rarely mean anything nowadays anyway as you say, 

Beko tend to be one of the only ones that don't get outsourced, I know they make Blomberg appliances as well but I think that's it's, when it comes to their large kitchen appliances at least. 

Mine have all been decent, the fridge is coming up 20 years old, had a cooker that was 18 years old and only got rid of it due to getting a bigger one with a fan oven to be a more efficient. The previous washing machine lasted about 7 years and the one I have now is coming up 4 years old and still going strong. It's not the best but for one of the cheapest out there it's good enough. All Beko, and customer service has been great when required. 

Though having said that I did have one Beko washing machine that lasted a day - went up in smoke after a couple of uses, it decided to eat the door seal when spinning 🙄 a new machine was delivered a couple of days later, so wasn't too bad. 

I assume most of their cheap small appliances are rebadged though as they all are

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10 minutes ago, RoverFolkUs said:

Thanks that's good to know. Maybe that was just my inner cynic showing 😀

I just don't feel it's worth the risk with dodgy appliances, especially so living in a flat where a fire could affect so many other people

Brand names rarely mean anything nowadays anyway as you say, 

Beko tend to be one of the only ones that don't get outsourced, I know they make Blomberg appliances as well but I think that's it's, when it comes to their large kitchen appliances at least. 

Mine have all been decent, the fridge is coming up 20 years old, had a cooker that was 18 years old and only got rid of it due to getting a bigger one with a fan oven to be a more efficient. The previous washing machine lasted about 7 years and the one I have now is coming up 4 years old and still going strong. It's not the best but for one of the cheapest out there it's good enough. All Beko, and customer service has been great when required. 

Though having said that I did have one Beko washing machine that lasted a day - went up in smoke after a couple of uses, it decided to eat the door seal when spinning 🙄 a new machine was delivered a couple of days later, so wasn't too bad. 

I assume most of their cheap small appliances are rebadged though as they all are

I believe they also make industrial appliances which is probably a good sign.

As for living in a flat, I totally get your concerns after the like of recent events. Other common examples I’ve encountered are flat owners with water damage from the flat above and asking if they can claim their damage from the owners of the flat that had the water leak. Again, unless you can prove they deliberately left that tap running, or knew their washing machine was about to leak and they were therefore negligent, you have no chance. 

It’s the same if the house next door burns down, causing serious smoke or indeed fire damage to you house. You can’t claim on their insurance, even though the fire was nothing to do with your house. They didn’t deliberately set fire to their house (usually 🙂) so are not negligent and there is no course to pursue. Everyone, make sure your own property and contents are adequately insured!

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17 minutes ago, RoverFolkUs said:

Thanks that's good to know. Maybe that was just my inner cynic showing 😀

I just don't feel it's worth the risk with dodgy appliances, especially so living in a flat where a fire could affect so many other people

Brand names rarely mean anything nowadays anyway as you say, 

Beko tend to be one of the only ones that don't get outsourced, I know they make Blomberg appliances as well but I think that's it's, when it comes to their large kitchen appliances at least. 

Mine have all been decent, the fridge is coming up 20 years old, had a cooker that was 18 years old and only got rid of it due to getting a bigger one with a fan oven to be a more efficient. The previous washing machine lasted about 7 years and the one I have now is coming up 4 years old and still going strong. It's not the best but for one of the cheapest out there it's good enough. All Beko, and customer service has been great when required. 

Though having said that I did have one Beko washing machine that lasted a day - went up in smoke after a couple of uses, it decided to eat the door seal when spinning 🙄 a new machine was delivered a couple of days later, so wasn't too bad. 

I assume most of their cheap small appliances are rebadged though as they all are

Beko are the consumer arm of Turkish company Arcelik who are owned by Koc holdings. See why they use the name Beko! They also make Grundig appliances.

I agree with comments re Hotpoint but have never had any problems with Indesit funnily enough.

Our Hotpoint tumble drier broke down  at least twice a year and was replaced by a Miele that has been faultless for ten years.

However, expensive German brands are not necessarily any better overall. I had a Bosch washer dryer that lasted a week and a couple of Liebherr fridge freezers that just managed to pass their warranty period before breaking down. They’re probably better at cranes .

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5 minutes ago, Metal Guru said:

Beko are the consumer arm of Turkish company Arcelik who are owned by Koc holdings. See why they use the name Beko! They also make Grundig appliances.

I agree with comments re Hotpoint but have never had any problems with Indesit funnily enough.

Our Hotpoint tumble drier broke down  at least twice a year and was replaced by a Miele that has been faultless for ten years.

However, expensive German brands are not necessarily any better overall. I had a Bosch washer dryer that lasted a week and a couple of Liebherr fridge freezers that just managed to pass their warranty period before breaking down. They’re probably better at cranes .

Hmm, well Indesit and Hotpoint are owned by whirlpool, and I think they are under the umbrella brand Merloni but don't quote me on that! 

Used to hear of Indesits exploding on the spin cycle, but I suppose there will always be a horror story for everything 

Miele are the dog's danglies, they're bloody heavy though!

Cheap Bosch appliances are shit. If it's a Bosch made in Spain, it'll be shit and nothing to do with Bosch really. Check the label if looking at one in store (do people still do that these days!?) to find out for sure. No experience with Liebherr so can't comment on them, but I do know someone who had a fridge that didn't last very long and I think it was a Liebherr now you mention that brand 

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1 hour ago, Metal Guru said:

Beko are the consumer arm of Turkish company Arcelik who are owned by Koc holdings. See why they use the name Beko!

Arselick and Cock Industries used to give us a right laugh when I worked in electrical retail.

Nowadays I'd buy the cheapest shite in the shop, or a Miele.

 

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