Customisations and the such - not in the Autoshite spirit ??

[Bfg]

I had a quick search for this but couldn't find the topic. Perhaps someone might point me to it ?

or else I ask the question :  Are customisations and the such - not in the Autoshite spirit ?

The question is prompted because I whenever I have a car I tend to change things. Often it's little stuff like tidying up the routing of wiring over the engine bay.   On my old Jag I changed the air filter again to one which wasn't over the engine, and I also moved a few things around (such as moving the steering box reservoir away from the hot exhaust manifolds.   On the Citroen,  I smoothed out panel fit lines, which were pretty atrocious from new, and I also changed the rear wings to fibreglass ones so that I could preserve the originals and yet (on the new ones) cut away the wheel arch so that wheel changes were easier and safer.  On my Norton Commando Interstate I de-seamed the petrol tank and had a custom paint job. I enclosed the final drive chain so that lubricant wasn't grinding in road dust and gravel, and I made a couple of hundred other small-detail changes mechanically and cosmetically.   They were all done in the vain of my wanting to ' improve ' something that had been production built to a price.   Conversely on my old Sunbeam  motorcycle - which was a very authentic bike, I took great care in keeping things ' authentic'  ..that is aside from the front tyre which I changed to the nearest original size but of a new tread pattern.  

So what is acceptable ? and what is sacrilege ? 

If a car or motorcycle had been customised many years ago - Is it appropriate to revert it to original or best to keep it as it now is.?  

Again the question is prompted by my looking into buying another 1960's car.. whose exterior door handles have been shaved (removed for a very clean line).  The last two owners had it for 11 years, so the customisation was done sometime before then.  It looks pretty neat but might be a pita to live with. ..I don't know as I'd not even heard of doing such things until recently.  In looking on the web I found this ..to me,  very interesting report < here >  showing that the practice has been happening since the 1930 or 40's !   What a sheltered life I'd lived. The nearest I had experienced was the really neat door handles of the early MGB's and the hook handles of Ferrari.    I once used as my daily driver a TR3 and that had a pull cord as an inner door handle, which I always thought was very practical. 

The car I'm looking at buying has also no bumpers - which not only it a more masculine race-car look but also shaves a huge amount of weight from the extremities. And the car has been de-seamed of chrome beading along the top of its wings, and the split lines of the bolt-on wings, sills and valance panels have been smoothed over.  Those exterior panels are not longer removable and I guess have been welded together.  That at first seemed like a dumb thing to do.., but of course it is usual on most cars nowadays to have a welded together shell ..and repairs on those are certainly common enough.

So, again the question is what is good taste and what is heresy ?   

Over to you ..

Pete

Not the car I'm looking at buying but simply an example of an older car that has had its door handles shaved off.  - Is that now part of this car's history or should it be reverted to standard ?

 

Similarly a TR6 with a V8 under the bonnet,  which the owner described as a homage to the AC Cobra.  Again ignoring for a moment the bonnet bulge and seemingly huge wheels - it's also been shaved of door handles and bumpers and has been deseamed of its (formerly bolt-on) wings. 

 

[outlaw118]

Ultimately, it's your car, your choice, but with certain caveats, whose importance can only be decided by you.

How rare is it now? Will your modifications be reversable if a purist were to be the next owner? What about resale? Spraying a Horsey Horseless neon pink and adding PHATRIMZ may seem like a good idea, but if you're not planning on keeping it, it's not adding value, probably the opposite.

If, as above, an option will be to put it back to factory standard, you've got to look at how much this wil cost v the potential value. If money is no object, and you're planning on keeping it forever, then do whatever YOU want, don't listen to some fat prick off the internet

Sounds like you've done a mixture of practical improvements and custom jobs, so the technical side of things shouldn't be a problem, thus reducing expenditure somewhat.

My Capri started life as a 1600 Laser. It's now a 2.1 Bitsa.... I could have kept it standard,but I built the car I wanted. I did some of the work myself, and the welding and paint were paid for after I decided that my talent was miniscule compared to my ambition. It's probably worth a few quid, but more than an original? Probably not. Bothered? Nope.

TL:DR Do what YOU want

[bunglebus]

I've always been into customs and hot rods, and ultimately if it's your car you can do what you like. Plenty of people will have an opinion about it, but you know what they say about those!

I'd say every single car I've owned has been modified in some way, wheel swaps, lowering, shaved badges etc. It makes them mine and different to every other one out there, which pleases me.

I appreciate a completely stock survivor or restored classic, but park a tastefully modified example of the same car next to it and that's the one I'll be drawn to.

[tooSavvy]

I was looking for a 'factory fit/option' bootlid spoiler for all the three years I have owned ToMM©....

It comes with Chinlip but (I suppose) balancing/matched otion bootlip was "extra cost" option = Dunno ?

I have lashed my Primera GT spoiler on.... finally gives the car a proportioned side elevation/tip of balance.

My car..My cash, I think it has been said.

[sierraman]

Depends what car it is, ultimately it’s up to you though. I’d be inclined not to if it’s got any resale value, modified cars are an acquired taste, lurid bodykits and half arsed mods will put 90% of people off so you could find it practically unsaleable. I personally would avoid something on the second hand circuit that’s been modified as it would suggest (rightly or wrongly) that it’s been thrashed to fuck. A classic is usually done properly by people with actual money and skills but a lot of used cars that have been modified have been done badly by people that really should keep away from the tools. 

[Six-cylinder]

That is the pleasure of Autoshite, a broad church. If you like it that is good enough, inevitably some will like some things and some others.

Me I quite like restromods that are subtle.

I own a 1968 Spitfire that has been 70/80s period modified with steel arches and Wolfrace wheels. I now feel that is part of the history of the car and is how it should stay. 

[sierraman]

There’s a world of difference between a 10 year old Insignia with a ‘Because Vauxhall...’ sunscreen and someone fitting a Zetec in a Mk1 Escort. Can completely get that, it just makes the car more useable on a frequent basis. But then flip side of same coin last year at a car show there was a Triumph Stag, the guy had fitted a 1.8 Ford TD and a P100 axle, then painted it in what looked like ALDI metal paint. Badly. I just thought... why???? But then again it’s his car to with as he wishes. All that said though I thought it would be piss funny to turn up to the Triumph Owners Club concours in it to put their stuffy fucking noses out of joint. 

[big_al_granvia]

period mods, evolution on a design o sod it, my car my rules... all are acceptable in my eyes, if it looks right then it is right... with fords having seen modern engines in classic 60's and 70's cars i would call it evolution, there is nothing wrong with fitting a duratech on throttle bodies in a mark 1 escort, fitting a vauxhall redtop does annoy me but its up to the owner.. if a car is to be used then it ideally has to be practical and reliable. do what you like and like what you do

[Rod/b]

Your car, do what you want with it. Doesn’t mean other people won’t have an opinion / take the piss / point and laugh if they think it looks gash, but how you deal with the reaction is up to you too. 
 

I like the sound of some of the mods you’ve done - got any pics? 

 

 

[New POD]

My car interest started with custom car magazine as a teenager. 

I never once questioned the reasoning behind anything, some of which was quite dubious. 

These days I like to think that sometimes subtle is more cool.  

My "successful" mods previously were fitting mk3 cavalier gsi front brakes to mk2 cavaliers, and mk3 Astra gsi brakes and suspension to a 1.4 mk3 Astra, and removing the side trim. 

If it makes a car faster, more comfortable, safer, cleaner looking, then why not? 

If it makes the car less comfy, more noisy, and aesthetically spoils the original lines.

There was a red 5.7 v8 Monaro parked outside next door at the weekend. 

There was some mods that made me think the owner was a dick. 

Black windows, None standard alloys in black with a red rim, and red lettering on the tyres. 

And a non standard plastic sill (bodykit), which I reckon was quite rare and expensive, but spoiled the lines because it had too many sharp edges and the Monaro has no sharp edges really. 

And it looked lowered, but not in a useable way. 

And tacky chrome v8 badges from halfords, although they might be standard. 

It looked like the worst attempts done to Calibras in the 90s. 

 

[Split_Pin]

No issues with improvements or customisation in my opinion. It's only a car and you're a long time dead, whatever makes you happy.

[mercedade]

I've put a touchscreen double DIN Android stereo in my 820, lowered front springs, and mostly just made it a better place to spend time.

It'd be a pain for a future user to revert the stereo (mostly because I had to butcher the centre console).

 I don't think I'd have any qualms about doing more significant alterations, but they'd probably be focused on improving it as my daily driver, rather than going for a specific look. It probably helps that I think of myself as this car's last owner.

[Timewaster]

I think there are several different Autoshite factions. 

For example Trigger drives interesting old stuff,  keeps them tip top and looking original and shows them off. 

Others drive the lowest cost shite possible regardless where some are more dedicated to one make. 

Others drive the most interesting stuff they can find but don't do polish. (buffing, not FSOs). 

 

Almost anything that has dropped off most people's radar can be autoshite however it is presented. 

 

[Mally]

You can do anything you like, and you will enjoy it. Most of us feel  that's how it should be.

When you come to sell however, instead of a few interested people, you will be lucky to get more than one.

Because it's your car, as you wanted.

[Jikovron]

1 hour ago, sierraman said:

'But then flip side of same coin last year at a car show there was a Triumph Stag, the guy had fitted a 1.8 Ford TD and a P100 axle, then painted it in what looked like ALDI metal paint. Badly. I just thought... why????'

I used to rent a garage of that guy, he mentioned something about wanting the economy and reliability of a ford td of which fair play it serves his purpose although presumably it's going around on a questionable mot exemption now lol

Imo anything goes regarding cars, they're just machinery that is an enjoyable hobby to the owner via added arbitrary layers of psychological dimensions, the only time it could be a community lead ethos is if they all have a stake in it via active efforts to assist in its factory like preservation otherwise progress is progress agreeable or otherwise for me.

 

[eddyramrod]

I haven't got room to talk.  I spent my teens immersed in Custom Car and Hot Car, and developing ideas on my model cars.  I never had enough money to make any significant mods to a real car, and anyway most of them weren't worth doing stuff to.  As I get older I find myself more and more leaning towards classics but I can still admire a  nice hot rod.  I know there is way more work in them than I could ever consider, so to the chap who builds one, I say Good Luck.

[St.Jude]

3 hours ago, tooSavvy said:

I was looking for a 'factory fit/option' bootlid spoiler for all the three years I have owned ToMM©....

It comes with Chinlip but (I suppose) balancing/matched otion bootlip was "extra cost" option = Dunno ?

I have lashed my Primera GT spoiler on.... finally gives the car a proportioned side elevation/tip of balance.

My car..My cash, I think it has been said.

That's how customisations should be, understated. 

[tooSavvy]

8 minutes ago, sgtberbatov said:

That's how customisations should be, understated. 

...... yeah & £30!

ffs... Check out fleebay for JDM tail-spoilers £650 (needs paint!! ? )

 

[DoctorRetro]

Oh no, I don't approve on any modifications /customisation of cars, it's just not the done thing! What do you think this is, Retro Rides or something? ????

In all seriousness though, everyone is different, and although Autoshite is not as tolerant as some to modified cars, it's still a car forum for car enthusiasts. And as long as you're not a ****, you can be sure you'll always be welcome here. 

Ps. Just don't paint a lacquer peeled bonnet matt black, you'll never hear the end of it! ?

[big_al_granvia]

Plus the old question, what defines a classic?? To me anything can be a classic once over 20 years old. It doesnt have to be high spec, that purple poverty spec escort that dodgy bastard has atm is as much of a classic as a escort cosworth.. As cars get rare they do fall into classic territory, anything can be preserved as long as it looks alright. Doesn't have to be original or have period mods as long as it looks okay

[bunglebus]

19 minutes ago, TheDoctor said:

ps. Just don't paint a lacquer peeled bonnet matt black, you'll never hear the end of it!

No, add some colour too!

20190422_072726 by RS, on Flickr

 

[St.Jude]

34 minutes ago, TheDoctor said:

Ps. Just don't paint a lacquer peeled bonnet matt black, you'll never hear the end of it! ?

Rally spec yo.

[bunglebus]

I tend to follow the ethos of "less is more", so I think this is the only time I've fitted anything like a body kit - eyebrow on the ex's E30 tourer. It was already a great colour with lovely wheels, so a drop of lowering and it was good to go

 

008-1 by RS, on Flickr

 

Escort estate never got finished but had the tailgate smoothed out and the ends of the gutters removed

 

Escort016 by RS, on Flickr

 

Sierra got lowered, 14" rather than 13" steels (ultimate plan was 24v V6 and 15" steels with trims), 90 spec lights a bit of debadging and covering the chrome inserts with black tape

 

Sierra018 by RS, on Flickr

 

Bought the Beetle like this as it was so close to how I would have chosen to do it myself

 

Bug56 by RS, on Flickr

 

Even my first car gained Supersport wheels, lowering, shaved tailgate and eventually a 1300 to replace the 950. And black door handles after this pic was taken

 

Fiesta3 by RS, on Flickr

 

5 got lowered, R19 16V wheels, clear indicators, trim removal and a side exit exhaust that was a pain in the arse. Rear wiper went in the bin at some point and I was making a debadged grille for it. Loved this car

 

Renlow007 by RS, on Flickr

Sonypics012-1 by RS, on Flickr

[dollywobbler]

I painted this with household emulsion.

I had explored fitting a Fiat engine, or even making it electric. I don't think any of those ideas would have ruined it, but I'm glad I've stuck with the little 850 engine. Am considering some suspension mods, an even contemplating a front disc conversion. My 2CV is also far from standard, not that most folk would know looking at it. 

But I'm more protective of the Invacar (bar fitting clear indicator lenses). Even restoring that is problematic as I don't want to lose any of its history. It looks like it sat in a field for 14 years because it did.

[paulplom]

I reckon do what makes you happy.  Your car, your money, go for it.

They are just material things at the end of the day and in the grand scheme of things, they aren't important in the slightest.

[eddyramrod]

I had many plans and (what I thought were) good ideas for my Cyprus A40.

Escort Ghia seats, for example.  Didn't matter that they came from a five-door, I planned to mount the runners on the tilt-frames from the A40.  Like the rest of my plans for that car, it all got overtaken by events.  The car is in Cyprus and we aren't.  I wonder if I ever would have finished it?

[Rocket88]

I got a right slating on here when I rodded my Peugeot wagon...........and in some respects, probably rightly so..........but some old stuff in standard form is so horrible to drive that any mods to make it more usable are surely a good idea.......

[bunglebus]

Quite like that, I'd lose the wood but the stance etc works for me, nicely shaped car to start with

[eddyramrod]

Col, the stumbling block for me was only the choice of running gear.  If it was all you had lying around you, then fine, I believe in using what you have; but if I had been going out to buy something for it I can't help thinking I would have stripped a mk3 Granada of its Cologne/auto combination, thus retaining RWD.  You kept an old car on the road, so ultimately, Well Done.

Same with that Rover P4 you had recently.  Had it received a petrol engine it could have been a very attractive proposition, but no, someone had gone all Devil's Fuel on its ass.  There's a Minor van here in Barrow that looks like they did in about 1979, but is all Pug 106 underneath.

[dozeydustman]

It depends on what you deem is tasteful. Slammed negative camber yo! Isn’t my thing, nor are huge rims with stretched tyres. Or headlamp peaks.

I quite like a stock looking wolf in sheep’s clothing - base looking but a tuned engine and slightly bigger rubber, or well thought through and sympathetic modernising methods that would improve an older car for daily use - uprated lighting, dynamo to alternator conversions, adding an extra cog in the gearbox, drum to disc conversion etc. (A bit like Dollywobbler’s neighbour and his Viva) so you get the usefulness of a modern(ish) car but with the charms of something a bit older.

Period giffer mods I find quite charming (aside from headlamp peaks) particularly if a rarer model is in the spotlight.

This said an unmolested car will grab my attention more than heavily modified.