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Why are Classic Cars so expensive?


sierraman

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30 minutes ago, anonymous user said:

not everyone did well out of price rises or did I imagine the last two crashes in the 1980s and 2007

Depends where the house was. In Bristol, prices went above 2008 prices in around 2013. But I know there are plenty of other places around the country that haven't got to 2008 prices yet. 

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The one thing that people often forget about rising classic car prices is the running costs. If you're buying to invest, then you have to buy a low mile and immaculate example. Then leave it in carefully controlled storage so there is near zero deterioration. 

Storage costs are a pretty fixed amount. So a car has to be worth a lot for it to outweigh that cost. For example my storage is really cheap at under £50 pcm, but that's still nearly £600 a year. 

By the time you've added in maintenance, insurance and repairs, you're nearly at a grand a year for each. Very few cars that are affordable for the average person will be appreciating at that level. So it still is the case that many cars cost more to own than any potential extra over what you paid originally.

Even super exotic stuff like a Ferrari F40 is eye watering expensive to own. The fuel tanks are rubber bladders. These deteriorate both fuel and naturally, so need replacing every 3 to 5 years. Naturally they're not cheap and requires expensive specialist work to do. Likewise the cambelts are an engine drop job. 

Trying to make money on classic cars is a bit of a mugs game imo. 

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It’s worth mentioning that many cars do drop off a cliff in price when they get to vintage age. Every self-made man wants an XR3i now, but pre-war stuff which seems far more interesting to me anyway, is comparatively cheap and appeal to a much smaller crowd. Same will apply in 50 years time, kids will be paying stupid money for tedious white goods like Teslas and the RS Turbo will be unloved crust in a museum.

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15 minutes ago, motorpunk said:

It’s worth mentioning that many cars do drop off a cliff in price when they get to vintage age. Every self-made man wants an XR3i now, but pre-war stuff which seems far more interesting to me anyway, is comparatively cheap and appeal to a much smaller crowd. Same will apply in 50 years time, kids will be paying stupid money for tedious white goods like Teslas and the RS Turbo will be unloved crust in a museum.

I think when stuff ages enough to pass from living memory it begins to drop in value, there isn't the emotional memory of family road trips attraction to draw buyers in.

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1 hour ago, New POD said:

I paid 1500 quid for a 1996/7 mx5 in 2009.  My wife told me it would hold its value.  Like fuck. It's worth less than we paid for it 11 years later.  Maybe if we hadn't bought a poverty spec Monza with only 92 bhp. 

 

Strange how MX5's have failed to increase in value  when they are such great cars to drive and easy to own. I guess there are still quite a lot around so supply and demand controls the prices.

I have  a 1994 1.8i Eunos that I bought in 2012. It seemed very reasonably priced when I bought it, but I guess it has not gone up in value at all. It does not really matter because I love the car, am not planning to sell it and it means parts can be bought reasonably for it.

IMG_20190415_133745 broad.jpg

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15 minutes ago, Rusty_Rocket said:

It's a total mystery to me why MX5s are still down in the £1500 area.  Particularly when other early 90s stuff is racing away.

It's rwd and has pop-up head lamps for goodness sake!!

They're cheap as there are still a huge % of those built still in service. Mechanically, the 1.6 is bombproof and rust is not a huge issue given the age of them. Add to that masses of imported Eunos adding to the numbers on these shores, it's little wonder that values haven't increased. Until numbers start to seriously decline, I can't see things changing. 

I've owned several NAs and my last one would have been a perfect long-term keeper- import and absolutely rot-free shell. It also had a turbo conversion so was lively enough. I sold it for around £2400 six years ago - I can't see the value would have crept up much if I'd hung onto it in the meantime. 

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20 minutes ago, Lankytim said:

I think when stuff ages enough to pass from living memory it begins to drop in value, there isn't the emotional memory of family road trips attraction to draw buyers in.

Not that I follow with forensic detail...

Some of the Old Iron youtubers are mentioning (literally) 'the death' of Boomers, chasing A Fords b.i.t.d. , now estates are being wound up and they are (... and similar) being hauled out of barns/outbuildings.

It's always generational.... ;)

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13 minutes ago, Rusty_Rocket said:

It's a total mystery to me why MX5s are still down in the £1500 area.  Particularly when other early 90s stuff is racing away.

It's rwd and has pop-up head lamps for goodness sake!!

They were around for £200 only a few years back. My last one was £400 in 2015 with a full MoT, nice ones were only a few hundred more unless they were a limited edition.

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X1/9s were the same, I've owned 17 of them and the dearest was £750 even though midgets and mgbs  were 3k+.. now I see x1/9s advertised for fifteen grand.  No idea why they were so undervalued but great for me.. now I can't afford one 😕

I moved to MGFs , as near as possible and 500 quid can still get a usable one..

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The prices demanded of 1980's motorbikes is ridiculous, even for basket cases. I had many 80's bikes in the 80's and early 90's) but there are very few I would actually want to own again. I think that's because I mislaid my rose tinted spectacles.

 

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Like all these things, it comes down to pounds in your pocket and what someone is willing to pay. Sixties, Seventies and Eighties Fords (to pick a marque at random) are generally speaking absolute landfill but if someone wants to pay good money for them why wouldn't you take their money? Wish I'd bought a few when they were at their true value, which was its weight. 

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8 minutes ago, Jerzy Woking said:

The prices demanded of 1980's motorbikes is ridiculous, even for basket cases. I had many 80's bikes in the 80's and early 90's) but there are very few I would actually want to own again. I think that's because I mislaid my rose tinted spectacles.

 

I am a bit of an IMPnutter (... Hillman).

998cc IMP... Ohh, so learry :) & owned one!

NOW rattling around in a 993cc SuziQ

..... Frankly, more refined but Just As Loud ..... *can be  :)

 

 

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1 minute ago, Timewaster said:

One for you to ponder... 

 

ACA this afternoon,  1983 Escort Rs1600i sold for £29k!

 

For a bloody Mk3 Escort. 

Exactly and what can you do with it? Too expensive to rag about and use it in the manner intended, too easily stolen to take it about and go to the pub in it without standing sentry over it. Then to top it all you’ll take it to a classic car show and someone who sounds like his mouth is full of bread will tell you it’s wank and his A4 diesel would piss all over it. 

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1 minute ago, sierraman said:

Too expensive to rag about and use it in the manner intended

Is it? Similar price to most Porsche 911 997/Aston Martin Vantage/etc. 

Providing you have insurance on it with guarenteed value, its not as if you'll loose out if it gets nicked either.

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3 minutes ago, SiC said:

Is it? Similar price to most Porsche 911 997/Aston Martin Vantage/etc. 

Providing you have insurance on it with guarenteed value, its not as if you'll loose out if it gets nicked either.

Probably a good deal more fragile than a Porsche 911 though but yeah I guess so long as it’s going to pay out what you’ve paid then you can use it with gay abandon.

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It’s nostalgia/ what was commonplace years ago yes, but it’s also that fickle factor of what’s developed a movement. 


Does the hive mind think that the old ford halo will tarnish? It harks back to 33% market share and the shared experience, nowadays it’s less prominent and more diluted than it used to be in exposure; maybe the old fords of tomorrow will be less sought after?

edit- I should say I’ve wanted a mk2 escort since I was 10 (1990) when they were cheap bangers. I’d love one but I can’t justify the price and - the security risk.

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7 minutes ago, Timewaster said:

And he'd be right. 

Unfortunately yes he would be right but some people can’t help themselves but state the obvious like they’ve discovered the burning bush or whatever. 

It is true though, a mate had an XR3i we did some work of years ago, we went out in it, it looked the bomb, had that lovely petrolly oily smell that old cars had. But then it came to a hill and it couldn’t pull the skin off a pudding, it crashed over every bump or undulation. On the drive or outside the aforementioned pub it looked great but climbing in it and driving it the magic had gone over the years. It’d be like looking up an old girlfriend from 20 years ago that banged like a shithouse door in a gale all those years ago then finding that now all she wants to do is look round DIY stores at wallpaper. The moment had passed...

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25 minutes ago, Six-cylinder said:

The other question in my mind for the future is what impact is the vendetta against fossil fuelled engines going to have on modern classics?

Taking the very long view - none.

Any petrol engine can be readily converted to run on hydrogen. Which will be produced in quantity as a transport "fuel" using nuclear or solar energy to drive the neccessary chemical engineering.

But in the near future the (entirely appropriate) vendetta against fossil fuels is going to be the dominant force in car values. Only the truly significant cars are likely to survive the next hundred years as anything other than decaying ornaments. 

And good riddance. Most Automobiles are Shite. Which is where we came in...

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