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The future of the roads?


Wilko220

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I think the point is that this isn't a consultation about whether the technology should exist, but how you legislate for it. Audi were planning to have it on the new A8, but scrapped it because they were worried that if there was an accident they would be liable rather than the driver. 

https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/audi-a8-level-3-automation-traffic-jam-pilot-system/

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Ultimately if you can’t control a car you shouldn’t be on the roads full stop. I’ve known people that avoid dual carriageways simply because they’re not confident - again shouldn’t be near the roads. Driving should be an earned skill not something that’s an entitlement.

I’ve yet to find anyone (apart from the usual tragic IT types) that actually wants automation apart from the people who will directly benefit from it such as Amazon or the Government. 

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16 minutes ago, leanycan said:

I don't want to sound old and archaic but is automation really the way to go. I certainly don't want technology being installed in my old banger so Boris and his chums can decide to slow down my car or look at where I've been. 

 

12 minutes ago, sierraman said:

Ultimately if you can’t control a car you shouldn’t be on the roads full stop. I’ve known people that avoid dual carriageways simply because they’re not confident - again shouldn’t be near the roads. Driving should be an earned skill not something that’s an entitlement.

I’ve yet to find anyone (apart from the usual tragic IT types) that actually wants automation apart from the people who will directly benefit from it such as Amazon or the Government. 

Its already here, and people want it / don't care about the privacy implications. Let's face it, the technology is being driven by manufacturers, and if they didn't think they could sell it they wouldn't bother. After all, didn't that guy in Wales recently get done for murder because police could retrospectively track his Land Rover?

There's five levels of automation - Level 1 is 'feet off', which is basically radar cruise and stuff - the car speeds up and slows down to respond to traffic, but you still do the steering. Seems popular, I've even seen people on here saying they'd want it in a daily. Level 2 is 'hands off' - basically Tesla autopilot in that the car can do some basic steering to keep you in a lane, but you still need to do anything beyond that. Level 3 is where Audi were saying they would get to - 'eyes off'. The idea is that the car can drive itself under certain conditions (say on a dual carriageway at up to 30mph) and sounds an alarm when it needs you to take back control. That's where things start to get legally interesting - if your Audi ploughs into a bus full of nuns while you had autopilot on and were playing Pokemon, who's responsible? You as the driver, or Audi as the people who wrote the software controlling the car?

I don't think we'll ever be in a place where cars are retrospectively automated. You might find in future that there are places you can't drive unless you're in an automated car, like you get with Clean Air Zones or whatever now. Worth saying though that I work in transport for [large engineering consultancy] and everyone we have who works in this sort of stuff doesn't think we'll ever get to full automation everywhere, at least not within our lifetimes. 

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21 minutes ago, sierraman said:

Ultimately if you can’t control a car you shouldn’t be on the roads full stop. I’ve known people that avoid dual carriageways simply because they’re not confident - again shouldn’t be near the roads. Driving should be an earned skill not something that’s an entitlement.

I’ve yet to find anyone (apart from the usual tragic IT types) that actually wants automation apart from the people who will directly benefit from it such as Amazon or the Government. 

I think it very much depends on who you talk to. I know a lot of people who take no pleasure from driving and would love to be able to go out on the lash and be driven home, or be able to go holiday and be ‘chauffeured’ there. What puts people off is a lack of confidence in the tech. I think us car types are a smaller minority than we realise.

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I'd quite like an auto park function.  Find a space, let the car reverse in. 

I'd quite like automatic cruise control. Car speeds up and slows down with traffic.

I'd quite like automatic, emergency braking (and collision avoidance).  Car decides I've fucked up and takes over.

I currently have crude traction control. crude cruise control and an old fashioned auto box, and ABS. 

 

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Does it not (in part) have to do with carmakers desperately trying to find new things to set their offerings apart from their competitors? As a concept, the ICE car was pretty much perfected by the early 1990s, petrol cars did a reliable 40 to the gallon, engines were robust in the main, everything worked and you could be reasonably sure that mechanically with some care an engine should see 150k miles. I'm thinking Nissan GA series engines here as a good example.

Since the early 00s what 'innovations' have we had that have genuinely been gamechangers? electronic handbrakes? uh-huh. what else that is genuinely a gamechanger? Hybrids and full electronic drivetrain - yes, absolutely. But what else? Why would I buy a brand new Ford Mondeo over a Mazda 6 or VW Passat? What do each of them do that the others don't? What sets them apart? Very little I suspect, its down to perceived 'quality' and 'prestige' and price.

So Manufacturers are looking to do something to set themselves apart. Be the first ones to reliably make a self-driving car that'll pilot you home from the Teaspoon and Racist at 11.45 on a wednesday night after you've drunk 18 pints of Carling, and possibly get you to the office the following day while you're still over the limit. Great, where do I sign?

I keep going back to the advert some significant while ago for a toothbrush which had little rubber things on the not-bristles side which they genuinely advertised as being 'revolutionary' as it meant you could clean your teeth and YOUR TONGUE ffs. They are all shitehawks desperate to make something that sets them apart from their competition and allows them to charge more for the same thing.

Also, WTF is wrong with getting a taxi or a bus?

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17 minutes ago, angle said:

....didn't that guy in Wales recently get done for murder because police could retrospectively track his Land Rover?....

The Anglesey Crossbow Murder. He thought setting fire to the car was enough to cover his tracks, but he couldn't burn the remote server for the car's telemmetry.....

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48 minutes ago, leanycan said:

I don't want to sound old and archaic but is automation really the way to go. I certainly don't want technology being installed in my old banger so Boris and his chums can decide to slow down my car or look at where I've been. 

They are already doing this by stealth -

Ford Focus: New tech save drivers hundreds in pothole damage ...

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58 minutes ago, angle said:

 

Its already here, and people want it / don't care about the privacy implications. Let's face it, the technology is being driven by manufacturers, and if they didn't think they could sell it they wouldn't bother. After all, didn't that guy in Wales recently get done for murder because police could retrospectively track his Land Rover?

There's five levels of automation - Level 1 is 'feet off', which is basically radar cruise and stuff - the car speeds up and slows down to respond to traffic, but you still do the steering. Seems popular, I've even seen people on here saying they'd want it in a daily. Level 2 is 'hands off' - basically Tesla autopilot in that the car can do some basic steering to keep you in a lane, but you still need to do anything beyond that. Level 3 is where Audi were saying they would get to - 'eyes off'. The idea is that the car can drive itself under certain conditions (say on a dual carriageway at up to 30mph) and sounds an alarm when it needs you to take back control. That's where things start to get legally interesting - if your Audi ploughs into a bus full of nuns while you had autopilot on and were playing Pokemon, who's responsible? You as the driver, or Audi as the people who wrote the software controlling the car?

I don't think we'll ever be in a place where cars are retrospectively automated. You might find in future that there are places you can't drive unless you're in an automated car, like you get with Clean Air Zones or whatever now. Worth saying though that I work in transport for [large engineering consultancy] and everyone we have who works in this sort of stuff doesn't think we'll ever get to full automation everywhere, at least not within our lifetimes. 

Ffs you can’t even murder someone these days without Big Brother watching you! 

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